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How racist are you?

wendynpeter said:
SOME african americans. And yes, I do. But what I'm saying is the truth. I can't help it if the truth is bothersome.



What can I say except that I believe Mel Gisbson is an anti-semite and that Michael Richards is not a racist? That's what I believe. I've said a hundred times it's my opinion.


Where's your truth wendy? You don't even know who we are; you gather your information from the media and races who are socially messed up and hate us because we live better than they do and they know it. But you gravitate to those people because they feed into your psyche; they justify your thought processes and give you what you think is fuel to prove your bigotry-laden statements are true.

I'll stand toe-to-toe with any Jamaican and African and remind them of their history. They're pretty much jealous of American Blacks; besides, some of their ancestors sold us over here. I'd be pretty upset too if I had to live with such. Besides, they'll tell you whatever you want to hear so they can maintain their jobs.

When Mr Richards talks about being hung upside down with a fork in their a**, that's about the most racist and bigoted statement I've heard in about 30 years! Keep defending him wendy, he needs racially-blinded people like you in his corner so he can stand a stab at a career someday.
 
kis123 said:
My goodness; this is beginning to become pathetic!

Gibson was drunk enough to tell how he felt about a group of people. Does it make him racist? I don't think so, but you do.

Right. He's an anti-semite.

Michael Richards was COLD STONE SOBER when he screamed racial obsenities out of his sick mouth and you defend him as not being a racist?

Right. I don't think attacking one rude bastard in a club is evidence that someone thinks all white people are superior to all black people, even if he did call him a racial name. I don't believe doing that de facto MKAES you a racist. That's my opinion. Next.

You have one helluva way of rationalizing behavior don't you? Or do you wish it was you on that stage screaming how you really feel about blacks? Is that why you practically idolize the man wendy?[/quote

Gimme a fucking break already. I don't idolize Michael Richards. I just don't believe he's a racist.

Is that why you protect him and give him the benefit of no-doubt (that is to everyone else who saw the tape)?

I saw the tape also. He went after that guy. He called him a racial name.

Let's talk about some of those facts you claim I don't have straight. The Civil Rights Act is a CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT-tell me when you get the right to voluntarily disobey an amendment? Corporations have to obey the law plain and simple. If they don't the offended can seek legal counsel and publicly bring the company to its knees!

You have no idea what you're talking about. Affirmative action is not part of the Civil Rights Act. THERE IS NO LAW REQUIRING AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. Affirmative action is a practice designed to meet the corrective requirements of some laws. The Civil Rights Act(s) are not constitutional amendments. They are laws. There are constitutional amendments that deal with discrimination based on race as well. The Civil Rights Acts and the Voting Rights Act were laws enacted to enforce the constitution. Please learn your history.
 
wendynpeter said:
I'm not the least bit racist. Call me an elitist if my having expectations that all people should act like decent human beings bothers you.



Jesus. One more time. Affirmative Action is NOT a law. And I have absolutely not said anything negative about the civil rights acts. Yes, acts. There was more than one. Just so's you know. I wish I didn't have to teach you civil rights law in order to have this discussion...




I care about your civil rights under the law as well. I care about EVERYone's civil rights under the law.



THAT's hardly true.

Give me another friggin' break!

You could NEVER teach me civil rights law when I've lived it-it's a luxury for people like you. You can't teach me anything except the fact that you're basically a closet bigot who's finally come out.

Don't tell me about my civil rights, you've never had to experience your RIGHTS being violated and you never will. You can tell me nothing about such at all.

All you can do is spew rhetoric, play point-and-counterpoint and hope I'll let it go. That would give you some sort of sick victory. Don't hold your breath because I know what I've had to endure for decades. I know what my son and daughter have to endure today. You can't erase that away wendy; racism is alive and well in this country and it has no intention of dying out. Attempting to minimize my intelligence isn't going to work. I don't need people like you to define me; all I need is a job-I don't need anything else. I don't define myself through my job so it someone like you takes it from me it only means that better is waiting for me; I don't go postal over it!

