Kobe Bryant: WTF does Shaq have to do with it?

[Laugh]

I really don't get it. Please explain this to me..

Just today I have seen so many posts on various sports boards accusing Kobe of being selfish, arrogant and labeled the reason Shaq left the Lakers. This was insinuated by quotes from Phil Jackson's book, interviews etc.

I realize Shaq and Kobe had their differences. Some see it as a melding of the big three: Shaq's supposed lazy 'work ethic', Kobe's over-sized ego and ultimately Lakers Management decision making.

Each one of those three has their 'pros' and 'cons'. Every NBA fan has their own opinions as to why Shaq left and what Kobe and Shaq each had to do with the decision. Everyone can speculate and blame, but in the end, only both Kobe and Shaq know the real inside story of what happened.

The whole "Kobe vs Shaq" fiasco has resurfaced because of recent accusations against Kobe and his seemingly imminent trade from Los Angeles. Phil Jackson and Lakers Management have accused Kobe of having a poor work ethic and not bringing his all to the game anymore, or at least while in a Lakers uniform.

My main gripe with all this is simple: WTF does Shaq have to do with Kobe anymore?? The man left years ago, found a new team, a new coach and found a partner who could work with him and win yet another championship. And no, the Heat didn't win a championship 'despite' Shaq - they won 'with' Shaq.

This came from Wade himself who knows how much Shaq contributed and how much Shaq helped win a title more than any fan or anyone who thinks they know basketball. Why? Because Wade was actually on the court with him during those games and during those practices. No number or statistic can judge a teammate's contributions and efforts better than someone actually on the court with them.

Shaq has moved on. He has yet another trophy and ring. He could retire tomorrow and be happy. He has proven once again he can play with a team, get along with teammates and bring a work ethic to the game that it takes to win a championship. He doesn't have to score over 40 points a game, he doesn't have to dominate a game and he has nothing left to prove in the NBA.

The bottom Line: SHAQ HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH KOBE ANYMORE.

Kobe, the fans of LA and NBA fans need to let it go. Why even bring Shaq's name up anymore?? He's a traded player who has moved on in life.

 

[primetime]

You know, I agree with you. Shaq has NOTHING to do with the Laker recent woes, but people will always tie Kobe to Shaq and vice versa.

The problem now is the fact that even though I love em', the Laker front office is a joke now. I mean, they have done ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to improve this team into a title contender. You have the BEST basketball player in the NBA today and you cant get ONE other "star" to help him? Lamar Odom is NOT a "star". He is a damn great role player. He does not have the mentality to be a "star". He would rather be that quiet guy doing all the dirty work. Look at his entire career.

That's the root cause of this whole situation. When you look at NBA Championship teams, you see a 1-2, sometimes 3 punch. Magic/Kareem/Worthy. Jordan/Pippen. Shaq/Kobe. Duncan/Parker. Shaq/Wade. These Lakers have Kobe/????????

The Laker management have had ample opportunities to bring in someone. For example, Jason Kidd, Kevin Garnett, Baron Davis, Carlos Boozer, the list goes on and on. They (Jimmy Buss actually) do not want to part with Andrew Bynum. Why? I do not know. But, I hope they realize that they are mortgaging the farm on Bynum. His success or failure will determine what happens to the Lakers.

Shaq/Kobe will always be brought up. The two guys will forever be bonded together, no matter who they play for. There was no other combination like them. It was like putting Wilt Chamberlain and Michael Jordan together. I think that is why they are mention together.

One more thing to those who really think Kobe was the one who got Shaq traded. Think about this logic. Kobe CANT get Andrew Bynum traded and he has publicly said he wants Bynum traded, but he can get Shaq traded (he never publicly said it). Even Shaq agreed with Kobe this past summer that Kobe is not the reason Shaq is gone. It is Laker management.

 

[jaba]

Good to see you back, Prime, and i agree with just about everything that is said so far in this thread. Here's my opinion....

everybody involved has a part of the blame in this mess, but i reserve the bulk of my anger with Laker management. They hold, or actually held, all the cards to the Championship pieces. All laker management had to do was force Shaq to play out the remaining years on his contract, or he could sit out and not get paid, if he chose to. So not only was Laker management stupid enough to trade one of the most dominant centers in the game, the rarest commodity in basketball, but they got nowhere near fair value for a player of Shaq's stature.

