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Question for non fetish producers

Soles_Scream

Verified
Joined
Oct 27, 2019
Messages
525
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16
These questions are geared toward non tickle fetish producers to see how they’d handle a very real situation.

You start your tickle clip business and you book your first model. You book her at her two hour minimum at $100/hr. You go to tickle her and 30 minutes into it she doesn’t react no matter how many different techniques you’ve tried.

What do you do?

Second question is the same as the first except you know that the model is genuinely ticklish person?
 
The solution that most producers have to your first question is that they book the model conditionally. They will pay for 1 hour regardless, but any more will be based in the results of a hands on screen test to see if their ticklishness is up to par with what they want to produce for customers. This is negotiated with the model before she comes to your shoot location, and she has full knowledge that if she is not ticklish enough she won't get more then one hour comp.

The second question is probably an issue with the model feeling uncomfortable or not fully well (which both will tamp down ticklishness) in this case a conversation as to what is up is why, and it will be caught out in the screen test in any case, so no harm no foul of the model is not up to it, she just gets her first hour. It's not unlike showing up to work after being ill and not being able to give more than 50% as you recover. Not good enough for a shoot.

Myriads
 
The solution that most producers have to your first question is that they book the model conditionally. They will pay for 1 hour regardless, but any more will be based in the results of a hands on screen test to see if their ticklishness is up to par with what they want to produce for customers. This is negotiated with the model before she comes to your shoot location, and she has full knowledge that if she is not ticklish enough she won't get more then one hour comp.

The second question is probably an issue with the model feeling uncomfortable or not fully well (which both will tamp down ticklishness) in this case a conversation as to what is up is why, and it will be caught out in the screen test in any case, so no harm no foul of the model is not up to it, she just gets her first hour. It's not unlike showing up to work after being ill and not being able to give more than 50% as you recover. Not good enough for a shoot.

Myriads

Sounds like that could be a recipe for getting models to fake ticklish reactions. That would be the last thing I would ever want as a content creator.

To answer the OP's question, I would suggest taking a break, offering her a snack, and trying again after a little pause. You might just have to cut your loss on that one and probably not work with that model again.
 
Sounds like that could be a recipe for getting models to fake ticklish reactions. That would be the last thing I would ever want as a content creator.

It might, but the producer, during the test can easily note that their responses are inconstant, and not what they are looking for, thus filtering fakers out. Or if the girl is good enough to fool said producer with her responses, then the product will probably be more than adequate for its audience, and thus salable.

But from talks I've had with many producers over the years, the fact is that many many models believe they are more ticklish than they are, and turn out to be basically average in responses. Many may not know that for every model that you see in a video from a top end producer, there are several that were just rejected as not being ticklish enough to satisfy the marketplace. So producers are faced with sifting through many models to find the few that produce the product that actually will sell.

If you spool back through the years here you'll find that there are hoards of videos made by producers that get lukewarm reviews as being "Ok, but she doesn't seem to be that ticklish" when in fact the girl is simple of average ticklishness. And this is the very thing that has moved the market to producers only choosing to release those models that are in the upper percentiles of response. Which in turn further biases the audience as to what average really is.

Vicious circle.

Myriads
 
It might, but the producer, during the test can easily note that their responses are inconstant, and not what they are looking for, thus filtering fakers out. Or if the girl is good enough to fool said producer with her responses, then the product will probably be more than adequate for its audience, and thus salable.

But from talks I've had with many producers over the years, the fact is that many many models believe they are more ticklish than they are, and turn out to be basically average in responses. Many may not know that for every model that you see in a video from a top end producer, there are several that were just rejected as not being ticklish enough to satisfy the marketplace. So producers are faced with sifting through many models to find the few that produce the product that actually will sell.

If you spool back through the years here you'll find that there are hoards of videos made by producers that get lukewarm reviews as being "Ok, but she doesn't seem to be that ticklish" when in fact the girl is simple of average ticklishness. And this is the very thing that has moved the market to producers only choosing to release those models that are in the upper percentiles of response. Which in turn further biases the audience as to what average really is.

Vicious circle.

Myriads

Amazing response and analytical to a high accuracy.

I totally agree and have some insight as well but, as a producer I guess I’m disqualified from responding. Very curious to see others responses though. Great topic soles_scream. Love your work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
That happened to me once. I cut her loose after about 15 minutes. I gave her a 20 for coming out to my place.
 
