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Kobe Bryant: the man cant get a break.

primetime

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Nov 28, 2001
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poor Kobe Bryant. no matter what he does, people (i.e. the media) will criticize him. according to the media, Kobe Bryant is responsible for the departure of Shaq, got Phil ousted, ripped apart the Lakers, it's his fault the Lakers lost to Detroit, the creation of AIDS, the turbulence in the Middle East and made Eve eat the apple in the Garden of Eden.

is Kobe Bryant a saint? HELL NO. far from it. however, recent events in Laker Land show he isnt responsible. here's my outlook based on what is actually said, not theory.

1) Shaq: the big TRAITOR is the reason why he left the Lakers, not Kobe Bryant. Shaq fooled a lot of people thinking Kobe got rid of him. how do i know this? let's look back and think about it. have you EVER EVER heard Shaq saying he hopes Kobe stays a Laker? NO. remember last year when the Lakers reported to training camp, but Kobe was missing? Shaq said "the WHOLE team is here." now, Shaq was asking the Lakers for a $60 million dollar contract for 2 years, BUT, he came into camp AGAIN fat and out of shape. he told the Laker management in July 2003 that if they got Karl Malone and Gary Payton, he would come into camp leaner and more dedicated. did he? NO.

after the NBA finals were over, Kobe was asked a question of can he play with Phil and Shaq. Kobe said "i could play with Phil and Shaq forever." Shaq's response? "i will ALWAYS do what's best for ME." now in Phil Jackson's book coming out, he quoted Kobe Bryant as saying he could play with Shaq but he's tired of being the sidekick. now also keep in mind that the Lakers didnt out of the blue say they were trading Shaq. it was Shaq who DEMANDED to be traded. Mitch Kupchak basically told the media Shaq is expendable. that's when Shaq made his trade demand.

now why would the Lakers make Shaq expendable? think about it. you have this one guy working hard every off season, dedicated to working on his game and keeps his mouth shut about management, then you have this other guy who NEVER works out in the summer, constantly bad mouths the management in the media, but yet is demanding a $60 million dollar contract for 2 years. hmmmmm, who would i pick? the proof is the fact Shaq is now in Miami in shape and motivated. WHERE THE HELL WAS THIS MOTIVATION THE LAST 3 YEARS IN LA???? the fact is also it was about money when Shaq told the national media "the Heat are on the brink of winning a championship as long as they do the right things. the right things are bringing in the right people and MATHEMATICALLY." what is "mathematically"? it's about money. plus, how can he say he would defer to Dwayne Wade (rookie sensation in Miami) but he couldnt defer to Kobe in LA?

plus, as much as people say Kobe is a ball hog and selfish, have you EVER EVER heard Kobe say in the media "i want the ball. you got to feed the big dog the ball."? NO. that was SHAQ almost everyday. plus Kobe Bryant usually leads the team in assists. how can you be a selfish player AND lead the team in assists? people say Shaq gets others involved, but he NEVER led the team in assists? Shaq is probably the most selfish player ever to play basketball. but because Shaq is "Mr. Personality" people overlook that fact. because Kobe Bryant is a quiet guy, people automatically assume he's cocky. tell me you havent seen that in regular life. how many of us seen a very attractive woman who is shy, but because she's shy, people think she's arrogant? same thing here. i will miss Shaq, but it is because of HIM, not Kobe, that he's not in LA anymore. he isnt loyal. otherwise he would have never left Orlando. Orlando wouldnt pay him $120 million dollars back in 1996, that's why he came to LA. now, it's 2004 and it's the same ol' thing.

2) Phil Jackson. i like Phil, i really do. however his new book also sheds light on his flaws. people see his book and say "see! Kobe is an arrogant ballplayer who only looks out for himself!" but, i tell people, READ his words. Phil, in his book, says he couldnt coach Kobe because he just wont listen. but isnt Phil Jackson a "MASTER" of controlling egos? Phil told Mitch Kupchak (his own words) in January 2004 that he didnt want to come back as a Laker coach for the 2004-2005 campaign if Kobe was still there. basically Phil gave a "him or me" ultimatum to the Laker brass. so if this true, then how did Kobe push Phil out as in him telling the Laker management to get rid of him? Phil pushed Phil out, not the other way around.

