Judging a Model's Ticlklishness

[Redmage]

Lorelei, webmistress and rigger at Bedroom Bondage, has an excellent article on erotic tickling. She says many worthwhile things, and I'm going to post a link to the article as a separate thread, but one of her points resonated with many comments that I've seen here:

Can Tickle-Fans Tell Who's Ticklish and Who Isn't?

I've seen this argument going back and forth in the newsgroups and on websites for a long time now. As far as I'm concerned, the answer is NO.

Sure, it's yes if it's a person who's had a lot of experience tickling actual partners -- in particular, tickling different women with individual, unique reactions to stimulus. But I've seen so many self-appointed experts online claiming that they could absolutely tell without a doubt that so-and-so wasn't ticklish, or that what's-'er-name was ticklish... And they were so wrong! I don't mind if a guy can't tell, but for him to march around the internet claiming to the masses that he knows who's ticklish... ha!

If you want to know how I can tell if a model is ticklish, well, it's not only my direct powers of observation and seeing what happens when I tickle them. It's also because the models are honest when the cameras aren't rolling. They'll tell you right out whether they're ticklish or not. Models have an admirable level of honesty going anyway; during most shoots I hear all kinds of personal stuff without even asking any questions -- they love to talk about what position they like in bed, whether their boyfriend's good at foreplay, how long it's been since they last had sex, how sensitive their nipples are, etc. etc.

I just thought it was worth thinking about and perhaps discussing. Personally I usually hesitate to say that someone is or isn't ticklish just from watching a video. I can tell when I have my hands on a 'lee, but I've seen enough different reactions that only the most extreme bad acting seems cut and dried to me.

 

[Bugman]

Redmage,you and Lorelei are so right.I've seen people post here that they have never seen a ticklish model in a clip.I think part of the problem is that not every lee reacts as they think she should.I've tickled enough ladies to know that reactions can vary wildly.Some people are just never happy with anything.I don't contend there are not plenty of fakers in clips but for the most part anyone with much experience can pick them out without much trouble.

 

[tcklft]

Lorelei, webmistress and rigger at Bedroom Bondage, has an excellent article on erotic tickling. She says many worthwhile things, and I'm going to post a link to the article as a separate thread, but one of her points resonated with many comments that I've seen here:

Can Tickle-Fans Tell Who's Ticklish and Who Isn't?

I've seen this argument going back and forth in the newsgroups and on websites for a long time now. As far as I'm concerned, the answer is NO.

Sure, it's yes if it's a person who's had a lot of experience tickling actual partners -- in particular, tickling different women with individual, unique reactions to stimulus. But I've seen so many self-appointed experts online claiming that they could absolutely tell without a doubt that so-and-so wasn't ticklish, or that what's-'er-name was ticklish... And they were so wrong! I don't mind if a guy can't tell, but for him to march around the internet claiming to the masses that he knows who's ticklish... ha!

If you want to know how I can tell if a model is ticklish, well, it's not only my direct powers of observation and seeing what happens when I tickle them. It's also because the models are honest when the cameras aren't rolling. They'll tell you right out whether they're ticklish or not. Models have an admirable level of honesty going anyway; during most shoots I hear all kinds of personal stuff without even asking any questions -- they love to talk about what position they like in bed, whether their boyfriend's good at foreplay, how long it's been since they last had sex, how sensitive their nipples are, etc. etc.

Well, given her past (?) association with FM Concepts, which has churned out quite a number of fake clips over the years, I wouldn't put much credence in what Lorelei has to say about the perceptiveness of the average tickling fan. What's she supposed to say? "Wow, they really nailed us on all that crap we've foisted on 'em over the years, and they were so right!"

That being said, there is a difference between the opinion that "that model's a fake" and "I don't care for that model's reactions". I dislike screamers (for instance) but realize screaming is a perfectly valid reaction, and not necessarily fake at all.

There are other reasons why an otherwise ticklish model may not perform as I'd like: the tickler is incompetent or indifferent, or the model is nervous, distracted, or feels poorly. She may "come alive", as it were, under different circumstances, but all I have before me is a clip where filming conditions--to which I'm not privy--led to a botched clip.

It may also be that a model is faking, but is so good that I don't notice. In this case ignorance is bliss, and I'm a satisfied customer. I wish I could read minds at a distance--at least as far as L.A.--but I can't. 🙁

The overall quality of tickling clips has improved greatly in the past decade, but there's still a fair amount of crap out there. I'll view whatever preview clips I can find and then figure out what to purchase....

 

[Redmage]

Well, given her past (?) association with FM Concepts, which has churned out quite a number of fake clips over the years, I wouldn't put much credence in what Lorelei has to say about the perceptiveness of the average tickling fan. What's she supposed to say? "Wow, they really nailed us on all that crap we've foisted on 'em over the years, and they were so right!"

Or, alternate scenario: FM's stuff isn't as faked as you think it is, and this is part of what she's talking about.

I actually know Lorelei, and when she says something line this, she means it.

That being said, there is a difference between the opinion that "that model's a fake" and "I don't care for that model's reactions". I dislike screamers (for instance) but realize screaming is a perfectly valid reaction, and not necessarily fake at all.

I agree that this is a common problem. In fact I think many people reframe a video as "fake" just because they actually dislike something else about it.

The overall quality of tickling clips has improved greatly in the past decade, but there's still a fair amount of crap out there. I'll view whatever preview clips I can find and then figure out what to purchase....

