Would this be considered racist?

[RobAce]

I certainly am not hitting at you kis. I am merely making my observations and opinions. I choose to believe until proven that the person who did this is more likely an uninformed idiot than a racist. I think everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt until seen otherwise.

I know you have issues with racism, and your 100% correct in your views. You do not need my or anyone's validation on your feelings and life experiences. Much like the racism I have dealt with in my life, and continue to daily. Not to mention the way Hispanics are talked about all over the place.

We have been told a monkey image was merged with Obama's. If you want to piss off the majority of black Americans, combine the image of a monkey with a black man

Why does it have to be to piss off a majority of Black Americans. Why not say to piss off a majority of Americans. There are just as many non-Black people that are pissed about this as well. Why think or state its just to piss off blacks. Granted that may have been the intention, but the good thing about it is that everyone was pissed off about it, so it shows there is some progress...but yes there is a LONG way to go.

If it was a stupid attempt at being controversial; the "artist" is an idiot!

This is what I believe until it is proven that the person was racist or doing it with racist intentions. I try to give people I do not know the benefit of the doubt until given a reason not to think that way.

Wanna' know where the line is? Make a commentary based on someone's race and you'll find the line every time.

But what isn't a commentary on race? Make fun of education, your knocking the intelligence, make fun of his smile your spouting the old ways of happy dancing and silly stuff from the past. Make fun of his hand gestures and your saying that he is using some personal signals like gang-signs. Make fun of a decision, then we are saying that only because he is not white and a white would make a better decision. Walking, eating, reading, posture, anything that can be made fun of is a potential time bomb waiting for 1 person to read too much into it, and that is all it takes.

It seems even giving him a compliment is dangerous. A DJ in my area said "Damn, Obama knows more words than Noah Webster", and the company suspended him for 2 days after calls of him implying that he was shocked to see a Black man know big words and he was being racist, and that was why he made the joke, when in fact the DJ was black, a democrat and in fact campaigned here in Athens for him.

So, this is my fear. Someone that can not be made fun of, because if you do someone will see something you did not intend, and you will be branded because of it.

Rob

 

[Deadsea7777]

I have seen many pictures of President Bush pictured as chimpanzee. So I am not sure if it is that clear. I don't think we should automatically jump to the conclusion that it is racist. Now, it could be racist, but it depends on the author intentions. Is the Author portraying Obama as a monkey because he is black or is he portraying Obama as monkey because he personally believes that Obama is an idiot.

Actually maybe in the USA, it may be as you said, but brown monkey i.e., "mono marron" has in the whole of Latinamerica the meaning of inferior black or mestizo. A picture of a black person depicted as a monkey would convey the meaning that he or she is a brown monkey.

Maybe it was not racist, but as italians use to said "se non e vero e ben trovato" that is "if it is not true is a good guess". Is so borderline, that it applies that if smell like a rose, it has spines and red petals, is a good guess that it is a rose.

 

[Oni Dorei]

If anyones really interested this is where I found the picture. http://darthbane2007.deviantart.com/art/Obama-fused-with-Monkey-104546049

 

[kis123]

I certainly am not hitting at you kis. I am merely making my observations and opinions. I choose to believe until proven that the person who did this is more likely an uninformed idiot than a racist. I think everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt until seen otherwise.

I know you have issues with racism, and your 100% correct in your views. You do not need my or anyone's validation on your feelings and life experiences. Much like the racism I have dealt with in my life, and continue to daily. Not to mention the way Hispanics are talked about all over the place.

Why does it have to be to piss off a majority of Black Americans. Why not say to piss off a majority of Americans. There are just as many non-Black people that are pissed about this as well. Why think or state its just to piss off blacks. Granted that may have been the intention, but the good thing about it is that everyone was pissed off about it, so it shows there is some progress...but yes there is a LONG way to go.


This is what I believe until it is proven that the person was racist or doing it with racist intentions. I try to give people I do not know the benefit of the doubt until given a reason not to think that way.

But what isn't a commentary on race? Make fun of education, your knocking the intelligence, make fun of his smile your spouting the old ways of happy dancing and silly stuff from the past. Make fun of his hand gestures and your saying that he is using some personal signals like gang-signs. Make fun of a decision, then we are saying that only because he is not white and a white would make a better decision. Walking, eating, reading, posture, anything that can be made fun of is a potential time bomb waiting for 1 person to read too much into it, and that is all it takes.

