A member's perspective...

[TummyDragon]

This message is from an average forum member. This is not a post to initiate a discussion or a debate. I am simply a member of this community who sees something I perceive to be just “not quite right” so I’m speaking up. I've been coming here since the forum's inception on EZboard, but I have no affiliation with the TMF, receive no compensation from the TMF, nor do I have any relationship or affiliation with Jeff or MTP aside from being “friends” in the community.

This place is huge. It’s enormous. It has almost 8,000 registered members with a ratio of approximately 5 guests to each 1 member online at a given time. The bandwidth cost is also enormous. Hundreds of dollars each and every month and sometimes over a thousand. Jeff foots the overwhelming majority of this bill himself. Granted, he advertises here, but so can everyone else. While there are detractors of the TMF, some of whom raise some very valid points and I sometimes agree with those points, the TMF is undisputedly and indisputably the sole impetus for the absolute explosion in numbers of participants in the tickling community we have seen in the last couple of years. Any search on "tickling" leads another "I'm all by myself, no one else could possibly be into this" lady or gentleman right to thousands of others who share this love of laughter-- right here. There are many great sites and contributors in and to the online tickling world, but the TMF is truly something special.

I would like to try to dispel a couple of misconceptions that I have seen. First of all, “having a membership to Tickling.WS takes care of the cost of running the TMF”. This simply is not true. The proceeds from Tickling.WS go directly into creating new material, paying the models, production costs, and hosting THAT site, etc. It’s a seperate entity with huge production and bandwidth costs of its own. The financing that keeps the TMF in existence is still coming directly out of Jeff’s pocket. He pays for everything.

The second misconception is that “well, I post thousands of messages here so I support it that way”. Okay, granted, the TMF would go under as a forum if no one posted. All the stories, vid links, pic links, ideas and thoughts posted make the TMF what it is. However, each one of those many “supporting” posts ads just a fraction more to the bandwidth cost of the forum. Try to look at it this way, Jeff pays the penny for each post we make. So while the forum couldn’t exist without the posts, the posts couldn’t exist without Jeff’s paying for them.

Jeff has never once complained about this, and has never suggested that the TMF become a subscription service (although I think it should-- we pay 15-20 bucks a month for subscription sites, would it kill us to pay maybe a buck a month for the TMF?)

Anyway the reason I post this is that I feel as though we are [edit]receiving a benevolence for free and ought to chip in something so that one person won't bear the whole burden[/edit]. Yes, there are some who have contributed to the upkeep, some anonymously and some quite heavily by donation standards, and I want to say “thank you” as a fellow member. But one glance into the “TMF Friends” section (it’s on the left side in the menuing system if you haven’t noticed it) will show that of the almost 8,000 members, our contributions are pennies as compared to what Jeff has forked over to support this forum.

If we each just kicked in say $10.00 every 6 months, or even once a year, the forum would come close to paying for itself and we wouldn’t be, what I feel to be anyway, taking advantage of someone’s good will and hospitality. I’d love see the TMF community come together to take care of the costs of the TMF without there ever being a need for subscriptions. It certainly wouldn't take much from each member.

That’s what I am asking each member to do. If you CAN afford to contribute something, ($10.00? come on, that’s nothing compared to the value of what is available here) please do so.

There no need to comment in response to this post, but if you do agree with the message it contains, simply walk quietly over to the “contribute to the TMF” link near the top of the left side, and help out. I, for one, as a member here will greatly appreciate it.


TD

 

[dodger]

Um, can I ask WHO are you that you no so much about the detailed costs of Jeff's sites? And that you know exactly where all Jeff's proceeds go to? 😕 Thanks.

 

[TummyDragon]

Um, can I ask WHO are you that you no so much about the detailed costs of Jeff's sites? And that you know exactly where all Jeff's proceeds go to? 😕 Thanks.

I am David, a member of the Tk cummunity under the name "Ticklefan" for years. I work in the computer industry and have done work in music production. I understand the costs of bandwidth. I've known Jeff since 1997 and while we are not necessarily friends outside of the tickling community, we have been cordial discussion mates since that time. Other than that, I'm just a member here.

TD

 

[dodger]

Hey well nice to meet you! 🙂

 

[Neutron]

Why Should I ...

If you want a job as Jeffs accountant then so be it.

If Jeff posts this it has creditibilty.

This thread sounded like a mindless lemminglike shill. 🙁


Tron

 

[TummyDragon]

Hey well nice to meet you! 🙂

Likewise! 🙂

 

[WorkInProgress]

I appreciate having this pointed out by someone who is aware, though I might suggest an alternative to "we're sponging," something like "we're receiving a benevolence for free and ought to chip in something so that one person won't bear the whole burden." But I think it has loads of credibility coming from a concerned friend.

 

[ShiningIce]

Yes mean people do indeed suck.

 

[dodger]

But I guarantee you that Jeff is not losing money when all [income vrs money spent] is calculated up each month. There is no way he's losing money every month and just paying out of his own pocket for the TMF. No way in hell. He may be a nice guy but he's not a fool. So all is well. He's making profit or he'd shut down.

