a hypothetical question about non-consensual tickling.

[CapturedDoll]

The link I'm going to post here is the closest you can find to what is being asked. And for me having experienced this twice... I can tell you... as a person who HAD rape fantasies on both sides of the coin... and ticking fantasies on both sides of the coin that REMAIN... You SHOULD experience a "Total Power Exchange". Nothing made me realize my limits faster or to be mindful of others limits until these 3 day weekends. Because we can sit here and imagine all day long... but reality is reality. I experienced these with my Master/Bf. I was safe. I was cared for in the sense meals were provided for me, health issues were always kept in mind. I was never in any real danger.

One was a weekend of punishment... the other was my introduction to TPE. Both VERY different... My punishment weekend was anything but fun...my introduction I walked away from happy... but realized some things about my fantasies that I wasn't into as much as I thought I was... and changed. And, through both I realized...you can't have these questions answered until you experience them for yourself. You cannot do something to someone else... until you are willing to go through it first yourself.

https://husdom.com/total-power-exchange-tpe/

 

[Sensualswitch10]

You only need to look at war crimes throughout history to prove my point. Nanking massacre, Vietnam war, etc. When people know they can get away with something, they turn into animals. The people who did these things were not some horrible psychopathic monsters, they were normal young men in the military, and these happened en masse.

I'm certain that not every young soldier in the situations you described participated in the rape and murder of helpless civilians. I am equally certain that many of the soldiers who witnessed those atrocities were horrified and repelled by them and those who committed them. They just lacked the courage or the ability to stop it from happening.
I also disagree with your assessment that they weren't horrible psychopathic monsters. They just didn't express their horrible psychopathic monstrosity until they were afforded the opportunity to get away with it. I actually read a book a while back about serial killers throughout history and how many of them sought out the ability to participate in warfare for exactly that reason. So they could act out their desires to harm other people and get away with or even be rewarded for it.
And I personally have been in many situations with girls who were so drunk that had I done anything like that to them they wouldn't have been able to resist or even remember. My most default response was to throw a blanket on them (if one was available) and let them sleep.
I'm not the morality police, and I'm not saying I'm better than anyone else, but there are definitely plenty of guys who would not commit rape just because they could get away with it.

And I thought this was supposed to be about tickling.

 

[Wolf]

You only need to look at war crimes throughout history to prove my point. Nanking massacre, Vietnam war, etc. When people know they can get away with something, they turn into animals. The people who did these things were not some horrible psychopathic monsters, they were normal young men in the military, and these happened en masse.

Kind of a leap, isn't it? To go from wartime atrocities to "Every man in the world would rape a woman if given the chance and the guarantee of no repercussions"?
What you fantasize about is your business, but you don't have any right to try to project them onto everyone else, no matter how hard you try.

 

[CapturedDoll]

Sensual Switch: It should be but the minute hypothetical non consent fantasies are discussed... horrific stories of old come up. Nature of the beast.


But I'll help bring it back to tickling. Most of my tickling fantasies are non consensual. And I myself think so far out there sometimes... my Bf will look at me (and the tickling community in general...) and say "You understand that's not possible... right? Nor is half of the things you repost. Most bodies can't contort like that... etc etc lol

So... one of my fantasies I would love to be tickled for 3 hours straight. Gang tickled at that. Is it possible without a bathroom break? Maybe... (most likely not unless I pee on myself). Is it possible I could pull a muscle or 10,000 other things go wrong. Yes. Would I LOVE to tickle a woman or man for 3 hours straight... YES. But... I think some people fail to realize that even the tickler themselves has limits. We all have other things that need to be taken care of in life. Smoke breaks... food... whatever. So I think the question cancels itself out really. If you can't imagine yourself in the shoes of the victim in the fantasy... then... it's probably best kept as a fantasy. Or up for discussion with a future partner. But in your fantasies....go hardcore! That's why we have them.

 

[Sensualswitch10]

^Thanks Dolly! I'm starting to real dig what you're putting down!^

 

[CapturedDoll]

^Thanks Dolly! I'm starting to real dig what you're putting down!^

Thank you! I appreciate hearing that, very much!

 

[shad0w]

I absolutely would... But only if I could somehow ensure the person I tortured didn't remember it afterward and was perfectly fine. Like a flat out "undo." The desire is certainly there, and I'm evil at my core enough to be fully attracted to the prospect of such a thing, but I know in the end my conscience of how that person would be after would kick in.

UNLESS....it was someone I distinctly disliked. Then I'd have no problem whatsoever.

*Ok, not NO problem, but I'd feel a lot less guilty.

