Password Trader on the TMF - ALERT!

[tickler_n_black]

I just want to alert everyone about this person who's yahoo messenger is "Paul McGuire" ... his actual yahoo email is [email protected]

Don't do any trading with him you will be dissappointed for sure. This conversation below was sent to me by a close friend who tested him out to see if he was a scam artist or not. This is word for word their IM conversation.

I suggest the moderators find his IP address to his screen names and ban him from the TMF. He's not the kind of person we need around here. Just a suggestion. Website membership password trading is bad enough but people like him who don't even plan on giving the other person anything is even worse. Just wanted to warn you all to watch out for that name and that yahoo email address. He's bad news.



Dodger Dogg: I got TIB to boot you from the TMF for scamming people out of their tickling site passwords you fucker! HA HA HA

Paul McGuire: cool i got 5 other accounts on the TMF that I'll use rofl

Paul McGuire: those TMF mods can't stop me even if they tried

Dodger Dogg: cool, as soon as I see your other names on the TMF asking for trade partners, I'll have him nuke those too!

Dodger Dogg: you lieing piece of shit with no class or no morals. it must be a crappy existance continuously scamming people out of their clips and passwords

Paul McGuire: dont worry within 10 mins of me posting my email up at the TMF i get a good 5-6 pms of stupid ass people that i get passwords from. who cares if i never return anything to them. they're stupid for giving me passwords first, lol

Dodger Dogg: why do you cheat people out of trades? bad upbringing? where you taught at home to be a sleezebag? it's very uncool to give your word that you will trade with someone but demand they give first and then just disappear.

Paul McGuire: if i want to scam people to get myself free clips that's my business.

Paul McGuire: the TMF is a joke. a bunch of idiots. i only go there to steal passwords and clips.

Paul McGuire: like i said, they can't stop me. the mods there are clueless.

 

[tklcouple]

Nice exposee

TIB,

Nice job with the exposee you posted. This schmuck deserves to not only banned but prosecuted. for larceny and fraud. One needs be only so computer savy to take care of this kind of business.

Anyone caught exchanging with this schmuck also deserves to be banned as well as blacklisted by ticklingvideo producers. Perhaps a common "blacklist" need be acquired by these producers.

Fraud is a crime and NOBODY in this community should tolerate it.

BTW, if this smartass thinks the mods cannot keep him out; all I can say is "don't make them get nasty".

In no mood for bullshit,

Professor Tkl​

 

[RobAce]

Just a suggestion TIB, perhaps you should post this in the Vid Clips section as well as many members go there and nowhere else.
Id ask a MOD and see if they will make a sticky there with this thread. Oh and alert our friends at Tickle Theater also.

It sucks there are people out there that do this.

Rob

 

[tickler_n_black]

I don't think the mods will want to allow it in the video clips section. Hey wait! I'll include a video clip with it.

 

[asutickler]

Is it just me, or does Paul there talk like a gleeful, "Muahaha!" -type villian from a bad melodrama?
Right now he's probably saying "Curses!! Foiled again!"

 

[He-Man]

Is it just me, or does Paul there talk like a gleeful, "Muahaha!" -type villian from a bad melodrama?
Right now he's probably saying "Curses!! Foiled again!"

"And I would've gotten away with it, too, if it hadn't been for that meddling TIB!"

 

[Armpit_licker]

TIB, was it you or Dodger Dogg that decided to throw in the extra fake stuff that wasn't said?

How do I know this?

Because I AM that guy he talked too.....

Yes..... I made a dual account and tried to trade a password...... I made a post saying "I have the following passes" and looking for a new one......

I am guilty of this... I broke the rules... bann me, suspend me.. I don't care.... but when you blatantly lie and make it seem worse then it is then it a new story.

After I made that post I got a RANDOM PM from this "Dodger dogg" character.... He came TO ME asking what passes I had to offer. I told him and he said he had no passes to offer but he had plenty of full length clips from different companies. The two main ones being TIB's company and tickle central.

I choose 2 clips from tickle central for him to give me for 2 passes he chose. So yes, not only was I breaking the rules but so was he...

yet he comes to you acting like the innocent little angel who is "busting me"...

but busting me for what? the fact is he never sent me any clips... I have no clips from him in my email. He kept BS'ing and taking forever to send so I logged off.

I then get a PM from him today full of threats....

here is the REAL PM... not the fake one TIB provided. taken directly from my message archive.

"Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:18:54 PM): I got TIB to boot you from the TMF you fucker! HA HA HA
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:19:11 PM): cool i have another account.
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:19:20 PM): not to mention i can get him to boot u for trading passes
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:19:38 PM): cool, as soon as I see them on the TMF asking for trade partners, I'll have him nuke those too!
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:19:51 PM): you lieing piece of shit with no class or no morals
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:19:58 PM): ok
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:20:27 PM): why do you cheat people out of trades? bad upbringing?
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:20:53 PM): cheat people? lets see u gave me NOTHING
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:20:56 PM): u gave me NO clips
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:20:58 PM): NO passes
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:21:02 PM): yet i cheated u?
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:21:03 PM): dumbass
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:21:13 PM): a full on full length clip I gave you, and you logged off right after
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:21:26 PM): dumbfuck you know what you do. don't play stupid with me
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:21:28 PM): u gave me nothing. nothing is in my email dude...
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:21:59 PM): wait until my buddy in your area comes to visit you in person....
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:22:05 PM): i can't wait until he tells me about it
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:22:06 PM):
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:22:28 PM): you won't act so smart and tough at that moment when you're crying, haha
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:23:13 PM): ya because u can find someones home addy from there yahoo messenger screen name
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:23:14 PM): HAHAHAHAH
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:23:17 PM): u make me laugh
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:24:17 PM): dude I have two close friends working at Yahoo who can easily trace your IP address to where your computer is. and your internet service provider has your exact address. they can get it done, and will. I'm just waiting for them to get back to me.
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:24:38 PM): people like you need to be dealt with
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:24:44 PM): cool. and now i have this convo of you threatening me and i have 2 cops as uncles they will deal with this
greatone_63121 (4/24/2007 6:24:46 PM): have a nice day
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:24:50 PM): thats fine
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:24:54 PM): keep this convoe
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:25:00 PM): you'll be crying
Dodger Dogg (4/24/2007 6:25:06 PM): no matter what, LOL

So that is the REAL pm minus the fake stuff either TIB or DD decided to add on to make it seem worse then it was.

Whats worse? Trying to trade a password for a few clips or getting threatened in real life over a clip/pass?

you decide.

either way I was wrong in the first place and will request my IP to be banned amd accont closed from the TMF.

 

[Iluv2Btickled]

I'll just voice my opinions and questions here.

Yes trading passwords and scamming people is wrong. But is it also wrong to trade clips if both parties are actually trading? Like if no one was scamming, and both people actually traded clips only, is that wrong? I mean once you've paid for it, other than posting it online, when it comes to sharing w/ an individual, you can do what you want right? Maybe I dont understand the full rules of this, but I'm thinking that would be ok. That's like trading songs w/ a friend; "hey can I borrow your such-and-such cd and I'll let you see my whatever-the-hell cd?". That's what I'm thinking....just saying...

And as for the threatening, is all that really neccessary? Threatening to have some distant cousin who works for AT&T look up your IP address and everyone come to your house and then do what? Yell in person? Slap each other in the face with white gloves?

And having the cops go over the IM for threats...I mean I've heard of people doing that looking for pervs, or terrorist threats, but over some clips? I mean unless TIB is losing $1,000,000's of dollars, is it really THAT BIG of a deal? Isnt banning enough?

This seems like one of those things you shouldnt do when your angry..like spanking a child. Everybody cool off a bit and take a breath.


My two pennies.

 

[Ace Riley]

Trading clips is not against the rules I believe. I think the free distribution to the public and the selling of clips is however.

Trading them is however an issue, so is technically the selling of member passwords.

It's the same as buying DVD's. If you bought 5 DVD's of the movie Spiderman and gave them to your family or traded them for other movies to your friends you're in the right. Selling them publically, or putting them online for download is a different story.

There are loopholes to this, hence why you can sell your movies on Ebay, but not open a store and just start busting out copies of the film.

In this case this is digital media, so there is more red tape involved. However a clip that is bought and paid for, being traded by a clip that was bought and paid for by two individuals technically isn't illegal or immoral. The scamming is the major issue here I believe.

I think that's TiB's major concern is the scamming element, although I'm sure he's not happy about the concept of video trading, that's not his main concern here. If the trade would have been successful, he'd have no reason to post about this guy.

 

[Mr. Blue]

But is it also wrong to trade clips if both parties are actually trading? Like if no one was scamming, and both people actually traded clips only, is that wrong?

Actually, it's not borrowing...it's duplicating and to use a term that sounds terribly severe, it's piracy.

Let me give you an example. If you lend someone a book. That's more or less letting them borrow something. They're not going to make photocopies of the book, they borrow it, and return it you.

You trade a video clip, you've duplicated the clip...there's no longer 1 clip. That clip will get trader further, passed around, and soon you have a network of people that didn't pay for the clip in question.