 

[TummyDragon]

I appreciate having this pointed out by someone who is aware, though I might suggest an alternative to "we're sponging," something like "we're receiving a benevolence for free and ought to chip in something so that one person won't bear the whole burden." But I think it has loads of credibility coming from a concerned friend.

You are absolutely correct. The wording I used was terrible there. Thanks for pointing that out. I didn't really give that much thought while I was typing it, but I can easily see how it could be seen as offensive. Sorry.

TD

 

[Limeoutsider]

But I guarantee you that Jeff is not losing money when all [income vrs money spent] is calculated up each month. There is no way he's losing money every month and just paying out of his own pocket for the TMF. No way in hell. He may be a nice guy but he's not a fool. So all is well. He's making profit or he'd shut down.

I think he would ask for donations or start charging a monthly fee for the service before he would shut down!

 

[TicklingDuo]

I think he would ask for donations or start charging a monthly fee for the service before he would shut down!

You mean like this? http://www.ticklingforum.com/contribute.html

We can all debate what we like. But, the fact remains that Jeff pays good money for this place...and others. Take a look at The Tickle Scene sometime. Jeff provides that space for us as well. It's Jeff's choice to do this. While not all are able/willing to donate money, I think he at least deserves thanks and respect for something he doesn't have to do.

Just my $.02.

Ann

 

[TickledToDeath]

This message is from an average forum member. This is not a post to initiate a discussion or a debate. I am simply a member of this community who sees something I perceive to be just “not quite right” so I’m speaking up. I've been coming here since the forum's inception on EZboard, but I have no affiliation with the TMF, receive no compensation from the TMF, nor do I have any relationship or affiliation with Jeff or MTP aside from being “friends” in the community.



TD

Geeeze, I would hate to see what your post would be like if you WERE affiliated with the TMF, Jeff and MPT and getting compensation!😛 😉


You raise valid points however in my opinion, while I do plan to throw a few bucks their way after I get settled in my new location, it is fair to presume that he is not just throwing thousands of dollars into the street. Anyone in their right mind(save the jokes😉 )
would not continue to operate a site or business with a perpetual loss of monatory revenue.

TTD

 

[TummyDragon]

Re: Re: A member's perspective...

Geeeze, I would hate to see what your post would be like if you WERE affiliated with the TMF, Jeff and MPT and getting compensation!😛 😉

You raise valid points however in my opinion,
TTD

LoL. Thanks.

Yeah, I’ve been known to speak passionately, probably overly so, on topics in which I have a strong belief. If that made me sound like a “shill” in this situation, then the cause of that was my own inability to communicate effectively. The message I tried to convey, however, is valid. I do firmly believe it’s "not quite right" to allow one individual to bear such a majority of the burden for something in which so many participate. It's not fair to that individual. The TMF is not a business. It is simply located “next door” to one.

I’m amazed that this thread turned into a discussion of Jeff’s profit margins on his commercial sites. Those are different sites for different purposes with different content. I think most, like you, who read the initial post understood the gist, noted the point, and made a decision one way or the other at that time. Most “got it” whether they agreed or not. The following is only for those who may not have.

Here's the way I see the situation. I'll use an imperfect analogy for the bandwidth, which obviously doesn't extrapolate perfectly, but it's the only one I can think of off the top of my head. It's like a group of friends at some point saying “I wish we had a cool place to hang out”. One of them says, “hey, we can all go to my place, I have pizza and brew!” So everyone heads over. He supplies all the pizza and beer for everyone saying "great to have you here". Over time, the groups of people coming over grow larger and larger. So the host provides more and more pizza and brew. The groups finally grow so large that the amount/cost of pizza and brew becomes staggering. Maybe, at this point, the group has become so large that not everyone knows exactly where the stuff is coming from or who's paying for all of it, but everyone is really enjoying it. The host continues supplying everything without saying a word. Well, the host shouldn't *have* to say anything. There just comes a time when those who are eating and drinking should say "hey, you shouldn't have to buy all the pizza and brew for everyone by yourself, let me kick in and help."

It shouldn't matter whether the host runs the pizza shop next door, or whether he has asked for help, or whether you feel he's having trouble financially or not, or even whether the person who mentions passing around the hat has some elusive credibility in your eyes. Each of us paying what we can to cover our own share of the tab is simply the right thing to do. That's the point I was trying to make. There will be those who disagree, those who can’t afford it at the moment, and those who, knowing the situation, will want to help. My original post was intended for the latter.

Take care,

TD

 

[harvey]

Keeping this site alive

May I begin, TD, by saying that I agree with your basic premise that TMF members should be willing to help fund this site. I also agree that the TMF is something very special, in that it brings together so many like-minded people from over the entire free world.

