Are we spreading the word the way it should be spread?

[drew70]

Here in the tickling community, there seems to be a movement of sorts to bring tickling more out in the mainstream...a sort of evangelism to spread the word of tickling to the world. Wouldn't it be great if tickling were as popular as video games? While I love the concept, there are realistic ramifications we have to consider.

The most serious of which is simply this: Do we present tickling to the world as a sexual thing? Or do we present it as a fun thing? I've seen threads that touch on the subject of just how sexual tickling is. There is a wide spectrum of opinion, the most common of which seems to be that depending on the situation it can be both. I'd have to agree with that mainstream opinion, myself.

If we successfully popularize tickling as a sexual (perhaps a better word would be "adult") theme, then we kind of shoot ourselves in the foot in my opinion. Tickling will be forever associated with whips, chains, BDSM, etc. There would be no more playful tickling amongst children. There's be no more affectionate tickling between parents and kids. It would be preached against in our churches, and would be shunned in general by the vanilla world.

However if we present it as a fun thing, then it would be something in which everybody could participate. Schools might have tickling competitions in which the champion would be he/she who could dish out the most and take the most. We'd have tickling on the menu of legitimate therapeutic massage places like Beaux Visages. Tickling would be commonplace at the office, raising morale considerably. The world in general would be wearing more of a smile than today's frown.

My vote goes for FUN. I've always disliked having to rummage through porn, bondage, and foot rags to find material on tickling. We've got to break away from this image of sexual deviancy. What do you think?

 

[WallStreet]

I've found that ticklees are actually more ticklish when they are NOT tied up. I'm not saying that they're easier to tickle. I'm just saying that they are more ticklish.
Bondage is not a necassary element of tickling.
I can remember the pre-internet era of rummaging through the "foot rags" for the smallest morsel of tickling information. That usually resulted with phony looking pics. Those were bad days. I think in today's age it's pretty easy to root out the straight up tickling sources.

 

[venray]

I dont think we are ready for what many consider mainstream..do we want to be accepted yes but by whom?..Schools..I think not...while there is definitely a place for the fun and innocent tickle, there is also a place for the sexual tickle..the vanilla world will never be able to separate the two...If we make tickling out to be just a fun innocent thing to do, we open up the vanilla world to those who would take advantage of the innocence and who knows where that would lead..

personally I do not care to be mainstream as it were, but choose to share within a community of like minded people instead....not really caring what mainstreamers think of my preferences....



Ven

 

[TicklingDuo]

A hug can be sexual or innocent. A kiss can be sexual or innocent. A pat on the arse can be sexual or innocent. A TICKLE can be sexual or innocent.

Nobody worries about a hug, kiss or pat on the bum. Nobody stops doing it. They know it can go either way. I suspect that, even if associated with sexuality, the past innocenced experienced in tickling will remind people that it goes either way. So, I don't see laws banning public tickling or anything like that in the future.

That having been said..I also think that, while we can make it clear to those who are looking that it CAN be a sexual thing, we are likely to be more successful in presenting the fun and innocent side to the masses. Something that is seen in that light is less likely to appear a threat than something matched up with things already viewed by many as negative or even evil. Present it as innocent fun. Then, wait for those who would to find deeper enjoyment and come to us. We've got our own materials to show the sexual side.

Ann

 

[dodger]

The most serious of which is simply this: Do we present tickling to the world as a sexual thing? Or do we present it as a fun thing?

LOL, this is the single most inept thing I've ever seen posted. It doesn't matter what "we" present! The world of human's doesn't care what "we" present tickling to be. They'll see it for what it mainly is anyway, a sexual fetish. It's shameful to think that a handful of us could "present it" this way or that way and make it stick worldwide. Too much time on your hands.....Too much time on your hands... 😀

 

[mabus]

...on a kinder note, drew70, no, tickling should never be "presented" to the world of mainstream, because the world of mainstream is filled with ignorant hate-filled bigots. That the way it was, is, and always will be, no matter what the peaceable and loving members of society, the Anne Franks and Mother Theresa's and poets believe and hope. People want to hate anything different because hate feels great!

