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Armageddon Was By Far The Worst Of This Year!
- Thread starter Krazy
- Start date
Further proof...
That Vince couldn't give two shits in an outhouse about using talent, unless it's homegrown, as in he made them stars, not ECW or WCW...
Triple Growth Hormone has the belt again, and it sickens me, as Goldberg was at least over...
Ah, well....let's all sit back and watch the ratings plummet even further....
GrandMaster Laz
That Vince couldn't give two shits in an outhouse about using talent, unless it's homegrown, as in he made them stars, not ECW or WCW...
Triple Growth Hormone has the belt again, and it sickens me, as Goldberg was at least over...
Ah, well....let's all sit back and watch the ratings plummet even further....
GrandMaster Laz
rajee
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😀 I believe it was scripted this way so the fans would be more interested in watching the next day's Raw to see if Mick Foley will fix the situation by giving the Dudley's a Table match, giving Rob Van Dam a Ladder or a TLC match and setting up a huge match for the Royal Rumble. Plus, Kane and Goldberg might have a no DQ contenders match on Raw. The script writers have to keep you passionate about WWE, so they get you angry at a PPV. 😀
TklDuo-Ann
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I agree. It stunk! Triple H no longer deserves a belt...any belt. He's not in shape (They should rename him Triple X if it wasn't already taken.), doesn't sell moves any more and doesn't seem to care about being there. Some of the other guys are just as bad. If I were Vince, the only ones to get air time would be those who earn it. That's how it used to be. Keeping prima donnas around becuase they're family or have some pull with someone doesn't draw a crowd. A good show does.
Rajee may be partially right in his expectations. But, frankly, I don't think we'll see much change. Pitty!
Ann
Rajee may be partially right in his expectations. But, frankly, I don't think we'll see much change. Pitty!
Ann
HOLLYWOOD
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I do not know if the problem is just vince himself. I do not watch raw much but i swear i am watching a bad edition of nitro most of the time. I like that there are so many wrestlers but they do not do nothing. I mean they got all these hot women. give them ecw style hardcore matches and people will watch. You got the dudleys and everytime they get hardcore they get beat. Also where are the submission matches like valentien and garvil had at rumble a few years ago?
The other thing that is wrong is that people are comparing now to the time when stone cold made it big. When wrestling was big i nthe 80's i would go to the historic spectrum and unless hogan was there the place was half empty. The funny thing was it was still considered a big success. I think people were satisfied with this and haivng the wwf come aorund every month. then when stone cold got big and cable was finally in every home, things changed. suddenly you sold out arenas. it was cool to wear wrestling shit in public. in my day you walk around with a hulk rules and you were crusing for a brusing. wrestling got so big that it had to come down a little. Now instead of looking at everything, people compare today to that one spec of time when the poularity soared. if you compare it to early 90's or 70's or even 60's wrestling is much better today. however when you consider it only against its pinnacle then everything looks bleak.
Now if vince wants to fix things so to speak, i say get rid of bischoff. I also think they need to have more technical matches that go the distance. Scott Steiner is a great grappler. Why not have steiner and flair, or steiner and beniot in a match that goes 30 or 40 minutes and has no cheating or interference. I also tihnk the hardcore got to be ecw style. When holly and snow battled all over arena it was cool. even road dogg on drugs in the back battling guysd was cool, but now there is no real hardcore violence. another thing is cut down on brock. he is a great athlete, but i do not need to see him constantly.
I would also increase the women's divison to make it more competitive and have much more women in it. also vince needs to finds a guy who is ready to be a star. Cena is getting there but Vince needs to create the next hollywood hulk hogan now to bring ratings and attention back to the 1998 and 1999 levels that everyone compares it to. The last thing i would do is cut out some pay per views. by having so many, they lose there speciality. If you go back to the main four or five then it means something grand again.
That just my thoughts. What are yours?