This is turning into a really pitiful word exchange; I give you facts and intelligent dialogue and you spew venom and continue to put my folks down. Can you identify one non-celebrity black american person that you have respect for wendy? Hello? Wendy? Are you still there???
 
wendynpeter said:
Right. He's an anti-semite.



Right. I don't think attacking one rude bastard in a club is evidence that someone thinks all white people are superior to all black people, even if he did call him a racial name. I don't believe doing that de facto MKAES you a racist. That's my opinion. Next.

You have one helluva way of rationalizing behavior don't you? Or do you wish it was you on that stage screaming how you really feel about blacks? Is that why you practically idolize the man wendy?[/quote

Gimme a fucking break already. I don't idolize Michael Richards. I just don't believe he's a racist.



I saw the tape also. He went after that guy. He called him a racial name.



You have no idea what you're talking about. Affirmative action is not part of the Civil Rights Act. THERE IS NO LAW REQUIRING AFFIRMATIVE ACTION. Affirmative action is a practice designed to meet the corrective requirements of some laws. The Civil Rights Act(s) are not constitutional amendments. They are laws. There are constitutional amendments that deal with discrimination based on race as well. The Civil Rights Acts and the Voting Rights Act were laws enacted to enforce the constitution. Please learn your history.


You can't get around the Constitution, plain and simple. You cannot discriminate over race wendy, the laws of the land protect from such. I well know my history and yours-it was shoved down my throat as a kid. How wouldn't I know your history? If you racially discrimate, you receive penalties under the law. As far as Affimative action is concerned, all someone has to do is tap into it. If the company doesn't comply there's this organization called EEOC who presides over these disputes. Yes, they can make corporations clean up their act wendy, whether you like it or not. You can voluntarily discrimate if you want to, but there are organizations in place that can put a serious bite in your behind if you do!

You're the one who hopes I don't know my history. You're the one who hopes I don't remember Little Big Horn , the Sioux, John Brown and others who fought for racial equality and a piece of respect. Guess what? I remember it all-you're the one who is seriously lacking and you've been hoping that I've been made to forget too. It ain't happenin in this lifetime!

There's no way around it wendy; either corporations comply with racial equity or there will be hell to pay for it. I guess you'll just have to get over it-then again it's you and you'll never get over it will you?

And btw, Richards is a total racist-even white people say so. He didn't attack a rude man in a club-he brought back racial problems that were about 50 years old. He didn't have to do that under ANY circumstances. I'm glad they caught him on tape-he'll never be able to lie his way out of it.
 
here in the uk things are far too pc now. This i believe is making more people intolerant of other races

as for myself, i wouldn't say i'm racist as i have always thought racists hate people because of their colour/religion and what not

i will however tell racial jokes and laugh at them. As long as things are not said in spite and people can laugh with each other not at someone, everything is hunky dory
 
I had a boss once tell me:

"It's hard for me to be a racist, because I hate everyone!"
 
wendynpeter said:
SOME african americans. And yes, I do. But what I'm saying is the truth. I can't help it if the truth is bothersome.



What can I say except that I believe Mel Gisbson is an anti-semite and that Michael Richards is not a racist? That's what I believe. I've said a hundred times it's my opinion.

Wendy is actually right....he can't help it, and "his truth" is bothersome....

But see, folks, you just have to understand "wendys language" to understand him....if you can wade past the inconsistencies....

And you have to "suspend reality" a little bit.....

See, wendy would have you believe, that HE actually believes, that when mr "non racist" Michael Richards screamed,

"He's a NIGGER!!!, He's a NIGGER!!!
Fifty years ago they would have shoved a pitchfork up his ass"

That Richards was OF COURSE "not" referring to what he believed would and should have happened to "ALL" uppity smart mouthed niggers" fifty years ago.......OF COURSE NOT.....