Kobe has his haters, but i think most rational folks agree that he is one of the premier players in the NBA....MVP of the last All Star game, major impact player and some say probably the best player in the complete series on the US national team. i have personally heard premier players in interviews say publically that they would love to play with Kobe and for the Lakers, and that they enjoyed playing with him in the All star game. So if for the past 3 years this is the abysmal team that arguably one of the most storied and prominent franchises in NBA history can assemble around Kobe, that tells me a lot about the stupidity and failure of the Laker management since Jerry west left the organization. And Prime, everybody forgets this....

How many championships did Michael Jordan win without Scottie Pippen?


That would be zero.


Also, other questions:

Q: What was Jordan's playoff record without Pippen as a teammate?
A: ONE win and NINE loses.


Q: Did Jordan ever get out of the first round of the playoffs without having Scottie Pippen as a teammate?
A: No, Jordan was knocked out in the first round all three years that he made the playoffs without Pippen. In Jordan's other two losing-record seasons with the Wizards, he did not make the playoffs.

Q: Did Scottie Pippen ever get the Bulls past the first round of the playoffs without Michael Jordan?
A: Yes, in 1994, the year after Jordan's first retirement. Got them to the 2nd round, where they lost in 7 games.


so if Jordan, who i think was the best player ever, wasnt able to win without another star, (actually Jordan had more super stars there, because Dennis Rodman was a monster on the backboards rebounding ) why do folks expect Kobe to do so, and give the Laker management a pass for 3 years of sorry dealmaking?

for 3 years, the Lakers have shown no desire to put a real quality contending team on the court. If they have shown no desire and ability to put a contending team on the court, how are they different than the Clippers in the locker room across from them?

Someone needs to shove the entire team of laker management out of the second story window of Laker headquarters.....

 

[primetime]

Hey Jaba, I'm glad you understand my plight. I am a die hard Laker fan. It is killing me to see our proud franchise get ripped apart by morons. The Shaq trade was necessary, but they bungled that trade. Now, they are bungling the whole Kobe situation.

Granted, Kobe should have kept his mouth shut about wanting to get traded, but he does have a point. I started asking other Laker fans, "what HAS management done to make us better?". Let's see, they trade Oneal for absolute peanuts. Although, we REALLY should have kept Caron Butler. However, we get rid of Caron for who? Kwame Brown. Need I say more?

What is killing me is the fact that the Lakers have had opportunities to get players, but for some strange reason, they fail to get deals done. Look at Danny Ainge (who i truly hate...) has done in Boston. How he managed to get Kevin Garnett for peanuts is beyond me. Mitch Kupchak? *crickets*. I know Kobe must have really enjoyed playing USA basketball because he was on a team where he didnt have to do everything. In LA, he HAS to do everything because no one else has the balls to do something with him. Again, Lamar Odom is a THIRD option. He will never truly be the "2" punch with a superstar alongside him.

Andrew Bynum. Yes, this kid has potential, but I just dont see him being that great. You can tell when someone is going to be really good and Bynum doesnt display it. But, little Jimmy Buss drafted him and he thinks Bynum is going to be the man. So, we are willing to lose Kobe (and Phil Jackson perhaps...) because Jimmy Buss thinks Bynum is great. I'm telling you, Bynum better average 30 points and 20 rebounds a game if he is to convince me he's going to be a star and he has to do that THIS year. If not, then the Lakers are doomed.

They need to make a decision. It's bad enough the rest of the team are not mentally tough, and this distraction will only bring them down. Either Kobe stays, or Kobe goes. I am hoping he stays and management brings their head out of their asses and get ONE other star. Otherwise, they will be responsible for losing both Shaq AND Kobe. How humiliating....

Good point about Jordan, Jaba. Same can be said for Kobe, Shaq, Duncan and a host of others. You NEED that other "wingman" otherwise, you end up being a great individual player, but not a champion.

 

[Laugh]

Thanks guys for posting. Good points Jaba about Jordan and Pippen. Like Prime said, every player needs a wingman.

I know we can't change time, but I was just thinking if Kobe and Shaq had stayed together, played together and Lakers Management acted like management and not monkeys screwing a football..

I'm thinking the Lakers would still be counting rings and trophies and would have equaled if not passed Jordan and the Bulls record by now.

I do hope the best for the Lakers. It's sad to see such a historic franchise with such a winning tradition waste away to nothing.

The Lakers used to be feared. Now they are laughed at.