Also agreed. I think the biggest reason for this is technology, believe it or not. Time was, the people who made most tickling erotica made it as a small sideline to a much larger business - perhaps a bondage producer or even a mainstream porn producer. Video equipment was expensive, and the tickling market was small, so no one could afford to produce tickling material unless they had a more profitable main business to support their overhead. This meant that the people making tickling material were unlikely to be tickling fetishists, and they didn't expect such material to sell well anyway, so they didn't pay as much attention to quality. Since tickling material was so rare, those who liked it took whatever they could get.

Technology changed this from both ends. As video production equipment got cheaper, more and more people began getting into the business just to produce tickling material. Someone who specializes like that is more likely to be a tickling fan and to know what those in the fetish like. At the same time the Web grew up and gave producers access to many more customers than they would have had before. In a small market like this, getting your product in front of every possible customer is critical if you want to make a profit. And as a bonus, the sudden boom in fetish material meant that customers didn't have to settle for second best. Only the best producers thrived.

So, hurray for Moore's Law. 😉

 

[Bugman]

There are other reasons why an otherwise ticklish model may not perform as I'd like: the tickler is incompetent or indifferent, or the model is nervous, distracted, or feels poorly. She may "come alive", as it were, under different circumstances, but all I have before me is a clip where filming conditions--to which I'm not privy--led to a botched clip.

All good points.Incompetent or indifferent lers dont seem to be as big a problem as before,but he/she can sure ruin what could have been a nice clip.

 

[drew70]

Very cool article. I found myself agreeing strongly with her on several points.

 

[jaba]

Well, given her past (?) association with FM Concepts, which has churned out quite a number of fake clips over the years, I wouldn't put much credence in what Lorelei has to say about the perceptiveness of the average tickling fan. What's she supposed to say? "Wow, they really nailed us on all that crap we've foisted on 'em over the years, and they were so right!"

That being said, there is a difference between the opinion that "that model's a fake" and "I don't care for that model's reactions". I dislike screamers (for instance) but realize screaming is a perfectly valid reaction, and not necessarily fake at all.

There are other reasons why an otherwise ticklish model may not perform as I'd like: the tickler is incompetent or indifferent, or the model is nervous, distracted, or feels poorly. She may "come alive", as it were, under different circumstances, but all I have before me is a clip where filming conditions--to which I'm not privy--led to a botched clip.

It may also be that a model is faking, but is so good that I don't notice. In this case ignorance is bliss, and I'm a satisfied customer. I wish I could read minds at a distance--at least as far as L.A.--but I can't. 🙁

The overall quality of tickling clips has improved greatly in the past decade, but there's still a fair amount of crap out there. I'll view whatever preview clips I can find and then figure out what to purchase....

Good, post, I agree with just about all of it. F M concepts has done the least with the most potential tickle talent of any other tickle media producer, in my opinion.

That being said, when I hear someone pronounce that they know that this or that particular model is "not ticklish", that usually tells me more about the experience level of that person than any actual ticklishness of the ticklee he refers to. Some folks feel that if the lee isn't screaming like a banshee and thrashing violently all over the place, she's "not truly ticklish". That just tells me that the evaluator hasn't experienced truly ticklish lees who react otherwise. Frankly, if youre not in the skin of the actual lee, I dont know how anyone could conclude that someone is "not ticklish", they may be just witnessing a reduced or total lack of reaction one preferrs or is accustomed to seeing. The faking is probably better described as a faked, over the top reaction, rather than a determination of ticklishness. I prefer a lady paralyzed by tickling into a fit of motionless giggles over a screeching thrashing lady anyday.

And I agree, how many times have we all viewed a great potential ticklee in a horrible clip due to the incompetence or inexperience of the ler?

Also agreed. I think the biggest reason for this is technology, believe it or not. Time was, the people who made most tickling erotica made it as a small sideline to a much larger business - perhaps a bondage producer or even a mainstream porn producer. Video equipment was expensive, and the tickling market was small, so no one could afford to produce tickling material unless they had a more profitable main business to support their overhead. This meant that the people making tickling material were unlikely to be tickling fetishists, and they didn't expect such material to sell well anyway, so they didn't pay as much attention to quality. Since tickling material was so rare, those who liked it took whatever they could get.

Technology changed this from both ends. As video production equipment got cheaper, more and more people began getting into the business just to produce tickling material. Someone who specializes like that is more likely to be a tickling fan and to know what those in the fetish like. At the same time the Web grew up and gave producers access to many more customers than they would have had before. In a small market like this, getting your product in front of every possible customer is critical if you want to make a profit. And as a bonus, the sudden boom in fetish material meant that customers didn't have to settle for second best. Only the best producers thrived.

So, hurray for Moore's Law. 😉

In addition to technology, I agree that the increase in tickle media producers has made the overall media market better. There are a lot of duds and dud companies who believe that all it takes is a camera and someone willing to be tickled, but the expansion has produced some real gems, particularly in the amateur tickle media market, with some great lees that would have not been found otherwise. And i've seen some homemade media filmed with the family camcorder that blows the professionally made media out of the water, and its ALL because of the RIGHT lee being tickled by someone who really knows how to tickle.

In the final analysis, while it may be impossible to deem someone "not ticklish", it's pretty easy to determine the really ticklish ones, it's usually the same lees everyone refers to when talking about the truly ticklish . When you find someone like a Julia Parton, not even F M concepts can screw that tickle scenario up.....