All the things you mentioned – the stories, vid-links, pic-links, posted thoughts and ideas – are all factors which bring people to this site and cause them to register and participate. I suspect that, until your posting of this thread, many registrants had no clue to the existence of “bandwidth” or the fact that Jeff is actually having to pay for it. A certain fraction of these uninformed members probably don’t care about it either, but perhaps the small fraction of our total membership (and guests) who will actually read this thread will care.

Perhaps we should consider, briefly, what this forum really is, to most people. I think of it as an “online club” for those interested in tickling. As is the case with any club, where people meet regularly, there is a “core group” within the general membership. It is usually this ‘core group’ which keeps the club together and administrates its various functions. It falls to them to do 90% of the work, while the other members ride along at their leisure. While this isn’t right, it is the nature of most organizations which people ‘join’ of their own choosing. With this in mind, perhaps a question that needs asking is, “Who makes up the core group of this online club?” I believe we would have to conclude that our ‘core group’ consists of those members who post regularly, or participate on a regular basis in some other way, as in the chat room. This core group represents the portion of registered members who would be most ‘negatively’ affected, if this forum were to suddenly be shut down.

Not long ago, Terra_Ascension started a thread (last seen on page 4 of ‘Tickling Discussion’), asking about posting statistics. In AMK714’s reply, he/she enumerated the postings by category, which, when added together, show a total of 436 members who have posted more than 50 times. This is only about 5% of the total registered membership. This does not include the members who post occasionally (like me) and have yet to achieve a total of 50 posts. However, a random survey of about 10% of the member pages indicates that, on average, about 18 of the 30 members listed per page have not posted at all, or only about 12 per page have posted.

If this average holds true for the entire membership listing (and it probably does within about plus/minus 4), then we could extrapolate or project that only about 40% of the registered members are ‘active’, in the posting sense. Even with the benefit of the deviation (best case), only about 53% of the registrants have ever posted. However, I know from my own participation in the chat room that some of the members who visit the chatter have never posted, so chat room participation is another factor in members’ overall use of this forum. Unfortunately, this leaves me with no accurate way to determine how many of the non-participants came here, registered, and then (for whatever reason) never returned.

Setting all this arithmetic garbage aside, I think the question that we (active) members must ask ourselves is “How adversely would I be affected, if this site suddenly disappeared?” I can only speak for myself here, in saying that I would be very unhappy to see that happen, because I have friends here with whom I have no other way of keeping contact. I know there are those who will say that this is "nobody’s fault but ours", but that doesn’t diminish the fact that this site does mean a lot to many people. It's also true that Jeff could require a 'membership fee', but this strikes me as an administrative nightmare that would be best avoided.

So, as TD suggested here, let’s ‘pass the hat’ and help Jeff a little. Surely those of us who consider ourselves ‘active’ members could do that. Even though I would hope that Jeff would let us know before things got tight enough to close this site, if you feel this forum is in some way important to you, you should consider helping support it.

 

[BigJim]

But I guarantee you that Jeff is not losing money when all [income vrs money spent] is calculated up each month. There is no way he's losing money every month and just paying out of his own pocket for the TMF. No way in hell. He may be a nice guy but he's not a fool. So all is well. He's making profit or he'd shut down.

He can also claim tax rebate, because it's an advertisement for a genuine business. Nevertheless, I'll echo Ann's words. He doesn't have to do it. He does anyway.(Even if it is in his business interests.) Nuff said.

 

[TummyDragon]

Bandwdth is the Sum total of all mouse clicks!

I suspect that, until your posting of this thread, many registrants had no clue to the existence of “bandwidth” or the fact that Jeff is actually having to pay for it.

Hi Harvey, I knew someone who is a far more eloquent "orator" than myself would hop on this thread. Thanks..

Bandwidth is the sum total of all mouse clicks!

I just wanted to say that first because I know that when many read about "computer geek stuff" their eyes glaze over, drool begins to spill and soon heads hit keyboards out of sheer boredom.

You make a valid point. Most don't know anything about it or that it even exists. Okay, this is for those in the category of "yes I care, but what the hell are you talking about?" Here's the quick, non geek version. Maybe almost non geek.

Every time you click your mouse, data is transferred either from the TMF to your computer or from your computer to the TMF. When you click on your bookmark, or type "ticklingforum.com" into your browser and hit "enter" the TMF wakes up and starts sending stuff to you as the opening page you see. Each page that "loads" is really being transferred to your computer. Each time you click on a thread, the TMF transfers that thread to your computer so you can read it in your browser. When you reply to that thread (or start a thread) and click "submit reply" it's sent from your computer to the TMF. So this stuff is transferred in both directions. Bandwidth, in a very simple definition for the purpose of this thread, can be considered the sum total of all stuff transfered in either direction. So whether you read posts, or post posts, you add a fraction to the total bandwidth of the site. Since a click of the mouse is usually what "makes something/stuff happen" on the TMF, you really can look at it as every time the mouse is clicked, bandwidth increases by a tiny fraction. Simple way of looking at it, but is true.
The Chatroom is the same way. Data packets being transferred in both directions.

And then, someone has to pay the bill for the total.

Enough geekness.

TD