 

[CrystalLight]

Fact of the matter is, whether people want to talk about it in nice company or not, it doesn't matter: if you take a man that's full of testosterone and give him the place, equipment, and ability to do anything to a gorgeous woman he wants to with no repercussions of any kind, he will satisfy his sexual fantasies. Moral or not, it's the truth.

OK. Lets toy with your assumption. Two questions.

1.) Would you do that? I've scanned bits of this thread and am not sure if you stated you would. If you have already, then discourse over; it's not the truth. It may be an unfortunate majority, but it is not an action all men would carry out nor even consider to.

2.) Do you feel the same if it were a female full of estrogen, had all the equipment, no repercussion, etc?

 

[CreepyMaleLer]

I would. The most ticklish girls are the ones who resist, because they don't want to be tickled. It's the ewwy gooey epicenter; where all the good vibes come from.

 

[DontAskJusTckle]

You agree with him that if there were no consequences you would rape a woman? And you think you have to be the morality police to oppose that? That's some world view you've managed to evolve.

I don't believe rape was mentioned in the hypothetical scenario Shinsatou described. I believe the phrase was "do anything to a gorgeous woman he wants to with no repercussions of any kind, he will satisfy his sexual fantasies."

That's a pretty broad stroke of the brush there. Yes, it certainly includes rape, and for some guys I suppose that's what it would take. But not for me. My sexual fantasies require a certain aggression from females so nothing I could do with any equipment would satisfy them, repercussions or no. The most I would likely do is cop a cheap feel...caress her breasts...squeeze her bottom...that kind of thing.

Having said that, I find it a little tough to accept your assurances that neither you nor most guys you know would in any way take such an advantage. I'm not saying you or they would. But I don't think you've thought it through. There she is, yours for the taking. You can do anything you want to her, and most importantly...without any repercussions. That's the key here, the linchpin of the whole scenario. No repercussions.

We all like to think we're good, decent people, and probably most of us are, more or less. But if we're honest, it's the repercussions that keep us in line, not any deeply ingrained morality. Before there were laws, rules, and repercussions, we were no different from the animals. We took anything that looked good to us, including women, whether they were ours to take or not.

We don't act that way any more because as a society we've built lots of repercussions in our daily lives that properly restrain us. You drive too fast you get a ticket, so you drive slow. When I was a teenager, I shoplifted from time to time. I knew it was wrong. But knowing it was wrong didn't stop me. What stopped me was the repercussions. I saw my friend get busted and that was it for me.

When you think of the repercussions of even touching a woman the way I described, it makes most people think twice. To take it further and actually pour the coal to her, that's rape. In the eyes of the law it's extremely serious. In the eyes of public opinion, it's twice so. The consequences are so daunting that to think we'd even consider it frightens us.

But take all of those consequences and repercussions away, in a situation in which you can totally have your way with a woman, and nobody finds out, nobody arrests you or treats you any differently...I'm thinking that to resist such an opportunity would require an impressive strength of will and character so rare, there's not nearly enough of it to pass around to you AND most guys you know.

At the very least, I think that few if any of us could know what we'd really do in such a situation unless we were in it. I have more respect for guys who would acknowledge the possibility that they'd say to hell with morality and have at her, than those who polish their halos and staunchly maintain their assurance that even in such a hypothetical scenario bereft of consequence, they would resist the temptation.

 

[TMF Jeff]

Rape was mentioned. What do you think it means when he says any guy who has a woman in his power would act out his sexual fantasies if there were no consequences, and as proof offers

You only need to look at war crimes throughout history to prove my point. Nanking massacre, Vietnam war, etc. When people know they can get away with something, they turn into animals. The people who did these things were not some horrible psychopathic monsters, they were normal young men in the military, and these happened en masse.

I've noticed something that you and he have in common, along with other people who hold this kind of point of view - you think anyone who won't admit to having the same lack of empathy and compassion is just hiding something.

I'm not hiding anything, and I've given it plenty of thought in other conversations like this. If you've ever seen the movie Platoon, I'm going to use it as an example. When they raid that village, some of the guys grab and rape everything female that they can get their hands on, and other guys either walk away because they don't want to have to kill their own comrades, or they outright fight the guys doing the rape.

You and Shinsatou are guys who would grab a girl and rape her, by your own admissions. I'm a guy who would shoot you in the back for doing it, and I wouldn't care what was going to happen next.

It comes across like you two are sociopaths who think anyone who claims to have empathy must be lying, because you've never felt it yourself. But what it probably is is that you've spent too much time fantasizing, and over time the fantasies get more extreme and drift further and further from anything rooted in reality.