i think Phil couldnt handle Kobe. why? Phil is a smart guy, no doubt about it. but he is an ARROGANT intelligient man. now, if you think you are intellectually superior to people, what would be the one thing that would drive you crazy? ANOTHER intelligient person. Phil played mind games with his players all the time. but, it probably didnt work on Kobe Bryant who sees through the head games. of course that will annoy Phil. he couldnt mold Kobe's mind like the other lemmings on the team. Kobe is already motivated. i laugh at the fact that Phil wanted a therapist because Kobe was getting to him. this is the same coach who coached certified psychopath Dennis Rodman. people say Phil managed Jordan, but the difference between Jordan and Kobe is, Jordan was the #1 guy in Chicago, but it was SHAQ, not Kobe, who was the #1 guy in LA. in other words, Kobe wouldnt fall for the mind games that Scottie Pippen probably fell for. had Kobe been the #1 guy in LA, i doubt Phil would think that way about Kobe.

here's another thing Phil said that let you know he had a problem with Kobe. Phil wanted to trade Kobe back in 1999. Phil's FIRST season was 1999-2000. how can Phil say Kobe is uncoachable if Kobe hasnt played a full year under Phil? Phil doesnt like a challenge? didnt Phil think he might be able to control Kobe's mind in 5 years? that's the odd part about his book. he wanted to get rid of Kobe well before he won a title in LA. makes you wonder about Phil. again, Phil had Dennis Rodman for three years and was able to control him. Rodman is crazy. no doubt. but he couldnt handle Kobe? he calls Kobe a narcissistic, but isnt Phil the same? is he truly a "Zen Master"?

now, i have NO IDEA what Kobe Bryant did, but the poor guy cant get a break. i'm talking basketball terms here, not his personal life like i know some of you are going to bring up. i dont condone the fact he cheate don his wife, i am looking at his basketball life only. no matter what he does, he will always be criticized. he is called a selfish player, but yet Allen Iverson is the very definition of a selfish player and you dont see the same criticism. amazing, simply amazing. i feel for Kobe, i really do. but the admirable thing he has done is keeping his mouth shut. he isnt blasting Shaq or Phil. he is just going about his business. why do we see Shaq in the paper everyday blasting the Lakers and Kobe? Shaq will never win a championship in Miami. why? him and Dwayne Wade will be at odds. he did it with "Penny" Hardaway in Orlando and he did it with Kobe Bryant in LA. mark my words.....
 
All I'll say is, want some cheese with that WHINE???😛


no sympathy from me, Kobe is getting exactly what he deserves. Now we'll see how far he could lead "his" team. He'll be lucky if he gets a winning season, let alone make the playoffs. The Lakers will be a lottery team, and they'll have Kobe to thank for it. Such a fall from grace:sowrong:
 
I doubt the lakers will make the playoffs this year....look for Miami, Dallas, Detroit, Sacremento to make a run....you watch.
 
natural tickler said:
All I'll say is, want some cheese with that WHINE???😛


no sympathy from me, Kobe is getting exactly what he deserves. Now we'll see how far he could lead "his" team. He'll be lucky if he gets a winning season, let alone make the playoffs. The Lakers will be a lottery team, and they'll have Kobe to thank for it. Such a fall from grace:sowrong:


i agree. People look up to Kobe like he's God and that he can do no wrong he is mister perfect on and off the Court. well to me thats really say the way people as Americans look up to him and other Sports figueres and Celebs like there God and Goddess. :sowrong:

break out the Whine!!!!!! 😀
 
LA who? This year belongs to Houston, baby. Tmac and Yao....the new shaq and kobe.
 
the funny thing is, each of you havent given any reasons on why Kobe deserves to be hated. what did Kobe Bryant do to deserve this kind of animosity? he's a ball hog? what is Tracy McGrady or Allen Iverson? was it the fact that Kobe had a trial? what about Allen Iverson? is it because Kobe isnt a saint? besides AC Green, who is? even the great Michael Jordan cheated on his wife and had an addiction to gambling.

again i ask, what did Kobe do? i gave you reasons on why Kobe is misperceived in the media. i think all of you who responded based your opinions about Kobe from what you got from the media. stop and think about all that was said. Kobe is getting a raw deal. is he a saint? HELL NO. but, the man isnt some monster who destroys teams. did any of you even bother to read my reasons on what happened here in LA?

by the way, Houston will be good, but i think San Antonio and Minnesota are the teams to beat in the West.
 