The record industry has lost a good percentage of their profits and will continue to do so in the future because of this...granted they're such a large entity that it isn't going to be as immediately noticed.

Let's break it down to tickle clip producers...they're not rich, they can't afford to give away their product for free. Yes, I say product, as believe it or not, it does cost money, time, etc, to make these clips available to users. Also, since you've gotten something from the trade...you're technically accepting payment for the duplication.

There aren't that many producing tickle clips...as a community if you want to see more clips, models, scenarios, etc, etc, you have to support the efforts of the producers and not engage in piracy.

 

[CDFGA]

hmmmm

I also thought when I read the initial post, that it had to have been altered to an extent. Come on, TIB, we're not dumb, that was very obviously way way out there. You don't have to add all that other stuff to it to get an emotional response from the TMF members, or prove any point. Altering a message isn't rocket science, people have been doing that on instant messenger and such for a long time. You really overdid it, and it's obvious.

That aside, I agree, stealing is stealing, but trading isn't stealing. If I have something that is my property via purchase, I am not required to be a vendor or dealer to sell or trade or even give it away to someone else, as long as I'm not engaging in public distribution more than what I had purchased, or public display. You do not retain total proprietry rights to something when you sell it to someone else, unless you are really leasing clips and such out.

By the way, I have never bought anything from you, I just thought I'd point out the obvious.

 

[Mr. Blue]

That aside, I agree, stealing is stealing, but trading isn't stealing. If I have something that is my property via purchase, I am not required to be a vendor or dealer to sell or trade or even give it away to someone else, as long as I'm not engaging in public distribution more than what I had purchased, or public display. You do not retain total proprietry rights to something when you sell it to someone else, unless you are really leasing clips and such out.

Perhaps I've made an error with my understanding of video trading. I took it to mean someone buying a clip, downloading it from a website, and trading it with another person online while still maintaining a copy for themselves. (which would in fact be illegal).

However, if it is something else, oops...I made a bit of an error

 

[padrefan67]

Asking for people to be banned? On any evidence? Perhaps we should ask for others we don't like to be banned as well, or people who make us angry, or thse that make sense. Or maybe hypocrites.

It'd be a lonely board then...

 

[Ace Riley]

Asking for people to be banned? On any evidence? Perhaps we should ask for others we don't like to be banned as well, or people who make us angry, or thse that make sense. Or maybe hypocrites.

It'd be a lonely board then...

You should be banned for questioning the desire to ban.

I have evidence.

Asking for people to be banned? On any evidence? Perhaps we should ask for others we don't like to be banned as well, or people who make us angry, or thse that make sense. Or maybe hypocrites.

It'd be a lonely board then...

See? He questioned it and I don't think it's right. Enjoy your B@n! Muahaha!

 

[The Last Laugh]

That aside, I agree, stealing is stealing, but trading isn't stealing. If I have something that is my property via purchase, I am not required to be a vendor or dealer to sell or trade or even give it away to someone else, as long as I'm not engaging in public distribution more than what I had purchased, or public display. You do not retain total proprietry rights to something when you sell it to someone else, unless you are really leasing clips and such out.

I'm amazed and appalled that so many people seem to think that way. I thought it was obvious that, since clips need to be duplicated to be traded, such a practice is illegal. If we were talking about a physical product, like a DVD, then I would agree, as long as it were the original (not a copy) and the original owner didn't make a copy for him/herself. But a clip is a very different kind of product. I tell you, it's very scary to be a clip vendor when you realize how many people don't understand this concept or simply don't care. It makes you wonder if it's really worth it.

By the way, CDFGA, please don't ever buy clips from me. It would be too damaging to my little business. Thanks.

 

[Ace Riley]

I'm amazed and appalled that so many people seem to think that way. I thought it was obvious that, since clips need to be duplicated to be traded, such a practice is illegal. If we were talking about a physical product, like a DVD, then I would agree, as long as it were the original (not a copy) and the original owner didn't make a copy for him/herself. But a clip is a very different kind of product. I tell you, it's very scary to be a clip vendor when you realize how many people don't understand this concept or simply don't care. It makes you wonder if it's really worth it.

By the way, CDFGA, please don't ever buy clips from me. It would be too damaging to my little business. Thanks.

You're not exactly right. :3 It's more than possible for someone to be on the honor system when trading and deleting his films. It's possible for someone to make a copy of a DVD before selling his movie too.

You're entering into the realm of semantics. I'm paying money for something. I bought a music album and ripped it to my MP3 player. I don't want the disc anymore, so I give it to my Mom. Please arrest me?

Too many lines being blurred here, and to say you would rather he not order from you in order to not harm your business is assuming people who do this are instant pirates?