Wendy "believes" (and would have us ALL believe) that "poor, misunderstood" Michael Richards was "ONLY" referring to that ONE "uppity nigger" in the comedy club that night....

So wendy's "compassionately" willing to give poor, misunderstood Michael Richards the benefit of the doubt, and "think he's not racist"....

Shouldn't we ALL be so "compassionate" to the obviously "misunderstood" Richards?....I mean, for goodness sakes, wendy says the black guy in the club WAS a "rude bastard", after all....... :illogical

You gotta change clothes, wendy.....

You're smug, but you're not stupid, and neither are we......

And that "cloak of naievity" fits you worse than your "cloak of superiority"......
 
The Origins of Affirmative Action
by Marquita Sykes

Affirmative action, the set of public policies and initiatives designed to help eliminate past and present discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin, is under attack.

· Originally, civil rights programs were enacted to help African Americans become full citizens of the United States. The Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution made slavery illegal; the Fourteenth Amendment guarantees equal protection under the law; the Fifteenth Amendment forbids racial discrimination in access to voting. The 1866 Civil Rights Act guarantees every citizen "the same right to make and enforce contracts ... as is enjoyed by white citizens ... "

· In 1896, the Supreme Court's decision in Plessy v. Ferguson upheld a "separate, but equal" doctrine that proved to be anything but equal for African Americans. The decision marked the end of the post-Civil War reconstruction era as Jim Crow laws spread across the South.

· In 1941, President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed Executive Order 8802 which outlawed segregationist hiring policies by defense-related industries which held federal contracts. Roosevelt's signing of this order was a direct result of efforts by Black trade union leader, A. Philip Randolph.

· During 1953 President Harry S. Truman's Committee on Government Contract Compliance urged the Bureau of Employment Security "to act positively and affirmatively to implement the policy of nondiscrimination . . . ."

· The 1954 Supreme Court decision in Brown v. Board of Education overturned Plessy v. Ferguson.

· The actual phrase "affirmative action" was first used in President Lyndon Johnson's 1965 Executive Order 11246 which requires federal contractors to "take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."

· In 1967, Johnson expanded the Executive Order to include affirmative action requirements to benefit women.

· Other equal protection laws passed to make discrimination illegal were the 1964 Civil Rights Act, Title II and VII of which forbid racial discrimination in "public accommodations" and race and sex discrimination in employment, respectively; and the 1965 Voting Rights Act adopted after Congress found "that racial discrimination in voting was an insidious and pervasive evil which had been perpetuated in certain parts of the country through unremitting and ingenious defiance of the Constitution."

