so why is there a difference between how we view f/f and m/m clips?

[isabeau]

i'm taking Bella's suggestion and starting a new thread regarding this issue..i know she meant for Tamia to, sorry Tamia..but i'm extremely curious as to why f/f is ok, but m/m seems to be taboo? it doesn't seem fair to me..and as Tamia said..seems a double standard issue as well...like why does it always have to be that males who enjoy being tickled by other males must be gay? and don't get me wrong..i have absolutely nothing against gay people at all..but why that standard? why when we see females tickling other females that issue doesn't seem to come up?

 

[Horatio]

Horatio speaks..

Well, Isabeau, the short and probably closest-to-the-truth answer is: that's how Western culture views same-sex, physical intimacy. As you know, it's different in other cultures accross the globe - some cultures it's more OK for two men to show affection (and not be branded as gay), and in many it's less acceptable for women to do the same.

I have a hunch that if one were to observe (here in the US) two adult men tickling each other in a public setting - a mall, a park,etc - most people would assume they're gay. But, I think if one were to observe to females doing the same, many observers would come to the same conclusion as well. Maybe not as many as m/m, but my gut feel is that it would be close.

 

[isabeau]

Well, Isabeau, the short and probably closest-to-the-truth answer is: that's how Western culture views same-sex, physical intimacy. As you know, it's different in other cultures accross the globe - some cultures it's more OK for two men to show affection (and not be branded as gay), and in many it's less acceptable for women to do the same.

I have a hunch that if one were to observe (here in the US) two adult men tickling each other in a public setting - a mall, a park,etc - most people would assume they're gay. But, I think if one were to observe to females doing the same, many observers would come to the same conclusion as well. Maybe not as many as m/m, but my gut feel is that it would be close.

thanks for answering, Horatio...i suppose that makes some sense..actually in person i haven't witnessed anyone being tickled like in a mall, park what have you..i've only viewed them on clips..but as i said before..i enjoy watching both, and it doesn't cross my mind that one or the other might be gay..

 

[PainTrain]

Well, Isabeau, the short and probably closest-to-the-truth answer is: that's how Western culture views same-sex, physical intimacy. As you know, it's different in other cultures accross the globe - some cultures it's more OK for two men to show affection (and not be branded as gay)

Thats what I love about Japan. =P

Men in the United States have been programmed from an early age to think a certain way, and I guess they are happy with that.

 

[isabeau]

Thats what I love about Japan. =P

Men in the United States have been programmed from an early age to think a certain way, and I guess they are happy with that.

which is truly a shame..i grew up in rather a rascist time..but i didn't allow my grandparents or even my parents in their own way influence me one bit..

 

[aun_existe_amor]

I love m/m but I don't like f/f. I'm trying to think of a reason why but I don't know apart from I'm a straight female. I know it doesn't make me gay to like f/f but I just have no desire at all to do it or see it.

 

[BellaRisa]

I have a hunch that if one were to observe (here in the US) two adult men tickling each other in a public setting - a mall, a park,etc - most people would assume they're gay. But, I think if one were to observe two females doing the same, many observers would come to the same conclusion as well. Maybe not as many as m/m, but my gut feel is that it would be close.

Actually, I'd assume they were related in some way, and I suspect most folks would.

Bella

 

[chrisheaven]

Good thread, Melanie-I have absolutely no idea about all of this-just a gut feeling like the others have mentioned.

 

[unclebill]

Melanie, in this country men don`t tickle other men. It is considered gay. Its like telling a blonde joke about a blonde haired man. Its simply not funny. Once in a great while, I enjoy a good blonde joke about females. I just crack up laughing. To sum things up: m/m tickling is gay, and blonde jokes are cool.

 

[isabeau]

Melanie, in this country men don`t tickle other men. It is considered gay. Its like telling a blonde joke about a blonde haired man. Its simply not funny. Once in a great while, I enjoy a good blonde joke about females. I just crack up laughing. To sum things up: m/m tickling is gay, and blonde jokes are cool.

sighs...you would bring up blonde jokes...but seriously i don't see the connection..and don't say because i'm a blonde.

and interesting Aun Existe that you don't enjoy watching f/f clips..i do, because i place myself in the lee's position..i can also do that with m/m clips as well.