It seems even giving him a compliment is dangerous. A DJ in my area said "Damn, Obama knows more words than Noah Webster", and the company suspended him for 2 days after calls of him implying that he was shocked to see a Black man know big words and he was being racist, and that was why he made the joke, when in fact the DJ was black, a democrat and in fact campaigned here in Athens for him.

So, this is my fear. Someone that can not be made fun of, because if you do someone will see something you did not intend, and you will be branded because of it.

Rob

A part of me agrees that society has gotten a little too oversensitive. I was one of the first who felt Don Imus shouldn't have lost his job over his "nappy-headed ho's" comment. Was it thoroughly distasteful? Certainly! Was it worth his job and livelihood? No-it takes a lot for me to want a person's job.

If anyone is going to make a public statement in today's PC society, they'd better be ready to take the hit. Unfortunately, that's not going to change; it'll probably get worse. But to take one of the universal symbols of racism and merge it with the image of a black man is begging for trouble. That monkey crap has been going on for decades! If Obama was in office already and made mistakes (like Bush did numerous times) then those who are defending this idiot I could better understand. But Obama hasn't been inaugurated yet and he's already having to clean up Bush's mess; I personally think he's done a fine job to this point. Wait for the man to mess up before the comics and critics start in on him. Anything else is just underhanded softball racist rhetoric to me.

At least you seek clarification and some common ground and not blow me off as unintelligent, or unenlightened like............never mind, people here can read for themselves.

 

[kis123]

Actually maybe in the USA, it may be as you said, but brown monkey i.e., "mono marron" has in the whole of Latinamerica the meaning of inferior black or mestizo. A picture of a black person depicted as a monkey would convey the meaning that he or she is a brown monkey.

Maybe it was not racist, but as italians use to said "se non e vero e ben trovato" that is "if it is not true is a good guess". Is so borderline, that it applies that if smell like a rose, it has spines and red petals, is a good guess that it is a rose.

Thank you!

Now that the photo has been found and posted, I want anyone to tell me that this wouldn't appear the least bit racist! Red.........hello.......where are you now?? I must be back on your ignore list....someone get Redmage back here! Need any more proof??

Btw, before this photo was discovered, I posed a small survey. I sent a few emails, and even talked to a couple of people in the grocery store about this post. Even got an opinion from my Asian (Chinese-American married to a Turkish national) tenant. Guess what came back? Best case scenario was that the so called artist was callous and thoughtless. Worst case scenario was that the so called artist was just perpetuating racism thinly veiled in a cloak of controversy.

Look at the photo; it's walking and quacking.......hard not to call it a duck at this point!

 

[Scouse]

Three cheers for the guy.
He has a two page thread on a website he's never heard of.

 

[Oni Dorei]

Three cheers for the guy.
He has a two page thread on a website he's never heard of.

Hehe yeah, but that's alright. Everythings jake.

 

[AffectionateDan]

That's a slippery slope, that one.

It just depends on the context in which the person who did the photo manipulation did it. I've seen the same thing done to George W. Bush, but nobody would bat an eye at that or consider it racist.

 

[TheTenaciousJ]

It just depends on the context in which the person who did the photo manipulation did it. I've seen the same thing done to George W. Bush, but nobody would bat an eye at that or consider it racist.

Because it's a racist term reserved for black people not white.

 

[BellaRisa]

It just depends on the context in which the person who did the photo manipulation did it. I've seen the same thing done to George W. Bush, but nobody would bat an eye at that or consider it racist.

Last I checked, no one enslaved Bush's ancestors for hundreds of years while comparing those people to monkeys and keeping them from freedom, the right to vote, calling them only 2/3rds of a man, etc. While I am NOT saying it's right, there are reasons why you're more likely to see brown people defended racially when monkeys are involved. The whole watermelon and fried chicken thing is annoying too, but that's another thread.

I honestly don't know whether the artist was being racist or not. I do know that it hurts and insults brown people to be compared to monkeys, and it's hurt us for centuries as anyone knows if they live in the world; so let's just not do it, 'k? Thanks

 

[Skipadeedoodah]

I have seen many pictures of President Bush pictured as chimpanzee. So I am not sure if it is that clear. I don't think we should automatically jump to the conclusion that it is racist. Now, it could be racist, but it depends on the author intentions. Is the Author portraying Obama as a monkey because he is black or is he portraying Obama as monkey because he personally believes that Obama is an idiot.

I agree. At first I was like, oh hell yeah it's racist...but pointing out that Bush was also compared to a monkey is a good point. It really does boil down to the intentions of whoever created it. I do think, however, that if the person was trying to convey that Obama is an idiot, using a monkey was definitely not the best choice if he wanted to avoid accusations of racism.