Just look at how the Southern Baptists and just about about every other loving, caring Christian denomination hates gays and the S&M community and anything else they deem different, therefore obscene.

Plus, tickling can be sexual or non-sexual, even to people who have a tickling fetish. They can tickle their kids, or friends, male and female, and not get turned on, but tickle their wife or husband, and that will turn them on. Or, they can even tickle their spouse and not get turned on, but choose to later. Well, WE understand this. The world won't, and as we all know by now, won't BOTHER to understand it, either. Sad, but true. And because we understand this, but everyone else doesn't, it should be a topic only discussed by us.

drew70, I understand where you are coming from, but sadly, tickling will never peacefully become mainstream. This is the way things will always be. The day tickling and alternate lifestyle choices become fully accepted by society will be the same day the Islamic world stops beating the shit out of women for basically existing, and stops sending their own kids to blow themselves up along with every Jew nearby, and the same day blacks stop hating whites, and whites stop hating blacks, and different religions stop hating each other, and on and on.

We already have to put up with the assholes in our own community who have this fetish, and those crazy ass hackers, and the feuds between Paradise Vision and whoever or whatever other person or company feels that the forum is "out to get them." But you know, at least everyone who posts here likes tickling, we can agree on that. I've always been afraid if we get too mainstream, the forum will be filled with all the bigots who will constantly tell us how evil and weird we are everytime any of us posts anything here. That would really suck!

Read Francois' thread about his own experiences:
http://www.ticklingforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17954

 

[46and2]

This is the way I look at it:
Just about everyone I know is aware that there are people with foot fetishes, and the majority of these people would not consider someone a foot fetishist if they offered to massage their feet (of course I'm talking about a flirtatious situation). I think the same could go for tickling, it's just not as well known as a foot fetish, or your typical S&M. I wouldn't see any harm if society as a whole was more educated to the fact that there is a tickling fetish. As a matter of fact I think that is slowly but surely happening. Not to say that it will ever be as popular as video games or movies, or accepted in the workplace for that matter.

-Phil

 

[JoBelle]

I recently had a converasiton with a gentleman friend who is in his late 40's. (The "I lived through the pre-internet days of tickling.") On topic, we talked about the how difficult it was for "us" as a collective to find things tickly. There was a lot of trial and error trying to find a source and fortunately, the internet makes it possible for folks to circumvent what was once a barrier. You don't have to "out" yourself at all to get your fix to a point. It's a subject I never understood because though I'm only 30, and have been dabbling online for over ten years, I only found the online tickly stuff about 4 years ago. Prior to that, I must have been a nightmare to the deeply closted ticklfolks who ever ran past me. I was open, gracious, excited, and verbal about my kink. How dare she?!? 😉

THAT being said....
I don't think there is a need to present tickling to the world. It's been there as we all know, forever. Who among us wasn't tickled as a kid? It's part of human nature to tickle. *If you ask me.* And now that there are readily avilable sources for the folks who take that tiny step to look, I doubt there needs to be debate on how it's viewed. I can't see pushing it either way. As soon as you do THAT, you've effectively excluded the folks who view it "the other way." You've marginalized them.

Anywho, as far as being in the day to day....tickling in schools beyond what kids do already? That's just crazy talk. I wouldn't want some contest with someone's fingers all over my kid. Just seems kinda creepy to me. Well, no more so than I want kissin' contests, or bum-pattin' rallies in grade school. Even if tickling were to become some mainstream thing, I'd still have to draw the line way before it got there. **An aside, people without kids can't view things in the same manner as those who do have them. It's just a matter of property, protection, and sense of responsibility of the life of another person. SO, I don't mean to offend anyone with that schools comment. Just saying that part the mommy in me and directing to the other parents who probably rolled their eyes at that suggestion while giving validity to the rest of the original post.**

To tie up...😉...The last few years, as gatherings can attest, have seen a huge comfort level in people's views toward tickling. Small and growing..small and growing. There's a base, a variety of levels, and a sense of availability. That's good enough for me.

Joby

 

[dodger]

Schools might have tickling competitions in which the champion would be he/she who could dish out the most and take the most. Tickling would be commonplace at the office, raising morale considerably.