Which is not to say you guys wouldn't rape a woman if you could, because as he pointed out it's something that happens when you take the leash off a certain type of guy.

I don't believe rape was mentioned in the hypothetical scenario Shinsatou described. I believe the phrase was "do anything to a gorgeous woman he wants to with no repercussions of any kind, he will satisfy his sexual fantasies."

That's a pretty broad stroke of the brush there. Yes, it certainly includes rape, and for some guys I suppose that's what it would take. But not for me. My sexual fantasies require a certain aggression from females so nothing I could do with any equipment would satisfy them, repercussions or no. The most I would likely do is cop a cheap feel...caress her breasts...squeeze her bottom...that kind of thing.

Having said that, I find it a little tough to accept your assurances that neither you nor most guys you know would in any way take such an advantage. I'm not saying you or they would. But I don't think you've thought it through. There she is, yours for the taking. You can do anything you want to her, and most importantly...without any repercussions. That's the key here, the linchpin of the whole scenario. No repercussions.

We all like to think we're good, decent people, and probably most of us are, more or less. But if we're honest, it's the repercussions that keep us in line, not any deeply ingrained morality. Before there were laws, rules, and repercussions, we were no different from the animals. We took anything that looked good to us, including women, whether they were ours to take or not.

We don't act that way any more because as a society we've built lots of repercussions in our daily lives that properly restrain us. You drive too fast you get a ticket, so you drive slow. When I was a teenager, I shoplifted from time to time. I knew it was wrong. But knowing it was wrong didn't stop me. What stopped me was the repercussions. I saw my friend get busted and that was it for me.

When you think of the repercussions of even touching a woman the way I described, it makes most people think twice. To take it further and actually pour the coal to her, that's rape. In the eyes of the law it's extremely serious. In the eyes of public opinion, it's twice so. The consequences are so daunting that to think we'd even consider it frightens us.

But take all of those consequences and repercussions away, in a situation in which you can totally have your way with a woman, and nobody finds out, nobody arrests you or treats you any differently...I'm thinking that to resist such an opportunity would require an impressive strength of will and character so rare, there's not nearly enough of it to pass around to you AND most guys you know.

At the very least, I think that few if any of us could know what we'd really do in such a situation unless we were in it. I have more respect for guys who would acknowledge the possibility that they'd say to hell with morality and have at her, than those who polish their halos and staunchly maintain their assurance that even in such a hypothetical scenario bereft of consequence, they would resist the temptation.

 

[Wolf]

Rape was mentioned. What do you think it means when he says any guy who has a woman in his power would act out his sexual fantasies if there were no consequences, and as proof offers
I've noticed something that you and he have in common, along with other people who hold this kind of point of view - you think anyone who won't admit to having the same lack of empathy and compassion is just hiding something.
I'm not hiding anything, and I've given it plenty of thought in other conversations like this. If you've ever seen the movie Platoon, I'm going to use it as an example. When they raid that village, some of the guys grab and rape everything female that they can get their hands on, and other guys either walk away because they don't want to have to kill their own comrades, or they outright fight the guys doing the rape.
You and Shinsatou are guys who would grab a girl and rape her, by your own admissions. I'm a guy who would shoot you in the back for doing it, and I wouldn't care what was going to happen next.
It comes across like you two are sociopaths who think anyone who claims to have empathy must be lying, because you've never felt it yourself. But what it probably is is that you've spent too much time fantasizing, and over time the fantasies get more extreme and drift further and further from anything rooted in reality. Which is not to say you guys wouldn't rape a woman if you could, because as he pointed out it's something that happens when you take the leash off a certain type of guy.

One of my jobs when I was in Law Enforcement was in Corrections, and I remember one particular night, sitting at a desk one door down the hall from where the sex offenders (in Administrative Segregation, of course) were playing cards. One of the excuses given for their actions was that what they had done was perfectly natural, that it was only the false restrictions of society (like ages of consent, etc) that made their actions "a crime". It's stunning what people will justify by simply saying, "anyone else would do it".

 

[DontAskJusTckle]

It's interesting and a little disheartening how many instances there are where you either woefully misunderstood what I said, or just outright ignored it. For example, I was pretty clear in describing what I would do in the proposed scenario, and why I would NOT go for rape. And yet you seem under the impression that I would commit the rape "by my own admission." Since you clearly missed what I said, here it is once again...

Yes, it certainly includes rape, and for some guys I suppose that's what it would take. But not for me. My sexual fantasies require a certain aggression from females so nothing I could do with any equipment would satisfy them, repercussions or no. The most I would likely do is cop a cheap feel...caress her breasts...squeeze her bottom...that kind of thing.