Should nobody should buy from you then, or buy any music. Fact of the matter is, most of us have committed digital piracy at one point or the other, and as long as we're not mass duplicating a product to such a degree that a net profit is lost by the maker then we're not committing much of a crime, even if we did, the punishment would be laughable.

Hell it wasn't even a concern until a few years back... shoot the law is still blurry.

Don't alienate your customers just because we use Windows and know what CTRL+C and CTRL+V does. Go after the the guys who put your full clips up for sale on their own Clips4sale the the name TheFirstLaugh or some dumb shit. Go after the guy FTPing your movies for free, the audacity.

Don't go after the guy who paid for your movie and is sharing it with a friend. Hell, that friend may have otherwise never heard of you, and never become a customer... now he's browsing your site for more.

Choose your targets, don't be the industry. I haven't bought a CD in about 6 years due to their ruffian tactics. Yet I'll pay money for indie cd's that are given for free on their website. Makes you think...

...or not, whatever.

 

[The Last Laugh]

You're not exactly right. :3 It's more than possible for someone to be on the honor system when trading and deleting his films.

True, but it's not exactly a reliable system, is it?

I'm paying money for something. I bought a music album and ripped it to my MP3 player. I don't want the disc anymore, so I give it to my Mom. Please arrest me?

In practice it would be silly, but yes, technically it's still illegal. If you don't understand that, than this conversation is pointless.

Too many lines being blurred here, and to say you would rather he not order from you in order to not harm your business is assuming people who do this are instant pirates?

I never said anything about people buying clips automatically being pirates. Were did you read that? Please don't put workds in my mouth.

The guy clearly believes that trading clips isn't illegal, when it in fact is. Why would I want his business when if I know that?

Should nobody should buy from you then, or buy any music. Fact of the matter is, most of us have committed digital piracy at one point or the other

Ah yes, the old "everybody does it" argument. Foolproof.

Hell it wasn't even a concern until a few years back

Just because the situation wasn't the same back then doesn't mean it's not an issue now.

Don't alienate your customers just because we use Windows and know what CTRL+C and CTRL+V does. Go after the the guys who put your full clips up for sale on their own Clips4sale the the name TheFirstLaugh or some dumb shit. Go after the guy FTPing your movies for free, the audacity.

Yeah, I'm sure I lost a lot of honest customers with my post.

Just because it's not practical to go after individual consumers who break the law doesn't make their actions right.

Don't go after the guy who paid for your movie and is sharing it with a friend. Hell, that friend may have otherwise never heard of you, and never become a customer... now he's browsing your site for more.

Sure he is. Why would he do that, since he has his good friend to give him the clips for free?

If people want to discover new producers and sample their work, that's what preview clips are for. I'm more than happy to see my previews shared for free. That's what they're for. It's the sharing of commercial clips that I disapprove of.

Choose your targets, don't be the industry.

I'm not trying to be the industry, I'm just explaining that, despite what some people clearly think, sharing commercial clips is illegal. You can't blame me for trying to protect my business.

 

[Mr. Blue]

http://www.safetyed.org/help/pirate.html

Scroll to the bottom it has some good info on what's exactly legal and illegal.

No matter where you fall on the issue though people should realize that there's just not that many people producing tickling clips...not when you compare it to other areas of "porn" where you'll always have tons of people shooting new content.

It's just a matter of supporting your local pervert with this one. We're not huge faceless corporations that can absorb the revenue lost by piracy (all forms) and if you really want to see a lot of fresh content produced you'll support our efforts.

If you have a friend that's really interested in a clip, point them to the sample clips this forum has, and give them an honest review of clips you saw whether they sucked or not (new forum section maybe), but let the producers see some benefit from the work they're doing. Heavily trading clips, passwords to sites, ftps, p2p sharing, etc will only hurt the ticklephiles ability to get new content.

So, people can have a cavalier attitude regarding this, but in the end they'll only end up hurting themselves by fewer people producing content. Again, we're not microsoft, sony, paramount, etc, most of us are "mom and pop" type producers with shoestring budgets.

I'm just hoping that the majority of the tickling community will support the producers and support the fetish they purportedly love.

 

[Ace Riley]

Not blaming you for watching your ass.

But I got Last Laugh Alpha for free while I was in Germany while on TT, the other forum.

I then proceeded to buy Gamma, Beta, and from you. Those I got on DVD while I was in Iraq the first time. I then bought some on clips like Upsilon and Tau.

If it was not having gotten Alpha, which even you have to admit was a rough copy since it was supposed to be an audition, I would have never bought from you.