The other thing that is wrong is that people are comparing now to the time when stone cold made it big. When wrestling was big i nthe 80's i would go to the historic spectrum and unless hogan was there the place was half empty. The funny thing was it was still considered a big success. I think people were satisfied with this and haivng the wwf come aorund every month. then when stone cold got big and cable was finally in every home, things changed. suddenly you sold out arenas. it was cool to wear wrestling shit in public. in my day you walk around with a hulk rules and you were crusing for a brusing. wrestling got so big that it had to come down a little. Now instead of looking at everything, people compare today to that one spec of time when the poularity soared. if you compare it to early 90's or 70's or even 60's wrestling is much better today. however when you consider it only against its pinnacle then everything looks bleak.
Now if vince wants to fix things so to speak, i say get rid of bischoff. I also think they need to have more technical matches that go the distance. Scott Steiner is a great grappler. Why not have steiner and flair, or steiner and beniot in a match that goes 30 or 40 minutes and has no cheating or interference. I also tihnk the hardcore got to be ecw style. When holly and snow battled all over arena it was cool. even road dogg on drugs in the back battling guysd was cool, but now there is no real hardcore violence. another thing is cut down on brock. he is a great athlete, but i do not need to see him constantly.
I would also increase the women's divison to make it more competitive and have much more women in it. also vince needs to finds a guy who is ready to be a star. Cena is getting there but Vince needs to create the next hollywood hulk hogan now to bring ratings and attention back to the 1998 and 1999 levels that everyone compares it to. The last thing i would do is cut out some pay per views. by having so many, they lose there speciality. If you go back to the main four or five then it means something grand again.
That just my thoughts. What are yours?
Admiral Trouser
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Huh? HUH!?! Whe're my freaks at!?!
Aaaah, Steiner, he's the man. A broken man mind you, he's raken a battering during the course of his career and he's not getting any younger, so I dont think he should be allowed any "prime-time" events, certainly not against the likes of Benoit, who MUST win the title soon, because god knows he's worked hard for it.
Anyway, can't comment on Arm, since us Brits were somehow denied access to it by Sky. Not sure why, might have had something to do with the Boxing match that was going down at the same time. Anyway, I figured it was going to suck, on the account that Tripple H was present. Go figure. RVD lost? Damn. Another guy who deserves more than he gets.
On a happier note, all is well in Raw....we have the Rock and Sock connection re-astablished, so much humour to come methinks 🙂
Btw, Bigshow needs to change proffession from wrestler to stand-up, that rap-war with Ciener (ack, sp) was hilarious 😀
Aaah, the joys of make-beleive Gladiator...
AT
Aaaah, Steiner, he's the man. A broken man mind you, he's raken a battering during the course of his career and he's not getting any younger, so I dont think he should be allowed any "prime-time" events, certainly not against the likes of Benoit, who MUST win the title soon, because god knows he's worked hard for it.
Anyway, can't comment on Arm, since us Brits were somehow denied access to it by Sky. Not sure why, might have had something to do with the Boxing match that was going down at the same time. Anyway, I figured it was going to suck, on the account that Tripple H was present. Go figure. RVD lost? Damn. Another guy who deserves more than he gets.
On a happier note, all is well in Raw....we have the Rock and Sock connection re-astablished, so much humour to come methinks 🙂
Btw, Bigshow needs to change proffession from wrestler to stand-up, that rap-war with Ciener (ack, sp) was hilarious 😀
Aaah, the joys of make-beleive Gladiator...
AT
natural tickler
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Yeah, I agree, Armageddon was terrible. However, and Lazarus can attest to this, wrestling renovates itself over and over. The good thing is, Royal Rumble is only a month away, and they will have fixed it by then. HHH wont have the belt long, I promise you that. What you guys fail to understand, and Laz you can chime in too, it takes time to develop a good storyline. It takes patience to get it just right. You forget: In 1995-97 WWE had a down period then too, until 98 when it went through the roof. Give it time. Yeah, I hate HHH with the belt too, but whatcha gonna do. Remember, the RAW after a pay-per-view is really good, so wait and see😀
I heard a rumor that Evolution is going to turn on HHH cuz like maby austin will return or someting, and they will all have to defend there titles EVERY member of Evolution will retain but HHH and they become all like: We dont need you anymore HHH, perhaps theyll cost HHH the title on acident then from there it will lead to chaos. But yea I don't see HHH with another long title streak he has movies to film I belive.
