Why I Think Greg Maddux Is The Best Pitcher Of All Time

[Mitchell]

I know this is purely an opinion, and maybe biased, with my being a Braves fan, and having had the pleasure of watching him pitch on a regular basis for 11 years when he was with the Braves. I truly think that upon thinking about the all time greatest pitchers, Greg Maddux holds the distinction, for a few reasons.

Maddux has 355 wins, more than Seaver, Ryan, Carlton, and most other 300 game winners of the modern era. Maddux has four Cy Young Awards, 18 Gold Gloves, more than 3300 strikeouts, and led the league in ERA many times, all with a fastball that never reached 90 mph.

All of the other all time greatest pitchers previously mentioned, had fastballs of 90 plus MPH, or in Ryan's case, more than 100 mph. In Carlton's case, he had a devastating slider. The other forementioned pitchers blew batters away with fearsome stuff. Greg Maddux succeeded for 23 years with location, location, location.

I'm aware that Seaver had a better career ERA and more strikeouts than Maddux. Often times, during his career with the Mets, Seaver lost games that he likely would have won, with a higher scoring team, and might have won 400 games with his 2.86 career ERA, if he played in the offensive era of today. The thing about Seaver, as I mentioned before, is that in his heyday, he threw 90 to 95 MPH, and was able to blow batters away. Greg Maddux, even at the prime of his career in the early and mid 90s, when he won four straight Cy Youngs, didn't have that luxury.

Maddux will almost certainly, deservedly, be inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame next summer.

Thoughts on Maddux?

 

[Laugh]

As you said, this is just opinion. But I think Seaver gets the nod over Maddux. You can't go wrong with either pitcher.

ERA is pretty much the target statistic most annalist study when deciding the more dominant pitcher. Seaver is also considered the better quality pitcher, having a 2.62 K/BB ratio and Maddux having a 3.37 K/BB ratio. Seaver also played for the Mets, who had one good year (1969) while Maddux was playing for 10 years with a playoff team. Seaver also had 5 one-hitters, including 2 no-hitters broken up in the 9th inning. He did get his no-hitter in 1978.

Also, I don't get the argument of saying Maddux did not have a high-speed fastball so that should give more of a 'luxury' to the other pitchers. Muhammad Ali is considered one of the greatest boxers in history, yet had no knock out power. I think few fans would argue that Mike Tyson is a greater boxer than Ali. However, both got the job done.

Again, you can't go wrong with either pitcher. Just my opinion Seaver was the better pitcher.

 

[milagros317]

While Maddux is certainly a great Hall of Fame pitcher, I believe you are indulging in hyperbole to even remotely think that he is the best of all time.

The right-handed starting pitcher whom I believe to have a much better record than Maddux is, you will be surprised to hear, not a Dodger. It is Walter "Big Train" Johnson who pitched from 1907 to 1927 for the old Washington Senators.

I won't bore you with a ton of stats, but in Johnson's best year (1913) he was 36-7 with an ERA of 1.14, with 11 shutouts thrown, and with a WHIP (walks plus hits per inning pitched) of 0.780. His career ERA is 2.17 and he struck out 3,509 hitters.

 

[Mitchell]

Laugh, I see your point.

mils, while I see your point as well. There's one reason I think Maddux has the edge.

While I know Johnson had 417 wins, he pitched in an era when starters almost always got the decision. Greg Maddux pitched.. at least for eleven years with the Braves, and even before and after that.. in an era of pitch counts, relievers, and starters often not getting decisions. The fact that he piled up 355 wins, with those conditions, not to mention 3000 plus K's, and the fact that his ERA didn't go over 3 until a few higher ERA years the last years of his career, is to me, amazing.

Again, I know this is opinion, but such are the reasons for my arguments.

 

[Laugh]

My favorite Maddux stat is 17 straight seasons with 15 wins or more. The game is about winning and that stat pretty much says it all.

 

[Mitchell]

Agreed.

Even though Seaver had five twenty win seasons, and Maddux had only two twenty win seasons, Maddux often won more games than Seaver, during individual seasons, because Maddux played for better teams than Seaver. As the Braves won division titles during each of his years with the Braves, and Seaver, except for 1969 and 1973, often played for mediocre teams with the Mets.