You just can't be serious! Please tell me this was meant to be sarcastic fiction. Been hittin' the bottle my friend? 😀 🙂

 

[drew70]

With one glaring exception, all of you gave good responses, and I thank you for them. I guess what I proposed is more wishful thinking than anything else. I posted it just after reading "The TMF" thread in which excitement was expressed over the expanding membership of this forum. It made me wonder if Howard Stern and Yaqi are doing us a favor by getting all this media exposure. But reading these responses has eased my concerns, especially considering 46and2's point regarding foot fetish and foot massage. Jo and the others made good points as well. I sometimes forget tickling has always been here, and is more deeply rooted as a pastime than it will ever be as a fetish.

Again, many thanks to most of you who responded.

 

[dodger]

You are very welcome. That's what we're here for! To help and respond. 😀

 

[TickledToDeath]

I agree, fun, if it were to be advertised/introduced into mainstream.
However it could also be described as senusal fun, for couples who need a pinch of spice in their lives.

All that is needed is a spark. I believe that there are many more who love tickling than we "know of" or even know it themselves for that matter!?

TTD😉 😀

 

[WallStreet]

I think that there are various definitions of Mainstream tickling. I could care less wether tickling ever becomes a mainstream thing. Mainstream tickling to me consists of being able to get a free video of Pam Anderson, Jenna Jameson, etc being tickled. I have always been a big backer of that kind of mainstream. I hope that my many comments over the last few months haven't been misconstrued as a desire to see tickling go worldwide. Sadly, there are many things alot more dimented than tickling that would come to the spotlight first.

On a lighter note, I think Dodger needs to switch to decaf. If Drew's question were truly inept I don't think it would have gotten three intelligent responses before Dodger's own response.
I don't mean to jump into the middle of Dodger and Drew's feud (I don't need to jump in, I simply sit back and laugh) but when Dodger basically zeroes in on Drew's nonconfrontational posts it makes him seem desperate for a confrontation.
I believe it was Mark Twain who said something to the effect of "The first man to throw a blow is the first man to run out of ideas".

 

[dodger]

Wallstreet I respect you. You've always been a really cool guy and I agree with most of your posts on here. But about Drew, you're missing the big picture. This is just one thread. He goes at me and others on other threads without any provocation. He's had many posts deleted because he attacked me and others harshly. And if you every make it over the the AMT, where Drew feels much more at home, you'll read how he describes "Dodger" as "a slippery little shit that needs to be taken care of." So in other words don't play into his little act that he's just trying to be helpful and friendly here. That's the pretend Drew. Why do you think he's so against the well maintained and well balanced censorship here at the TMF? It's because he has so many nasty things he'd love to say but it eats him up that he can't. Keep on tickling Wallstreet. I love your stuff. You come across as a nice, normal decent guy. Most of the people who post here are just like you. Most. 😀

 

[Sunday_10pm]

I think that the fewer people who know about the "tickle fetish" the better. I also know that there are alot of people in this community who don't care what me and thousands like me think. Occasionally you hear - "Do you think going on Jerry Springer and spreading the word about us ticklephiles would be a good idea??" - "You could really promote the TMF!!!" - "Yea good one. They will all point and laugh at you fs" - "No they won't! I think it would be great for the community! The stars are God's daisy chain! wheee"
And so I've come to the conclusion that no matter how much I wish these apparently brainless people would be granted brains, they won't. However, I think that despite their efforts to ruin it for everyone, it will never be regarded as anything worse than a harmless, kinky querk.
I'm not saying people who are open about it are foolish. Neither do I think it is anything to be ashamed of. I have openly admitted finding it sexual to every girlfriend i've had. None of them have had any problem with it. They may find it weird, but not in a bad way at all. The people I really don't like are those who seem bent on letting everyone know there is a "tickle fetish". If I want anyone to know, I'll tell them myself ffs.

 

[drew70]

Dodger

While having my own personal stalker here at the TMF is somewhat flattering, I have to believe you've got better things to do. You are welcome to express your opinions and your speculations as to my motives, though I suspect some are growing weary of them. I'm happy to let you continue but I'm afraid I have to correct some misinformation on your part.