National NOW Times >> August 1995 >> Article

Laws Applying to Affirmative Action in Educational Institutions


Affirmative action programs are governed by a number of overlapping laws. A common principle is that whether for admissions or employment, affirmative action programs such as targeted recruitment and goals are encouraged to remedy past effects of discrimination; quotas are disfavored.
Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution
The "equal protection clause" of the Fourteenth Amendment, which applies only to public institutions, prohibits discrimination based on race or sex. According to recent U.S. Supreme Court cases decided under this provision, such as City of Richmond v. J.A. Croson Co., 488 U.S. 469 (1989), public employers' affirmative action programs must be justified by and narrowly tailored to remedy specific evidence of past discrimination.
Title Vl of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C. § 2000d, and regulations at 45 C.F.R. §§ 80.1 et seq.
Title Vl prohibits race discrimination in any program receiving federal funds. This law applies to both admissions and employees. Violations can result in withdrawal of federal funds or suits by private individuals.
Cases brought under Title Vl, such as University of California Board of Regents v. Bakke, 438 U.S. 265 (1978), establish that in an affirmative action context, race can be one of several factors used in admissions decisions.
Title Vll of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C.A. §§ 2000e et seq., and regu rations at 29 C.F.R. §§ 1604-1606, 1608.1 et seq.
Title Vll prohibits employment discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin by any employer with 15 or more employees; as amended in 1972 it applies to public and private educational institutions. Cases decided under Title Vl l authorize affirmative action programs that are "narrowly tailored" to remedy past discrimination based on race, sex, etc.
Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, 20 U.S.C. §§ 1681 et seq., and regulations at 34 C.F.R. §§ 106.1 et seq., 45 C.F.R. §§ 86.1 et seq.
Title IX prohibits sex discrimination in all educational institutions that receive federal funding. Title IX's affirmative action provisions apply to both employment and admission of students. Violations can result in withdrawal of federal funds or suits by private individuals. Regulations promulgated under Title IX, 34 C.F.R. § 106.3, authorize affirmative or remedial action in instances in which members of one sex must be treated differently to overcome the specific effects of past discrimination.
Executive Order 11246, Sept. 24, 1965, as amended by Executive Order 11375, Oct. 13, 1967, 41 C.F.R. §§ 60-1 et seq.
Executive Order 11246 requires federal contractors to adopt and implement "affirmative action programs" to promote attainment of equal employment objectives. It authorizes use of goals but prohibits quotas, and applies to race, religion, color, national origin, and sex.
State Laws
Many states have laws that are similar to Title Vll or Title IX. In some instances, state laws provide broader remedies or more expansive coverage to protected groups.
List Prepared by NOW Legal Defense and Education Fund.
aad.english.ucsb.edu/docs/Laws.html


It seems that affirmative action is a law to me. :illogical
 
Ticklerguy4u said:
The Origins of Affirmative Action
by Marquita Sykes

Affirmative action, the set of public policies and initiatives designed to help eliminate past and present discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin, is under attack.

· Originally, civil rights programs were enacted to help African Americans become full citizens of the United States. The Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution made slavery illegal; the Fourteenth Amendment guarantees equal protection under the law; the Fifteenth Amendment forbids racial discrimination in access to voting. The 1866 Civil Rights Act guarantees every citizen "the same right to make and enforce contracts ... as is enjoyed by white citizens ... "

· In 1896, the Supreme Court's decision in Plessy v. Ferguson upheld a "separate, but equal" doctrine that proved to be anything but equal for African Americans. The decision marked the end of the post-Civil War reconstruction era as Jim Crow laws spread across the South.

· In 1941, President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed Executive Order 8802 which outlawed segregationist hiring policies by defense-related industries which held federal contracts. Roosevelt's signing of this order was a direct result of efforts by Black trade union leader, A. Philip Randolph.

· During 1953 President Harry S. Truman's Committee on Government Contract Compliance urged the Bureau of Employment Security "to act positively and affirmatively to implement the policy of nondiscrimination . . . ."

· The 1954 Supreme Court decision in Brown v. Board of Education overturned Plessy v. Ferguson.

· The actual phrase "affirmative action" was first used in President Lyndon Johnson's 1965 Executive Order 11246 which requires federal contractors to "take affirmative action to ensure that applicants are employed, and that employees are treated during employment, without regard to their race, creed, color, or national origin."

· In 1967, Johnson expanded the Executive Order to include affirmative action requirements to benefit women.

· Other equal protection laws passed to make discrimination illegal were the 1964 Civil Rights Act, Title II and VII of which forbid racial discrimination in "public accommodations" and race and sex discrimination in employment, respectively; and the 1965 Voting Rights Act adopted after Congress found "that racial discrimination in voting was an insidious and pervasive evil which had been perpetuated in certain parts of the country through unremitting and ingenious defiance of the Constitution."