the way i see it, shaq has a prob with kobe, phil jackson has a prob with kobe, why does everyone have a prob with kobe? he's an egomaniac who thinks he makes the team, when in fact, the only reason they won the titles was because of shaq. Say what you want, but i promise you that miami will finish with a better rec than LA, and so will houston. T-mac has led the league in scoring for years and he is a better player than bryant, statistics prove it. Yao is only going to get better, and houston also has established, solid players such as juwan Howard, Jim Jackson, Bob sura ect....they've upgraded every position. Miami, Shaq is back in shape and reasy to prove the critics wrong. Shaq is the most dominant man in the history of the nba, and la is stupid for not keeping him happy and letting him go....and trust me, they will pay for it....he's ready to throw down this season...with dwayne wade at his side, they will do well...very well. And lets not forget Detroid...chemistry is amazing there...
 
but again, what has Kobe done? he wasnt the #1 option in LA, but yet, still lead the Lakers, along with Shaq to the title. contrary to popular belief, Shaq IS NOT the reason LA wont titles. if it wasnt for Kobe Bryant, LA DOES NOT get past San Antonio in 2001 and 2002. Shaq gets controlled against Duncan and the Spurs. they couldnt stop Kobe Bryant. the reason why Shaq got Finals MVP was because there is NO ONE and i mean NO ONE that matches up with him. in the West, you have Duncan, Garnett, Webber and a host of other big men. why wouldnt you give it to Shaq? but if Shaq is the reason LA won titles, what happened the last 2 years? where are the titles in Orlando? where are the titles in LA the years BEFORE Phil got there? sorry, it took Shaq AND Kobe AND the rest of the Lakers to win.

i agree, Miami will have a better record than LA. why? there is NO ONE and i mean NO ONE in the East that can match Shaq. ALL the big men are in the West. you saying Miami will have a better record is like predicting Tiger Woods will be a miniature golfer in the Masters. no shock.

as for T-Mac. he is a ball hog. more of a ball hog than Kobe. plus, you KNOW the reasons why his statistics are better than Kobe. T-Mac didnt have Shaq on his team. it was T-Mac and the stiffs. Kobe had to defer to Shaq. but Kobe is a better DEFENSIVE player than T-Mac.

now, did you even read my post about Shaq and why he's not in LA? or did you just go off what the media has said?
 
Yes, I read it, you make some good points, I respectfully disagree. The whole rape trial, while being a joke IMO, has unfortunately ruined this mans reputation. i see him and his team going downhill from here...the lakers are entering a rebuilding phase now, and I don't see them coming out of it for awhile.
 
the Lakers will rebuild, but they will be fine. they will make the playoffs, but to beat teams like San Antonio, Minnesota, or even Houston is a tall order. the Lakers will be better than anyone thinks.

the whole reason why i am defending Kobe Bryant is because so much negativity is being thrown his way and i sat back and thought about it. what did he do? i think about everyone calling him a ball hog, but yet he usually leads the Lakers in assists. they say he's arrogant, but what about Jordan? he wasnt exactly the humble type either. as for the rape trial, Kobe cheated on his wife, but he was innocent of the charges. no man is perfect, so for everyone to dislike Kobe for that probably should look in the mirror as well. he isnt the first, nor will he be the last NBA player to cheat on his wife.

on the flip side, had Kobe left the Lakers, i would have had some choice words for him too. had he left, then he would have turned his back on the fans and the organization that supported him 1000%.
 
let me ask you this.....do you think kobe is jordan-like? Personally, I don't even think he's in the same league...there will never be another jordan IMHO.....what do you think?
 
is Kobe Jordan-like? honestly, NO. there will never, EVER be a another Jordan. Kobe will be the first Kobe. there's been no one else like Magic Johnson. there's been no one like Larry Bird. there's been no one like Dr. J. there's been no one like Wilt Chameberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, and Shaquille O'Neal. Kobe Bryant will carve his own legacy.

but Jordan and Kobe have things in common. Jordan worked extremely hard at his game. so has Kobe Bryant. Jordan had a very strong will. so does Kobe Bryant. that's why i think the Lakers will be okay because Kobe has the will to win. the only reason why he hasnt "led" the Lakers was because the supporting cast around him during Phil Jackson's tenure were design to complement Shaq, not him. this year's Lakers have players more suitbale for Kobe's talents. does that mean they win a championship? maybe not. but give it a few years and have the team mold around him. the Lakers will be successful. Kobe Bryant is no dummy, he KNOWS people are going to hold him responsible for the Lakers fate. despite what Ray "who the hell am i?" Allen says, i doubt Kobe will ask for a trade in the near future. he knew what he was getting into to when he signed that contract.