 

[Redmage]

Because it's a racist term reserved for black people not white.

True, that's the reason that this is even a question with regard to Obama. However the point remains that calling the President a monkey is not racist, no matter what color his skin is - unless it's done because of the color of his skin. And that still has not been established.

 

[Evil Dave]

Considering that someone somewhere always creates a picture of the current president depicted as a monkey it would mean that everyone was treating Obama differently if they didn't do it.

Surely it would be quite insulting to treat him differently because of the colour of his skin.

Just a thought.

 

[kis123]

Last I checked, no one enslaved Bush's ancestors for hundreds of years while comparing those people to monkeys and keeping them from freedom, the right to vote, calling them only 2/3rds of a man, etc. While I am NOT saying it's right, there are reasons why you're more likely to see brown people defended racially when monkeys are involved. The whole watermelon and fried chicken thing is annoying too, but that's another thread.

I honestly don't know whether the artist was being racist or not. I do know that it hurts and insults brown people to be compared to monkeys, and it's hurt us for centuries as anyone knows if they live in the world; so let's just not do it, 'k? Thanks

Well, at least no one's accusing you of knee-jerk emotionalism! Maybe if anyone other than me makes a statement, it won't get blown off!! Then again, I don't spend a lot of time caring about what others think about me; it is only cyberspace and I personally don't take things that seriously around here!

I appreciate your imput since it comes from another brown person who completely understands what the monkey reference means to blacks, African-americans, or whatever designation is chosen for the moment. I really don't care what the "artist's" intentions were; if you don't want the accusation, don't cross the line!

 

[BellaRisa]

Psst, Hey Kis...

Well, at least no one's accusing you of knee-jerk emotionalism!

The trick is to use less exclamation points, you seem less emotional that way

But seriously, I agree with you. Even if you don't have a racist bone in your body, if you know people may be hurt by something, why do it when you can express yourself in another way?

 

[badreligion]

It depends on what context the person who made the picture is using .

 

[kis123]

The trick is to use less exclamation points, you seem less emotional that way

*In the best Popeye voice I can muster*

I am what I am and that's all that I am!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Besides, I love my exclamation points!

But seriously, I agree with you. Even if you don't have a racist bone in your body, if you know people may be hurt by something, why do it when you can express yourself in another way?

Because sometimes people say and do stupid things in the name of being controversial, then wonder why they're getting blasted. Well, duh!

 

[Redmage]

But seriously, I agree with you. Even if you don't have a racist bone in your body, if you know people may be hurt by something, why do it when you can express yourself in another way?

Insensitivity. A common problem, unfortunately, but still a long way from racism.

 

[BellaRisa]

Insensitivity. A common problem, unfortunately, but still a long way from racism.

Yes, and I agree, my question was meant to be rhetorical .
A little common sense goes a long way. If one merely suspects something will be hurtful, even if your intentions are pure I say avoid that particular act and avoid undue sadness.

 

[Soda83pop]

Three cheers for the guy.
He has a two page thread on a website he's never heard of.

Im only mad I didnt get to say it first...and you arent even counting the number of hits he is getting from it.

 

[General Zod]

The next four years will be interesting for people who love to make fun of any president

 

[Artoo]

Hm...I'd consider the picture to be insensitive at the very least. The artist even said about the photoshop, "and no, I'm not a racist."

This begs the question, why did he do the photoshop? If we can take him at his word, then perhaps it's much in the same vein as previous president/monkey mashups. But considering Obama hasn't even entered office yet, I'd say it's a little presumptious.

If we can't take the artist at his word, he might just be spewing rhetoric ala "I'm not a racist. but..."

Those are the choices. Unfortunately, both are plausible, so we may never know.

 

[Redmage]

This begs the question, why did he do the photoshop? If we can take him at his word, then perhaps it's much in the same vein as previous president/monkey mashups. But considering Obama hasn't even entered office yet, I'd say it's a little presumptious.

Why? In that case it's simply a statement of the author's opinions about how Obama WILL do in office. We all registered similar opinions when we voted for him or against him last month, and that wasn't presumptuous.

 

[TheTenaciousJ]

If anyone reads the posts from the one who created the picture they will see the guy also said "He does look like a monkey."

 

[Redmage]

If anyone reads the posts from the one who created the picture they will see the guy also said "He does look like a monkey."

So does Dick Cheney.