Last edited:
Amazing response and analytical to a high accuracy.

I totally agree and have some insight as well but, as a producer I guess I’m disqualified from responding. Very curious to see others responses though. Great topic soles_scream. Love your work

I'd like to hear your thoughts. I listen to all that passes by and file it away for later use, as I did above. So feel free to share. Threads here evolve, and your words will certainly be partially on mark.

Myriads
 
But from talks I've had with many producers over the years, the fact is that many many models believe they are more ticklish than they are, and turn out to be basically average in responses. Many may not know that for every model that you see in a video from a top end producer, there are several that were just rejected as not being ticklish enough to satisfy the marketplace.

Far be it from me to consider myself a "top-end" producer, but I will be celebrating my tenth year in March. I've tickled a model or two in my day. What surprises me is how often the rest of y'all seem to have models say "yes, I'm ticklish" and then come in and be like, "meh". I've never had to reject a model for being "not ticklish enough". Some were more squirmers than shriekers but even those have their audience, and nine times out of ten I find a spot even they didn't know they had (...and mercilessly exploit it, but I digress). I just don't get it.

Also, why is this thread directed at "non-fetish" producers? Who else but fetish producers makes tickle fetish videos?
 
Far be it from me to consider myself a "top-end" producer, but I will be celebrating my tenth year in March. I've tickled a model or two in my day. What surprises me is how often the rest of y'all seem to have models say "yes, I'm ticklish" and then come in and be like, "meh". I've never had to reject a model for being "not ticklish enough". Some were more squirmers than shriekers but even those have their audience, and nine times out of ten I find a spot even they didn't know they had (...and mercilessly exploit it, but I digress). I just don't get it.

Also, why is this thread directed at "non-fetish" producers? Who else but fetish producers makes tickle fetish videos?

I wanted see what those who don’t produce content think should happen in those scenarios. Producers already seem to have their respective philosophies on the matter.

Mine is just take the L on the tickle portion and double down on foot worship, trampling, or whatever else they may be comfortable doing.

Take the L meaning, give it a try, revisit later, but otherwise give up on tickling.
 
Amazing response and analytical to a high accuracy.

I totally agree and have some insight as well but, as a producer I guess I’m disqualified from responding. Very curious to see others responses though. Great topic soles_scream. Love your work


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I appreciate you! Anyone can and hopefully will respond, but I especially want those who don't produce to weigh in as it's one of the many aspects fans don't consider. In some cases they just don't care, but in others it's because they arean't aware.
 
Far be it from me to consider myself a "top-end" producer, but I will be celebrating my tenth year in March. I've tickled a model or two in my day. What surprises me is how often the rest of y'all seem to have models say "yes, I'm ticklish" and then come in and be like, "meh". I've never had to reject a model for being "not ticklish enough". Some were more squirmers than shriekers but even those have their audience, and nine times out of ten I find a spot even they didn't know they had (...and mercilessly exploit it, but I digress). I just don't get it.

Also, why is this thread directed at "non-fetish" producers? Who else but fetish producers makes tickle fetish videos?

I haven't shot with nearly as many models as you have, but I also have been pleasantly suprised that all but one of them have been "ticklish enough" to make content. The majority were pretty damn ticklish.

PS I am still using the language from the model release you kindly shared on here when I asked about it.
:yourock:
 
I wanted see what those who don’t produce content think should happen in those scenarios. Producers already seem to have their respective philosophies on the matter.

Mine is just take the L on the tickle portion and double down on foot worship, trampling, or whatever else they may be comfortable doing.

Take the L meaning, give it a try, revisit later, but otherwise give up on tickling.

I agree and respect the taking the "L" in the rare instance that something like that happens. The models I've worked with (you and I have some overlap) are hardworking professionals trying to make a living. Most of them would not even consider agreeing to a "conditional booking", unless the producer was a big deal, and they thought the exposure from working with that producer would be worth the potential lost income. Most producers do not have that kind of clout. Most models are not going to potentially miss out on booking time, so some mid level producer can decide if she's "good enough." They want to maximize their "billable hours" and expect half of the modeling fee to be paid in advance as a deposit, so they don't have their time wasted.