 

[aun_existe_amor]

Maybe it has something to do with me not being a lee then, I honestly don't know.

 

[BellaRisa]

Melanie, in this country men don`t tickle other men. It is considered gay. :

See, I find this truly facinating. Because I think you're right...but I've seen too much to the contrary to totally agree with that. I think the straight guys that tickle don't end up being around the ones that don't, so those guys think it never happens. It does I promise you. And the guys doing it don't think it's gay because, well, they're not gay.

One of the first truly excellent tickling scenes I ever saw was a young man being gang tickled by his fellow wrestlers in Roots, it's a reasonably lengthy scene and kinda hot and definitely helped shape my love of straight m/m material. Yes they were in Africa, but the movie was made here and that scene was written by a straight American man about other straight men. Unusual? Perhaps, but then again, I saw many such scenes in college involving guys so straight I'm amazed their knees and elbows even bent 🙂 . To me and a LOT of people I know, a guy tickling another guy is honestly no different than two guys wrestling, indian burns, noogies, or that sick nipple twisting thing y'all do 😛 . A way to torture your buddy without really hurting him. And sometimes I'm in the mood for a level of tickle torture that two girls rarely deliver; a bit of nail fluttering ain't what I want at the time That appeals to me in a way that two women usually doesn't, just because girls don't often abuse each other the way guys do, y'know? We're not born to it. I love f/f if I'm one of the f's, otherwise it's kinda boring and phony for the same reasons men feel that way about m/m.

bella

 

[unclebill]

sighs...you would bring up blonde jokes...but seriously i don't see the connection..and don't say because i'm a blonde.

and interesting Aun Existe that you don't enjoy watching f/f clips..i do, because i place myself in the lee's position..i can also do that with m/m clips as well.

The connection is, that society has set these guidlines for much longer than any of us has been around. If you see a group of females tickling each other in a mall, your first reaction is to think little of it. Its no big deal. However, if a group of men are tickling each other, I assure you security will be alerted. In a womans eyes, this may not be considered fair, but its the way it is, at least in the U.S. A few different opinions from a tickling forum are not going to change hundreds of years of thinking.

 

[lk70]

I expect I might get some negativity on this but what the hell...I think it's viewed differently because the vast majority of American men have absurd hang ups about male homosexuality. Sure, they'll give lip service (pardon me) about how they have no problem with gay guys, but they'll be sure to emphatically state in the same breath that they're not gay. That can only stem from the fact that they really do have some problem with male homosexuality. Female homosexuality, on the hand- well hell- if you're a man who doesn't think THAT'S hot then you must be gay. Complete and utter nonsense.

I like m/m. I find it sexually arousing whether the participants are gay or not. I also find m/m sex scenes arousing, assuming the action presented is to my liking.

I don't like watching f/f videos but I'm not disgusted by it and I don't assume anything about the sexuality of the participants. Right up til this minute I haven't stated on the forum that I don't like f/f. Why? Because at no other time has it been relevant. I've never felt the need to jump into a f/f clip thread and state that I don't like it. What's the point of that? Who cares if I like it or not? It's there for the people who do like it. Period.

As for in person, participatory tickling- it's ALL good with me. F/F, M/F, M/M F/M. Why? Because it's fun! Because I always have a good time. Because the people I play with are people I like and what's better than doing something you like with people you like? Does it have to be sexual? Absolutely not. Can it be? Oh my yes, even with participants of the same sex.

Am I gay? Bi-sexual? Straight with turns? Don't know, don't care. Don't feel the need to carry a label. I like what I like and I'll do what I like with whomever I like - and I'll have a damn fine time of it and not give a hoot what others think about it.

I am woman, hear me roar....

 

[BellaRisa]

Um, whut?