Another example. I never suggested you or anybody else was "hiding" anything. That would only be true if I felt that you KNOW you would rape the woman, given the proposed scenario, and simply don't want to admit it. That's not what I'm saying. Maybe that's what Shiatsu is saying, but not me. What I'm saying is that given the scenario of no repercussions, it would take a rare bread of man to not take advantage of that situation in some way. (Given the mention of "equipment" I was thinking more in terms of tickling than raping.) Most of us aspire to be that rare breed kind of guy. I know I do, and I'm sure you do as well. But unless we are actually in that situation, I believe that few if any of us could say with 100% assurance what we would do.

For that reason I think those who self-righteously insist they are above such temptations come off as holier-than-thou. I think the more honest answer would be, "I'd like to think I wouldn't do that, but as I've never encountered such a situation, I can't say for certain."

As for shooting me in the back, well forgive my wild imagination, but that strikes me as a wee bit of a repercussion. Hence, at the risk of spoiling your White Knight moment, I would have done nothing in the first place to warrant you shooting me in the back.

Rape was mentioned. What do you think it means when he says any guy who has a woman in his power would act out his sexual fantasies if there were no consequences, and as proof offers


I've noticed something that you and he have in common, along with other people who hold this kind of point of view - you think anyone who won't admit to having the same lack of empathy and compassion is just hiding something.

I'm not hiding anything, and I've given it plenty of thought in other conversations like this. If you've ever seen the movie Platoon, I'm going to use it as an example. When they raid that village, some of the guys grab and rape everything female that they can get their hands on, and other guys either walk away because they don't want to have to kill their own comrades, or they outright fight the guys doing the rape.

You and Shinsatou are guys who would grab a girl and rape her, by your own admissions. I'm a guy who would shoot you in the back for doing it, and I wouldn't care what was going to happen next.

It comes across like you two are sociopaths who think anyone who claims to have empathy must be lying, because you've never felt it yourself. But what it probably is is that you've spent too much time fantasizing, and over time the fantasies get more extreme and drift further and further from anything rooted in reality.

Which is not to say you guys wouldn't rape a woman if you could, because as he pointed out it's something that happens when you take the leash off a certain type of guy.

 

[shinsatou]

I'm certain that not every young soldier in the situations you described participated in the rape and murder of helpless civilians. I am equally certain that many of the soldiers who witnessed those atrocities were horrified and repelled by them and those who committed them. They just lacked the courage or the ability to stop it from happening.
I also disagree with your assessment that they weren't horrible psychopathic monsters. They just didn't express their horrible psychopathic monstrosity until they were afforded the opportunity to get away with it. I actually read a book a while back about serial killers throughout history and how many of them sought out the ability to participate in warfare for exactly that reason. So they could act out their desires to harm other people and get away with or even be rewarded for it.
And I personally have been in many situations with girls who were so drunk that had I done anything like that to them they wouldn't have been able to resist or even remember. My most default response was to throw a blanket on them (if one was available) and let them sleep.
I'm not the morality police, and I'm not saying I'm better than anyone else, but there are definitely plenty of guys who would not commit rape just because they could get away with it.

And I thought this was supposed to be about tickling.

Well yes, I didn't mean literally every single man. In any case involving people, there are always going to be majorities and minorities, and I'm speaking about the majority.

As for serial killers(a subject I'm fascinated by), the amount of people in any society who are/are potentially serial killers is very low. Like probably less than 1% of the population. The war crimes I'm talking about happened en masse, you can look up the ones I listed if you like. Not a good comparison.

And your point about drunk girls, well there is still a possibility that you would get in trouble for it, so again not really a good comparison. The situations I and the OP were talking about were ones with absolutely no repercussions, guaranteed.

OK. Lets toy with your assumption. Two questions.

1.) Would you do that? I've scanned bits of this thread and am not sure if you stated you would. If you have already, then discourse over; it's not the truth. It may be an unfortunate majority, but it is not an action all men would carry out nor even consider to.




2.) Do you feel the same if it were a female full of estrogen, had all the equipment, no repercussion, etc?

1. Yes

2. Not really. I'm not a female, but their attitude towards sex is much different than men's, in my opinion.

 

[shinsatou]

Rape was mentioned. What do you think it means when he says any guy who has a woman in his power would act out his sexual fantasies if there were no consequences, and as proof offers


I've noticed something that you and he have in common, along with other people who hold this kind of point of view - you think anyone who won't admit to having the same lack of empathy and compassion is just hiding something.