I always have healthy snacks available for the talent. One thing I've realized is that these women are highly driven entrepreneurs, and they often neglect things like taking meal breaks when on tour. A hangry model is not going to be as ticklish. It also helps to build a rapport with the model, which I think a lot of people who've never made a clip greatly underestimate the importance of. If she's not comfortable with or worse, creeped out by the tickler, she ain't gonna be very ticklish. If you make her feel safe, comfortable, and respected, it will show in the content. There are some consumers who really don't understand the human interaction aspect of making content. Sorry for the mini rant lol. :ranty:
 
it's one of the many aspects fans don't consider. In some cases they just don't care, but in others it's because they arean't aware.

In my experience, they don't care - and those who are unaware, still don't care. Myself and other producers, like Turtleboy and others, have explained every "unknown" facet of this industry, endlessly, since day one - and no matter how many times we repeat ourselves, the same questions keep getting "asked" - if you can consider rude, sarcastically veiled accusations of incompetence asking, but I digress. Especially since a non-fetish producer is never going to be in the situation where they'll actually need to formulate a useful answer to this question. It'd be like asking me what I'd do if I got propositioned by Emma Stone. I mean, it's fun to think about, but ultimately who cares what my answer would be? (...and if I'm wrong, Emma? Call me.)

PS I am still using the language from the model release you kindly shared on here when I asked about it.

Appreciate it! I wish I could take credit for the drafted verbiage on the forms I use, but I got them from professional photography/modeling websites. So far they've stood up when I've had them requested by third parties, though, so feel free to rest easy that they're fairly solid regardless.

They want to maximize their "billable hours" and expect half of the modeling fee to be paid in advance as a deposit, so they don't have their time wasted.

As usual, your mileage may vary! I think I've only ever had two, maybe three models ever request deposits up front. If I had to guess, I'd say that's more a thing strictly in the fetish space, given how many tire-kickers and time-wasters there are in these communities. I've never had a girl-next-door or, say, fashion/print model expect to be paid up-front, and if they did, I wouldn't agree to it. Many a photographer outside of the fetish space has a story of models ghosting them as well - it happened to me recently, as well - so it cuts both ways, honestly.

they often neglect things like taking meal breaks when on tour. A hangry model is not going to be as ticklish.

Yes! When I shot with Giantess Autumn, while I was breaking down my gear she admitted to me that she hadn't had time to eat yet that day... and it was well after lunchtime! I immediately took her out to eat to rectify the situation. 'course, I later found out that "grumpy" is Autumn's default state hungry or not, but that's just part of her charm. hehe

It also helps to build a rapport with the model, which I think a lot of people who've never made a clip greatly underestimate the importance of. If she's not comfortable with or worse, creeped out by the tickler, she ain't gonna be very ticklish.

Also yes! I've seen way too much content of awkwardly-grimacing models and heard way too many horror stories from the talent to ever write this one off. As a community, we really need to go back to school and re-learn how to treat people, and remember that while there's such a thing as letting yourself get taken advantage of, the fact is that - business or not - these women are doing us a favor and need to be treated with respect and have a positive atmosphere foistered on set. My models almost always want to come back for another go, and my customers often comment about how I excel at creating that kind of rapport. It honestly doesn't take much effort, but it's amazing how often producers simply don't care.

Speaking of which, 'member when we had that thread not too long ago where a few of our more notable members swore up and down that re-negotiating a model's boundaries while she was tied up wasn't a threat? I took a straw poll on my Instagram page. I would have to check the exact numbers, but I do remember a lot of people voting, including a number of models... both ones I've worked with and ones who just follow me for whatever reason. Anyway, out of all of those people, only two voted "no, it's not a threat", and of those two... neither were models. Make of that what you will.

Anyway, don't take my questions as criticism OP, it's a good topic! I do occasionally wonder how I'd handle the situation myself if it ever occurred. Fingers crossed I never have to.
 
Everyone has some great points in this thread. Pretty much in agreement with everything said.

Personally I have worked with very few professional models. All of my recruitment came off just talking to people and friends, friends of friends, word of mouth style. Always meet them in person for coffee ( my fave) and just be personable and break down everything up front.

Atmosphere is a big deal o feel and sensualswitch hit it right on the head. “Models” come in and see a nice, warm inviting environment and everyone having fun. Is more or less going to make or break the shoot most times.

Soles_scream that’s smart on doubling down on other content that could be shot and used. I never did that yet.