UncleBill I swear I'm not picking on you, but if I saw a group of grown people of either sex tickling each other at the mall (or anyplace else except maybe a family reunion) I'd think they'd lost their minds, wouldn't you? Now a bunch of teens, of either gender, acting like clowns and tickling/pulling hair/whatever would just get an eye roll from most people, and while boys *might* get stranger looks I think most folks would file it under typical horseplay and move on. But we never see a bunch of grown people just hanging around tickling each other, unless your neighborhood is some 'ler heaven you're keeping a secret... 😛

Bella

 

[milagros317]

Speaking only for myself, I like to watch women engaged in tickling, on either side of it. So seeing an f/f photo or clip is a double pleasure, giving me the sight of both.

A photo or clip of m/m does nothing for me, but others are welcome to enjoy it.

 

[isabeau]

I expect I might get some negativity on this but what the hell...I think it's viewed differently because the vast majority of American men have absurd hang ups about male homosexuality. Sure, they'll give lip service (pardon me) about how they have no problem with gay guys, but they'll be sure to emphatically state in the same breath that they're not gay. That can only stem from the fact that they really do have some problem with male homosexuality. Female homosexuality, on the hand- well hell- if you're a man who doesn't think THAT'S hot then you must be gay. Complete and utter nonsense.

I like m/m. I find it sexually arousing whether the participants are gay or not. I also find m/m sex scenes arousing, assuming the action presented is to my liking.

I don't like watching f/f videos but I'm not disgusted by it and I don't assume anything about the sexuality of the participants. Right up til this minute I haven't stated on the forum that I don't like f/f. Why? Because at no other time has it been relevant. I've never felt the need to jump into a f/f clip thread and state that I don't like it. What's the point of that? Who cares if I like it or not? It's there for the people who do like it. Period.

As for in person, participatory tickling- it's ALL good with me. F/F, M/F, M/M F/M. Why? Because it's fun! Because I always have a good time. Because the people I play with are people I like and what's better than doing something you like with people you like? Does it have to be sexual? Absolutely not. Can it be? Oh my yes, even with participants of the same sex.

Am I gay? Bi-sexual? Straight with turns? Don't know, don't care. Don't feel the need to carry a label. I like what I like and I'll do what I like with whomever I like - and I'll have a damn fine time of it and not give a hoot what others think about it.

I am woman, hear me roar....

you rock did you know that? that's a fantastic answer..thank you Lk and i agree wholeheartedly..

 

[drew70]

but i'm extremely curious as to why f/f is ok, but m/m seems to be taboo?

I'm curious, Izzy. What leads you to believe that M/M is "taboo"? From what I've seen lately, it's clearly the most protected gender preference here in the TMF. In the Clips forum there is a thread posting an M/M clip advertisement. Without even bordering on any insult whatsoever a few of the guys casually expressed disinterest in M/M, after which a couple of Moderators jumped all over them, threatening them with banning. Again, for only expressing disinterest. In fact, one fan of M/M referred to those expressing disinterest as "assholes," and was praised for doing so by one of the mods.

So, I'm wondering why you feel that M/M is taboo? Around here, disliking M/M is way more taboo than acceptance of it.

 

[isabeau]

I'm curious, Izzy. What leads you to believe that M/M is "taboo"? From what I've seen lately, it's clearly the most protected gender preference here in the TMF. In the Clips forum there is a thread posting an M/M clip advertisement. Without even bordering on any insult whatsoever a few of the guys casually expressed disinterest in M/M, after which a couple of Moderators jumped all over them, threatening them with banning. Again, for only expressing disinterest. In fact, one fan of M/M referred to those expressing disinterest as "assholes," and was praised for doing so by one of the mods.

So, I'm wondering why you feel that M/M is taboo? Around here, disliking M/M is way more taboo than acceptance of it.

um Drew where have you been??? there are two threads in here specifically about m/m clips...and there was much fighting in that thread you are talking about...i stand by what i posted.. it seems taboo to me..although of course i don't agree with it..one thread in the tickling discussion is do you like m/m clips..the other is for those who don't like m/m and to state their opinions as to why not.