TklDuo-Drew
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I also thought "Armageddon" stunk, as well. The only thing that was entertaining was J.R. and The King's bantering back and forth.
There's no way that Ric Flair and Bastista are going to be an active tag team. Shawn Micheals had a good match, It didn't look like Booker T. was even into his match, unless he was under the weather.
And we really didn't need to see Triple Cheese....oops..I mean Hippo Hearst Hemsley regain the championship belt. But I guess you get what you want when you're the boss' son-in-law.
Actually I thought Kane was very impressive last night, in his moves and facial expressions, which were priceless at some points.
All in all, a very lackluster PPV, and for you folks who missed it, not to worry, they're going to rehash a couple of last nights matches on RAW tonight.
Drew
There's no way that Ric Flair and Bastista are going to be an active tag team. Shawn Micheals had a good match, It didn't look like Booker T. was even into his match, unless he was under the weather.
And we really didn't need to see Triple Cheese....oops..I mean Hippo Hearst Hemsley regain the championship belt. But I guess you get what you want when you're the boss' son-in-law.
Actually I thought Kane was very impressive last night, in his moves and facial expressions, which were priceless at some points.
All in all, a very lackluster PPV, and for you folks who missed it, not to worry, they're going to rehash a couple of last nights matches on RAW tonight.
Drew
TklDuo-Drew
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The next live RAW will be Dec. 29th from San Antonio, Texas. Maybe Austin will show up then. If not, I think we're about to enter "The McMahon-Helmsly era" part 2., only this time with Bishoff.
Drew
Drew
Admiral Trouser
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Tron's probably right about Steiner, for all of his amusement factor, he's never looked, well...natural. It wouldn't surprise me if those muscles weren't gained solely through all of those push-ups he does in the ring...
btw, he has a brother?? Didn't know this Tron...cheers 🙂
AT
btw, he has a brother?? Didn't know this Tron...cheers 🙂
AT
Yes, Scott Steiner has a brother. Rick Steiner. They were a tag team for YEARS in both main federations, as well as some of the smaller ones.
I have no doubt in my mind that Scott developed his unnaturally freakish physique through the aid of steroids. Someone would have to be awfully foolish not to believe that. Rick, however, I would not be so quick to accuse. Rick was never overly muscular. Just 'beefy'. He is now retired, though.
I was equally shocked and disappointed by the Foley angle they took last night, Krazy. I can not for the life of me imagine where the hell they are going with it. That was so uncharacteristically Foley last night. A truly stupid move on the writers part, IMO.
I just hope they can get all these god-awful screw-ups and let downs over the past few days squared away and righted once more. Just when I was finally starting to gain some respect back for WWE again, they go and pull all this B.S. I'm beginning to wonder if they've dug themselves a hole so deep, that they don't know how to get back out of it.
Mimi
I have no doubt in my mind that Scott developed his unnaturally freakish physique through the aid of steroids. Someone would have to be awfully foolish not to believe that. Rick, however, I would not be so quick to accuse. Rick was never overly muscular. Just 'beefy'. He is now retired, though.
I was equally shocked and disappointed by the Foley angle they took last night, Krazy. I can not for the life of me imagine where the hell they are going with it. That was so uncharacteristically Foley last night. A truly stupid move on the writers part, IMO.
I just hope they can get all these god-awful screw-ups and let downs over the past few days squared away and righted once more. Just when I was finally starting to gain some respect back for WWE again, they go and pull all this B.S. I'm beginning to wonder if they've dug themselves a hole so deep, that they don't know how to get back out of it.
Mimi
Celtic_Emperor
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I didn't see the PPV, but I am aware of the results. From what others tell me it wasn't as good as it could have been.
I would have wanted Kane to get the title, but it makes sense for Triple H to regain it. We all have to realize the WWE makes it scripts probably months in advance, and only make last minute changes if something unforseen happens.
I agree with rajee 100% They want us to be angry, so much so that when they make things right we will rejoice.