I'm not hiding anything, and I've given it plenty of thought in other conversations like this. If you've ever seen the movie Platoon, I'm going to use it as an example. When they raid that village, some of the guys grab and rape everything female that they can get their hands on, and other guys either walk away because they don't want to have to kill their own comrades, or they outright fight the guys doing the rape.

You and Shinsatou are guys who would grab a girl and rape her, by your own admissions. I'm a guy who would shoot you in the back for doing it, and I wouldn't care what was going to happen next.

It comes across like you two are sociopaths who think anyone who claims to have empathy must be lying, because you've never felt it yourself. But what it probably is is that you've spent too much time fantasizing, and over time the fantasies get more extreme and drift further and further from anything rooted in reality.

Which is not to say you guys wouldn't rape a woman if you could, because as he pointed out it's something that happens when you take the leash off a certain type of guy.

Shoot us in the back? I thought we wanted to talk about things objectively while refraining from judgement, not pillory people for their opinions! I think you'd be right at home in the Spanish Inquisition. The pious attitude of some people is what's stunning to me, not the fact that some people agree with my point.


At the end of the day, human beings are animals, and animals don't have any inherent morality. What keeps us in line is our societies and legal systems.

 

[TMF Jeff]

Wrong, at least in my case, I'm definitely judging this stuff. I'm drawing conclusions from what people are saying, I don't know how to avoid that. And I don't think seeing a rape is something that calls for objectivity. If you were lucky I'd shoot you in the back. If I had time to think it through, I might shoot your cock off and let you live.

I also don't think you can fairly call opposition to rape "pious." Why do you think it's considered such a serious crime? It's because the vast majority of humanity considers it to be one of the most despicable, inexcusable acts possible. Even the topic is disgusting and vile, and the idea that you think most people are capable of it deserves judgement, and it needs to be contradicted vigorously, or someone might get the idea that people are passively agreeing with your horrifying premise.

We are animals, but we, and many animals, do have morality. Apes, dogs, dolphins, whales, elephants, and probably a lot more that I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. Insects don't have morality.

Shoot us in the back? I thought we wanted to talk about things objectively while refraining from judgement, not pillory people for their opinions! I think you'd be right at home in the Spanish Inquisition. The pious attitude of some people is what's stunning to me, not the fact that some people agree with my point.


At the end of the day, human beings are animals, and animals don't have any inherent morality. What keeps us in line is our societies and legal systems.

 

[Wolf]

2. Not really. I'm not a female, but their attitude towards sex is much different than men's, in my opinion.

Oh, Christ...is this another "women don't really want sex as much as men but all men want it all the time, with any woman" thing?

 

[-Hari-]

This is a funny one, the obvious answer is no. But it's a bit vaguely worded. I have ticklish friends that never gave me specific consent who I've tickled for extended periods of time and I don't remember having any noticeable consequences so in a way yes.

You probably don't quite mean it that way but Yeh. It doesn't actually specify the situation

 

[shinsatou]

I wouldn't say the vast majority of humanity considers rape to be "one of the most despicable, inexcusable acts possible". Look at Africa and the Middle East, rape is a very common occurrence there and they consider it to be normal. Don't assume that the ideas of the modern western world apply to all of humanity.

I'm not personally advocating for rape in real life, I'm only saying that morality is subjective. Also, nobody in this thread is going out and harming anyone as far as I know, we're only discussing a hypothetical situation, so I don't see how telling us about how you would shoot our cocks off and kill us is necessary. Also, at the end of the day I'm not trying to talk about what is right or wrong, only what I believe most men would do, and trying to diffuse nonsense from the Morality Gestapo.

And explain to me how animals have morality?

 

[Wolf]

Weird, isn't it? The people who are okay with professing this: If you take a man that's full of testosterone and give him the place, equipment, and ability to do anything to a gorgeous woman he wants to with no repercussions of any kind, he will satisfy his sexual fantasies. Get their "life is hard, and morality is a social construct" panties all in a bunch when someone talks about hypothetically defending others from harm.
I guess something's only wrong if it's effecting them.

 

[Sensualswitch10]

We are animals, but we, and many animals, do have morality. Apes, dogs, dolphins, whales, elephants, and probably a lot more that I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. Insects don't have morality.

I just feel the need to point out that male dolphins are nature's rapists. That's how they breed. A group of males will lure an unsuspecting female away from the group and rape her. Look it up if you don't believe me.

And no, I'm not in any way condoning rape. Just pointing out a disturbing fact of nature.

 

[P[a]pi]

I would only do it to an evil chick. Maybe it would be rehabilitating lol.