 

[lk70]

I'm curious, Izzy. What leads you to believe that M/M is "taboo"? From what I've seen lately, it's clearly the most protected gender preference here in the TMF. In the Clips forum there is a thread posting an M/M clip advertisement. Without even bordering on any insult whatsoever a few of the guys casually expressed disinterest in M/M, after which a couple of Moderators jumped all over them, threatening them with banning. Again, for only expressing disinterest. In fact, one fan of M/M referred to those expressing disinterest as "assholes," and was praised for doing so by one of the mods.

So, I'm wondering why you feel that M/M is taboo? Around here, disliking M/M is way more taboo than acceptance of it.

I wonder how casual that expression of disinterest is, Drew. It certainly wasn't apropos of the thread, was it? Suppose every time someone posted a clip, everybody who wasn't interested in it posted to say so? I'd get mighty tired of seeing that, I can tell you. While that particular thread did turn into an absurd pissing match, I think the point is that there's really no need to post in a clip thread the fact that you don't like that style of tickling. It would be like taking the time to open a non-tk foot pic only to post that you don't like feet. Why bother?

 

[maniactickler]

I think it just seems more natural to see two soft, sexy women together as opposed to two macho, ugly, dirty men tickling each other.

 

[isabeau]

I think it just seems more natural to see two soft, sexy women together as opposed to two macho, ugly, dirty men tickling each other.

hmm not all women are drop dead gorgeous that get tickled in clips..and the same can apply to the men...not all are macho, or ugly or dirty gesh...

 

[Redmage]

I expect I might get some negativity on this but what the hell...I think it's viewed differently because the vast majority of American men have absurd hang ups about male homosexuality.

Yep, pretty much. "******" is practically the first insult boys learn these days. I recall a comment in the early thread to the effect that men in an M/M video were "obviously gay," whereas that wasn't obvious at all for women in an F/F video. Someone went so far as to say that F/F and M/M were actually different fetishes. Reminds me of the homophobe I knew in college who swore he could tell whether a man was gay or straight just by watching him walk.

Then there's the recent comment that F/F is just "more natural." As though women were intended by nature to tickle each other, and men were not. Ooookay-fine.

My experience has been that when someone says something so poorly supported with such obvious conviction, there's something strange afoot in that person's assumptions.

 

[tickledgirl]

i'm taking Bella's suggestion and starting a new thread regarding this issue..i know she meant for Tamia to, sorry Tamia..but i'm extremely curious as to why f/f is ok, but m/m seems to be taboo? it doesn't seem fair to me..and as Tamia said..seems a double standard issue as well...like why does it always have to be that males who enjoy being tickled by other males must be gay? and don't get me wrong..i have absolutely nothing against gay people at all..but why that standard? why when we see females tickling other females that issue doesn't seem to come up?

This may be dodging the question, but I think it's fair to say that most of the tickling depicted here is sexual in nature. There may be some exceptions, but that's a legit assumption to make. So assuming, or thinking about a sexual relationship of some sort between 'ler and 'lee isn't a stretch.

Of course that begs the question of why people are less comfortable with (male) gay sex than with lesbian sex...

 

[tickledgirl]

So, I'm wondering why you feel that M/M is taboo? Around here, disliking M/M is way more taboo than acceptance of it.

Drew, taking the sexuality out might make it easier to understand:

I'm not into foot tickling. There are lots of foot tickling pictures/clips/stories here. If I went to every thread that featured foot tickling and posted something negative, even if it was something mild like "Eh, foot tickling. Doesn't do anything for me," lots of people would get annoyed, and rightfully so. Someone took to trouble to create that story/post/picture, and their payment is the approbation they get here. Grumbling about stuff that isn't my personal cup of tea undercuts the ethos that makes this place work.

So when people got annoyed, it wouldn't be because there's a taboo about disliking foot tickling. I think a good general rule is, "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything." Okay, that may be the "mom" in me speaking, but I think it's valid here too.

I'd say the same goes for negative comments about MM, or just about anything other kind of tickling.