What does worry me as was mentioned in the later half of this thread is that Foley lost his nerve before his match last night on Raw, was spooked, was afraid, or whatever you want to call it, and he up and left the arena without saying a word and even allowed Orton to spit in his face and call him a coward as he walked out.
We all know Mick Foley. Whether he was Dude Love, Cactus Jack or Mankind. Both as a wrestler and even a a Co-GM, etc., he has never backed down from anyone or anything for any reason unless he was forced to or had no control over the situation.
The plot, however they are going with it, wants us to believe that hes having second thoughts about his life and/or profession. If this were completely real, Mick would have every reason to be scared or have second thoughts. The crowd was roaring for him, Orton was giving him the gaze of death, and it was all very much a mind game at that point for him. He probably would have lost that match, but only because hes 'out of shape' and hasn't wrestled in 4 years. The truth is though hes in better shape then he was last time we saw him, and hes lost a good ammount of wait and looks more fit then perhaps he was when last he wrestled.
I feel if anything, they left us hanging with him just leaving like that because perhaps they hadn't really figured out whether he should win or not. They probably just let it to be ambiguous, so we would debate whether or not hes gone or what the deal is. Theres no reason to believe this is the last we've seen of Mick Foley in any capacity. Last night was planned out, we just don't know where they are going with it.
I will offer my own opinion of RAW though. For the past couple of weeks I've actually been finding it more entertaining then Smackdown. Usually I favor Smackdown over Raw, but Smackdown has just been a bit boring the last couple of weeks. I hope both shows pick up the pace and start giving more of what the fans want. If anything, the fans want to see enemies face eachother. I really don't think winning a title is all that important, so much as the match was. And by not giving titles to the deserving people it pumps you up with frustration. They know how to push our buttons, and they're pushing them good.
PS: I like Triple H. Its true hes not trying nearly as hard as he should, and his performances are starting to fluctuate. If anything though, I like his presense. He has a strong presense whether hes alone or with others. The fact that hes one of the main antagonists makes him well established as a heel. I feel we needed to see Evolution with all the gold. I just hope it doesn't stay that way. The heels have to win more than the faces do, except when it counts and matters. Triple H won't have that belt for long. If Foley truely isn't gone in his capacity as an 'outside consultant' then I think we'll see that title match between Shawn and Hunter. I think HBK will win. He was very dominant in last night's match, and I think they may be going somewhere with this HBK vs Triple H thing, whether Foley is there or not.
If Triple H losses and HBK is the champion, Bishoff will probably punish HBK by putting him against Kane for the title because Kane will demand it, and Triple H will be too intimidated to really argue about it (much like he was a few weeks ago during that scene with Bishoff where Kane was standing right up against him from behind.) Kane may or may not win, or there may be some interference on Triple H's part.
As far as Kane goes, I don't think they did the whole 'unmasking' and 'unleashing the monster' thing for nothing. JR was right last night. Kane may very well be the champion soon.
This is of course just an idea.
I would have wanted Kane to get the title, but it makes sense for Triple H to regain it. We all have to realize the WWE makes it scripts probably months in advance, and only make last minute changes if something unforseen happens.
I agree with rajee 100% They want us to be angry, so much so that when they make things right we will rejoice.
What does worry me as was mentioned in the later half of this thread is that Foley lost his nerve before his match last night on Raw, was spooked, was afraid, or whatever you want to call it, and he up and left the arena without saying a word and even allowed Orton to spit in his face and call him a coward as he walked out.
We all know Mick Foley. Whether he was Dude Love, Cactus Jack or Mankind. Both as a wrestler and even a a Co-GM, etc., he has never backed down from anyone or anything for any reason unless he was forced to or had no control over the situation.
The plot, however they are going with it, wants us to believe that hes having second thoughts about his life and/or profession. If this were completely real, Mick would have every reason to be scared or have second thoughts. The crowd was roaring for him, Orton was giving him the gaze of death, and it was all very much a mind game at that point for him. He probably would have lost that match, but only because hes 'out of shape' and hasn't wrestled in 4 years. The truth is though hes in better shape then he was last time we saw him, and hes lost a good ammount of wait and looks more fit then perhaps he was when last he wrestled.