We talk talk legalities all day, but yes, the everybody does it argument is, indeed, foolproof. We must accept it and at least look at the bright side to it. It's going to happen, and if one has a product worth buying, people will buy it. Your reputation is not something that is going to be sullied by avid traders.

Just because I can get an album for free doesn't mean I won't buy it. I haven't bought a CD in years, but I have purchased so much Itunes music it's disgusting. I understand your industry is smaller than that of music, and even one lost sale can hurt. However that one lost sale earned you at least 9 from me and plenty of good feedback and word of mouth.

Let's just look at things from a brighter perspective is all I'm saying. Lest you guys start suing 14 year old girls like the RIAA. :3

 

[The Last Laugh]

Not blaming you for watching your ass.

But I got Last Laugh Alpha for free while I was in Germany while on TT, the other forum.

I then proceeded to buy Gamma, Beta, and from you. Those I got on DVD while I was in Iraq the first time. I then bought some on clips like Upsilon and Tau.

If it was not having gotten Alpha, which even you have to admit was a rough copy since it was supposed to be an audition, I would have never bought from you.

While I don't think that the "rough copy" issue changes anything, as it's still a commercial product (though you're right, it's not exacftly the most polished of my videos, and it was my very first effort), I do appreciate your support and thank you for it.

Problem is, even though you are cool enough to buy stuff from a vendor if you like what he/she does, I'm afraid not everyone is like that.

We talk talk legalities all day, but yes, the everybody does it argument is, indeed, foolproof.

But it shouldn't be, and I don't think it should be used as a legitimate argument.

Your reputation is not something that is going to be sullied by avid traders.

No, but it can still hurt my business, and that of the other tickling producers, ultimately hurting the community as a whole.

Lest you guys start suing 14 year old girls like the RIAA. :3

That was indeed a silly thing to do, very embarrassing for the RIAA. I've no idea what possessed them to do something so stupid. Still, it doesn't mean it wasn't technically illegal. Just because going to the extremes the RIAA went is ridiculous overkill doesn't make song sharing right.

 

[Mr. Blue]

Problem is, even though you are cool enough to buy stuff from a vendor if you like what he/she does, I'm afraid not everyone is like that.

That's basically the point I was going to raise. I always appreciate people buying clips, joining the site, and helping us continue to produce as much tickle content as possible. Sometimes a freebie will prime the pump and get a person to buy more, but more often than not it won't spark that type of reaction.

Today I had the pleasure of spending money on a new security system to prevent password sharing...my old system wasn't great. However, I had that money earmarked for models and advertising on this forum. So, I mean you see how actions have consequences.

No producers wants to be a nazi about this...If it was all about making money we wouldn't be producing tickle content. I think as long as there's a sense of fair play and as long as the people of the tickling community supports our efforts that's all we really want.

 

[The Last Laugh]

http://www.safetyed.org/help/pirate.html

Scroll to the bottom it has some good info on what's exactly legal and illegal.

Thank you, Mr Blue! That's very informative. I also like the other things you said in this thread. I feel the same way you do.

"Support your local pervert", HAHAHAHAHA!!! Nice!

 

[tickler_n_black]

but trading isn't stealing. If I have something that is my property via purchase, I am not required to be a vendor or dealer to sell or trade or even give it away to someone else... You do not retain total proprietry rights to something when you sell it to someone else.

The following is on the first page (and every page) of any and all clips4sale stores. It is something that is agreed upon before a purchase is made. There is no "justifying" your way out of the clear rules at clips4sale. It is made absolutely clear with no gray areas.

Copyright © 2001 - 2005 Clips4sale.com All Rights Reserved. Clips4Sale does not own or produce any of the material sold on clips4sale.com All Rights Reserved. Unauthorized copying, sharing, distribution, reproduction, or any other use is a violation of applicable laws. All clips sold are to be viewed by the purchaser only and are not to be shared, traded or posted for others to download. Violators will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. There is to be no re-sale of any merchandise, videos, video clips, or pictures purchased from any Clips4sale.com site without written consent from Clips4sale.com All models on this site are 18 or older. Title 2257

 

[Ace Riley]

Holy crap, this thread won't die! O____O

It won't stop, it's coming right for us...aim at the head... the head!! It's gonna keep coming up with the same point over and over until it eats our brains. No matter how many times it's said!

Is it going to take silver bullets? Wooden stakes... Oh god, I'm out of rounds... he's right on us, nooo...get away from me! What are you...no...AAAH NOOO....!!!! Aaagrrh..grgl.........

 

[He-Man]

"Support your local pervert", HAHAHAHAHA!!! Nice!

That slogan needs to be made into a bumper sticker or t-shirt or something.