I have only sent one person home and thanked them for their time. Paid them for the time they were there and went on our separate ways. I think that’s fair. But I’ve never paid upfront before they come in unless I’ve worked with them before.

SoleMates is absolutely correct and I love just how honest you are with the scene. I feel all producers should be like that. Im very open about all the details and I also shoot photography and videography in a mainstream professional capacity. There is a lot of overlap and taking things from that over to this does work well.

Trying to drop the 12 plus years of professional work experience and think of this as someone who is doing it personally. In all honesty, unless I get to meet the person beforehand and speak with them before the session, break the ice and just warm up to each other even if it’s right before the session. Im not going to do it. But in reality, sometimes you have to charge it to the game and move on.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
In my experience, they don't care - and those who are unaware, still don't care. Myself and other producers, like Turtleboy and others, have explained every "unknown" facet of this industry, endlessly, since day one - and no matter how many times we repeat ourselves, the same questions keep getting "asked" - if you can consider rude, sarcastically veiled accusations of incompetence asking, but I digress. Especially since a non-fetish producer is never going to be in the situation where they'll actually need to formulate a useful answer to this question. It'd be like asking me what I'd do if I got propositioned by Emma Stone. I mean, it's fun to think about, but ultimately who cares what my answer would be? (...and if I'm wrong, Emma? Call me.)

I appreciate you and I will take the torch on this one. I know you feel like a broken record, but I'm convinced folks out there do hear what you're saying. For 4 years or so I've been preaching a similar massage on my social media accounts before I even knew what a follower was. Many more than we realize do hear it. Those who disregard model safety/boundaries or whatever are not our customers and probably not anyone else's customers for that matter - at least that's what believe.

Also yes! I've seen way too much content of awkwardly-grimacing models and heard way too many horror stories from the talent to ever write this one off. As a community, we really need to go back to school and re-learn how to treat people, and remember that while there's such a thing as letting yourself get taken advantage of, the fact is that - business or not - these women are doing us a favor and need to be treated with respect and have a positive atmosphere foistered on set. My models almost always want to come back for another go, and my customers often comment about how I excel at creating that kind of rapport. It honestly doesn't take much effort, but it's amazing how often producers simply don't care.

Speaking of which, 'member when we had that thread not too long ago where a few of our more notable members swore up and down that re-negotiating a model's boundaries while she was tied up wasn't a threat? I took a straw poll on my Instagram page. I would have to check the exact numbers, but I do remember a lot of people voting, including a number of models... both ones I've worked with and ones who just follow me for whatever reason. Anyway, out of all of those people, only two voted "no, it's not a threat", and of those two... neither were models. Make of that what you will.

Anyway, don't take my questions as criticism OP, it's a good topic! I do occasionally wonder how I'd handle the situation myself if it ever occurred. Fingers crossed I never have to.

I hope beyond hope that folks who voted that re-negotiating a model's boundaries on site or worse while tied up, never pick up a camera or book a model or play session with anyone for that matter. Thank you for your kind words as well.

SoleMates, once again thanks for your feedback and perspective. It's no accident that you've been in this space at a high level for as long as you have. It means a lot too that you're willing to share your knowledge as with the community as well.
 
I agree and respect the taking the "L" in the rare instance that something like that happens. The models I've worked with (you and I have some overlap) are hardworking professionals trying to make a living. Most of them would not even consider agreeing to a "conditional booking", unless the producer was a big deal, and they thought the exposure from working with that producer would be worth the potential lost income. Most producers do not have that kind of clout. Most models are not going to potentially miss out on booking time, so some mid level producer can decide if she's "good enough." They want to maximize their "billable hours" and expect half of the modeling fee to be paid in advance as a deposit, so they don't have their time wasted.

I always have healthy snacks available for the talent. One thing I've realized is that these women are highly driven entrepreneurs, and they often neglect things like taking meal breaks when on tour. A hangry model is not going to be as ticklish. It also helps to build a rapport with the model, which I think a lot of people who've never made a clip greatly underestimate the importance of. If she's not comfortable with or worse, creeped out by the tickler, she ain't gonna be very ticklish. If you make her feel safe, comfortable, and respected, it will show in the content. There are some consumers who really don't understand the human interaction aspect of making content. Sorry for the mini rant lol. :ranty:

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