I feel if anything, they left us hanging with him just leaving like that because perhaps they hadn't really figured out whether he should win or not. They probably just let it to be ambiguous, so we would debate whether or not hes gone or what the deal is. Theres no reason to believe this is the last we've seen of Mick Foley in any capacity. Last night was planned out, we just don't know where they are going with it.
I will offer my own opinion of RAW though. For the past couple of weeks I've actually been finding it more entertaining then Smackdown. Usually I favor Smackdown over Raw, but Smackdown has just been a bit boring the last couple of weeks. I hope both shows pick up the pace and start giving more of what the fans want. If anything, the fans want to see enemies face eachother. I really don't think winning a title is all that important, so much as the match was. And by not giving titles to the deserving people it pumps you up with frustration. They know how to push our buttons, and they're pushing them good.
PS: I like Triple H. Its true hes not trying nearly as hard as he should, and his performances are starting to fluctuate. If anything though, I like his presense. He has a strong presense whether hes alone or with others. The fact that hes one of the main antagonists makes him well established as a heel. I feel we needed to see Evolution with all the gold. I just hope it doesn't stay that way. The heels have to win more than the faces do, except when it counts and matters. Triple H won't have that belt for long. If Foley truely isn't gone in his capacity as an 'outside consultant' then I think we'll see that title match between Shawn and Hunter. I think HBK will win. He was very dominant in last night's match, and I think they may be going somewhere with this HBK vs Triple H thing, whether Foley is there or not.
If Triple H losses and HBK is the champion, Bishoff will probably punish HBK by putting him against Kane for the title because Kane will demand it, and Triple H will be too intimidated to really argue about it (much like he was a few weeks ago during that scene with Bishoff where Kane was standing right up against him from behind.) Kane may or may not win, or there may be some interference on Triple H's part.
As far as Kane goes, I don't think they did the whole 'unmasking' and 'unleashing the monster' thing for nothing. JR was right last night. Kane may very well be the champion soon.
This is of course just an idea.
Shem the Penman
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Not really surprised by the results of Armageddon, although it was sloppy as hell for them to add a couple matches to the card at the last minute. Not that the promise of Maven vs. Matt Hardy and Ivory vs. Molly would have sent me running to order the show, but...
It's disappointing for RVD to lose the belt to Randy Orton, but it's not surprising given that RVD's probably gone in 2004 and Orton is getting the big push nowadays.
I'm a Foley mark, but I'm willing to see where they go with the angle before I decide what I think of it. Obviously, the writers wanted it to be shocking and disturbing; the question is, how well can they follow up on it?
It's disappointing for RVD to lose the belt to Randy Orton, but it's not surprising given that RVD's probably gone in 2004 and Orton is getting the big push nowadays.
I'm a Foley mark, but I'm willing to see where they go with the angle before I decide what I think of it. Obviously, the writers wanted it to be shocking and disturbing; the question is, how well can they follow up on it?
The reason the UK didn't get the pay per view was because it was one of the 4 that we have to pay for, and Sky and WWE couldn't come to an agreement over money.
We will still get the other 8 free PPV's for now, but that contract expires in 2005 I think.
But never mind. At least we'll soon have 'The Wrestling Channel' where we can watch NWA-TNA, ROH, FWA, Pro Wrestling NOAH, Irish Whip Wrestling, Combat Zone Wrestling and others.
Yippee. 🙂
We will still get the other 8 free PPV's for now, but that contract expires in 2005 I think.
But never mind. At least we'll soon have 'The Wrestling Channel' where we can watch NWA-TNA, ROH, FWA, Pro Wrestling NOAH, Irish Whip Wrestling, Combat Zone Wrestling and others.
Yippee. 🙂
Celtic_Emperor
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I also forgot to mention another reason Raw has seemed more appealing to me lately then Smackdown is because of good old JR. ^__^
I like the way he gets all worked up when good or bad things happen to the wrestlers. Last night was funny when he was disgusted with the things that happened or when he gave his opinions.
I like the way he gets all worked up when good or bad things happen to the wrestlers. Last night was funny when he was disgusted with the things that happened or when he gave his opinions.