National NOW Times >> August 1995 >> Article

Laws Applying to Affirmative Action in Educational Institutions


Affirmative action programs are governed by a number of overlapping laws. A common principle is that whether for admissions or employment, affirmative action programs such as targeted recruitment and goals are encouraged to remedy past effects of discrimination; quotas are disfavored.
Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution
The "equal protection clause" of the Fourteenth Amendment, which applies only to public institutions, prohibits discrimination based on race or sex. According to recent U.S. Supreme Court cases decided under this provision, such as City of Richmond v. J.A. Croson Co., 488 U.S. 469 (1989), public employers' affirmative action programs must be justified by and narrowly tailored to remedy specific evidence of past discrimination.
Title Vl of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C. § 2000d, and regulations at 45 C.F.R. §§ 80.1 et seq.
Title Vl prohibits race discrimination in any program receiving federal funds. This law applies to both admissions and employees. Violations can result in withdrawal of federal funds or suits by private individuals.
Cases brought under Title Vl, such as University of California Board of Regents v. Bakke, 438 U.S. 265 (1978), establish that in an affirmative action context, race can be one of several factors used in admissions decisions.
Title Vll of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, 42 U.S.C.A. §§ 2000e et seq., and regu rations at 29 C.F.R. §§ 1604-1606, 1608.1 et seq.
Title Vll prohibits employment discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin by any employer with 15 or more employees; as amended in 1972 it applies to public and private educational institutions. Cases decided under Title Vl l authorize affirmative action programs that are "narrowly tailored" to remedy past discrimination based on race, sex, etc.
Title IX of the Education Amendments of 1972, 20 U.S.C. §§ 1681 et seq., and regulations at 34 C.F.R. §§ 106.1 et seq., 45 C.F.R. §§ 86.1 et seq.
Title IX prohibits sex discrimination in all educational institutions that receive federal funding. Title IX's affirmative action provisions apply to both employment and admission of students. Violations can result in withdrawal of federal funds or suits by private individuals. Regulations promulgated under Title IX, 34 C.F.R. § 106.3, authorize affirmative or remedial action in instances in which members of one sex must be treated differently to overcome the specific effects of past discrimination.
Executive Order 11246, Sept. 24, 1965, as amended by Executive Order 11375, Oct. 13, 1967, 41 C.F.R. §§ 60-1 et seq.
Executive Order 11246 requires federal contractors to adopt and implement "affirmative action programs" to promote attainment of equal employment objectives. It authorizes use of goals but prohibits quotas, and applies to race, religion, color, national origin, and sex.
State Laws
Many states have laws that are similar to Title Vll or Title IX. In some instances, state laws provide broader remedies or more expansive coverage to protected groups.
List Prepared by NOW Legal Defense and Education Fund.
aad.english.ucsb.edu/docs/Laws.html


It seems that affirmative action is a law to me. :illogical

OK. First, executive orders and regulations are not laws. Laws are passed by legislatures. Executive orders are rules stipulted by the president or the governor of a state that apply only to federal or state employees. Regulations are promulgated by regulatory agencies. Second, there are laws "governing affirmative action programs" i.e., outlining what affirmative action programs can and cannot do. And of course there are nondiscrimination laws (ex. the civil rights acts of 1964 and 1965), but there are no federal laws requiring affirmative action per se.

Look, this is a very complicated issue, and would totally take this thread in a different direction. If you really want to discuss affirmative action jurisprudence, let's start a different thread...
 
wendynpeter said:
OK. First, executive orders and regulations are not laws. Laws are passed by legislatures. Executive orders are rules stipulted by the president or the governor of a state that apply only to federal or state employees. Regulations are promulgated by regulatory agencies. Second, there are laws "governing affirmative action programs" i.e., outlining what affirmative action programs can and cannot do. And of course there are nondiscrimination laws (ex. the civil rights acts of 1964 and 1965), but there are no federal laws requiring affirmative action per se.

Look, this is a very complicated issue, and would totally take this thread in a different direction. If you really want to discuss affirmative action jurisprudence, let's start a different thread...

Well the second page I found under aad.english.ucsb.edu/docs/Laws.html..so I guess that is what it meant, but I guess they don't know what they are talking about. Same thing happens when I look under "tickling" I usually get the sports webpages. It must of been a fluke.
Personally, I don't think this thread could go any more in a different direction.
 
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