1) To the best of my knowlege, only one post of mine has ever been deleted from the TMF, and only just recently. Myriads was right in doing so because that post was a direct breach of TMF protocol. I screwed up, and I'm determined not to let that happen again.

2) You misquoted my AMT post. My exact words were "...a slippery little s__t who has learned how to flame, while keeping just under the threshold of unacceptable discourse." I mentioned nothing of "taking care of you." Paranoid, are we? But hey, don't take my word. Reread it for yourself:

http://groups.google.com/[email protected]

What I find curious is that as much as that remark obviously upsets you, you made no reply to it at AMT. Instead you bring it here to the TMF. Why would you want to do that? Shouldn't this conversation be taking place there and not here?

 

[dodger]

Re: Dodger

What I find curious is that as much as that remark obviously upsets you, you made no reply to it at AMT. Instead you bring it here to the TMF. Why would you want to do that? Shouldn't this conversation be taking place there and not here?

Wait now. There's a glaring contradiction in your two recent posts. On another recent post when I said,
"Smell blood did ya drew70? For the life of me I can't think of a single reason why you'd start this thread out."

To which you replied,

"Very simple. I saw this information posted to AMT and nothing about it here."

But Drew, according to your words way up above, your rule is that what is posted to AMT, should stay on AMT right? Uh oh! Looks like someone has broken there own rule (to benefit himself). That's a no no. 😉

 

[dodger]

Oh and please stop stalking me here on the TMF. 😀 🙂 😀 It's very unflattering to me. 😀

 

[Myriads]

Dodger, Drew, take it to private e-mail if you have an issue with each other. No more of this personal slap game here, or in the other thread. Deletions will start if it continues.

Myriads

 

[dodger]

Understood Myriads. Sorry.

 

[Neutron]

Or Are You...

Thinking about this WAY too deep. I could give a flying rats ass if anyone else likes tickling as a hobby, fetish or whatever so long as I can find ticklees.

Tron

 

[drew70]

Re: Or Are You...

Originally posted by Neutron

Thinking about this WAY too deep. I could give a flying rats ass if anyone else likes tickling as a hobby, fetish or whatever so long as I can find ticklees.

Why yes Neut, I can really see how much you don't care. So much is your non-caring that you took the time and trouble to respond to this thread, making sure we all know exactly how much you "don't care." Never have I seen such apathy.

This is a discussion forum. There is no "WAY too deep." And if it hasn't yet occurred to you, the best way to express disinterest might just be to not respond. Food for thought, eh?

But getting back to the topic, it seems that many feel that they don't want the world to know about the tickling fetish. I tend to agree. It's not their business what gets our rocks off. That's why I feel, if the word is going to be spread, stress the fun, and underemphasize the fetish. Otherwise let's not spread it at all.

 

[Texas_Tickle]

personally I do not care to be mainstream as it were, but choose to share within a community of like minded people instead....not really caring what mainstreamers think of my preferences....



Ven

Here here! I too don't really give a rat's ass what "mainstream" thinks either. I have always marched to my own beat. But I agree that the "vanilla world" will always associate tickling with chains and leather. Not that it's all bad, but we will never be accepted by "mainstream". Even those in the "hardcore" BSDM scene refer to us as " BSDM wannabe's".

 

[Texas_Tickle]

Re: Re: Are we spreading the word the way it should be spread?

LOL, this is the single most inept thing I've ever seen posted. It doesn't matter what "we" present! The world of human's doesn't care what "we" present tickling to be. They'll see it for what it mainly is anyway, a sexual fetish. It's shameful to think that a handful of us could "present it" this way or that way and make it stick worldwide. Too much time on your hands.....Too much time on your hands... 😀

Agreed. It does not matter how we present it to the world. Most of the world has already made up it's mind, and all the facts in the world will not be able to change their minds.

Like the old saying goes "My mind is already made up, so don't try to confuse me with the facts".

 

[mabus]

Whoah, this got nasty real fast!

But is it mainstream everyone wants, or simply better and/or more tickling stuff?

There are two ways to look at this whole debate that has embraced the community for a long time. If you don't already know, there are bigots out there, and just plain stupid people who will not bother to learn anything about anything and will just say we're all weird and that's that. If you don't know this, well, you're either two years old or a hermit, ...since you were two years old.

But I don't know if you want it to become mainstream in order that you start getting higher quality and/or more tickling material. You either want it to be accepted by everyone, or you just want to see more stuff videos and pictures.

I'm kind of agree with the second statement. I know it will never be accepted. You either have to tickle fetish, or you don't. I mean, everyone knows there are people out there who like bondage, but that still doesn't mean it will be accepted fully by everyone. Many christians believe those people who engage in bondage, or even role playing in the bedroom, are going straight to hell, no questions asked. No matter that many of these people are married, or are faithful to their spouses, commit no crimes and are very productive and happy members of society. Look, if it became known that a dedicated member of the local homeless diner, or church group engaged in bondage or leather outfits with his or her spouse, the other community members would look down angrily on them and throw them out. Never mind that they are faithful to their partners and are humble people, just like Jesus told us to be. (He also said don't dare hrow the first stone, or the last one, don't judge. He said that a lot. That rally pissed people off everytime he said it. That still pisses people off today.) If we were there, in that group, we wouldn't bat an eyelash.

Jobelle also hit it on the head - I don't want that taught in schools, I don't want to see tickle parades, I don't want it shoved down eveyone's throat. I support gay rights, but I don't want to hear about being gay 24 hours a day, I'm not gay, and neither is the majority of Americans. I don't want the gay lifestyle taught in schools to kids who don't know what the hell the teacher is talking about. I don't want the S&M lifestyle taught in schools or in public service announcements either. School should be math and science and history. I mean, goddamnit! Kids today don't know how WWI started, WWII, or any other war for that matter. They don't know who the first, second, 15th, or CURRENT president is! They can't even find their own country, let alone own state on a map. So when I see the gays, or the athiests, or the christians trying to push their agenda in public schools, I sake my head in disbelief. Let them the learn the basics first, and when they leave school, then teach them that, IF they choose to learn it.

There are many here who love to see "mainstream" tickling in movies and TV. Maybe this is where some of this debate stems from. 99.999% of mainstream tickling SUUUUCCCKKKKKKSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!
That's because in 99% of the scenes, there is either no reaction whatsoever, or there is zero laughter if there is a reaction. Or, it lasts 3 seconds long. Or, it's very dark. (Why do most mainstream scenes, happen in dark situations where you can't see anything?)

So, we want more stuff, but even though there is now a lot of stuff, there ain't that much. There was a thread recently about producers mad because people were bashing there stuff. But they pointed to suggestions and requests, and labeled that as bashing. There is a huge difference between insults, critiques, and mere suggestions. To label ALL of those as bashing, is simply untrue.

There is some great stuff out there. But look at all the things that have NOT been done. No, no one has yet to make a cheerleader tickling video. Pantyhose is still a rarity, a once a year thing. Few teacher tickling videos, and the "teacher" is never dressed like a teacher. No girls are tickled in really nice dresses, or business outfits. It always looks like a model behind a desk, and not a woman who actually works a job. Not many business secretaries wear a leather skirt, platform heels, or a bikini top. Not many teachers wear platform heels and fishnet stockings, either. There are many stories of tickling, which obviously involve some plot, or setup. Rarely is attention made to setup, and plots are almost non-existent in videos or picture sets. You have a model, already in stocks, she gets tickled, and that's fine, but that is going to get old the hundredth time it's done.
Maybe people want a little bigger productions, maybe some more, different angles, or artsy style. Not weird as hell artsy, but you ever scan magazine, or see a movie, and imagine that that scene could be a great setup for a tickle? Or, take a mainstream scene of tickling that sucks, and make a good video where it doesn't suck? Look at Harmony Concept's catalog. Hundreds of bondage poses perfect to carry into tickling. Maybe more comedy. Parodies of movies where tickling instead of violence is involved. What else could be done that has never been done before?