let me ask you this. could Jordan play with Shaq in Chicago? i DOUBT IT. the SAME problem would have arose had Shaq been the center of the Chicago Bulls in the 90's. Jordan would have never defered to Shaq and Shaq was in his youth, so there was no way he would have defered to Jordan. so why is it Kobe gets all the flack? i hear all these media guys saying Kobe should defer because Shaq is too big, too strong. but would we see the same thing if Shaq was in Chicago? interesting question isnt it?
 
But there lies the difference between the men IMO....Jordan could carry an entire team, by himself...he could win championships, by himself. This is a man who could drop 60 a game whenever he wanted to. Just ask the celtics, lol. Jordan could carry the team with or without shaq....I don't believe that kobe can lead the lakers to multiple world titles like jordan did with the bulls. I don't believe bryant can carry a team all on his own. But hey, hopefully the guy will prove me wrong, I'll be watching him...don't get me wrong, I like bryant, I think he comes off in a negative way sometimes even though thats not what he's doing, or trying to do. Shaq and kobe, 2 big stars, not enough romm for em both I guess. Your right.
 
Just a scenario to consider..

Players knows he's going to court. Player knows he needs money to pay accuser - LOTS Of money. How does player get money? Get rid of highest paid player - get rid of highest paid coach. How does player get rid of player and coach? Lose championship to Detroit. Sign new contract for LOTS of money. Problem solved.
 
Krokus said:
But there lies the difference between the men IMO....Jordan could carry an entire team, by himself...he could win championships, by himself. This is a man who could drop 60 a game whenever he wanted to. Just ask the celtics, lol. Jordan could carry the team with or without shaq....I don't believe that kobe can lead the lakers to multiple world titles like jordan did with the bulls. I don't believe bryant can carry a team all on his own. But hey, hopefully the guy will prove me wrong, I'll be watching him...don't get me wrong, I like bryant, I think he comes off in a negative way sometimes even though thats not what he's doing, or trying to do. Shaq and kobe, 2 big stars, not enough romm for em both I guess. Your right.

The Bulls won games with Jordan getting 60 a game, but they didn't start winning championships until Jordan got some help. No man can carry a team game after game without help. I oughta know, we're finding that out with LeBron James and the Cavaliers. Until they get him some real help out there, they won't go far. Right now, management's just happy they can sell some tickets to the game. But you need more than that if you want the ring!

Now about Kobe vs Shaq.....

I NEVER LIKED SHAQ!!! When he was with Orlando, all he did was break backboards and bellyache every chance he got. He is the one who's arrogant, ball hog, and media hog. If it's not about him, there's hell to pay.

As far as Kobe is concerned:

He cheated on his wife! Okay, is he the first one in professional sports to do that? Hell, no!!! Even the great Jordan cheated on his wife until she let him know what "community property" really meant! What is Magic Johnson dealing with for the rest of his life? I wonder just how happy Cookie really is about that? I can list the offenders until my hands ached that cheat on their wives. Kobe just got caught. Everyone thoght he was a saint and he profited from that image. Even King David in the bible committed adultery. It's one of the oldest sins in the book.

But do you know what the bible considers one of the biggest (if not THE biggest) sins of all? PRIDE!! And that's what Mr. O'Neal's problem is. I'd rather take a quiet Kobe who messed up in his marriage than to deal with a loud mouth who uses the media to beat up on his former team and teammate. Notice that Kobe has not said anything to anyone about anything. I suspect that he'll take it up on the court and not on the camera. I don't condone what he did at all, but I have a whole lot more respect for him than I ever will have for Shaq, or Phil Jackson. Their egos wouldn't fit in a building the size of the pacific ocean!!!:sowrong:
 
you cant say that's the difference between Kobe and Jordan. Kobe hasnt had the chance to show he can carry a team. this year, we will see. funny thing is, how come Jordan, who took all the shots in Chicago and was highly recognized as the one who carried the Bulls, isnt criticized, but Kobe is? again, do you honestly think Shaq and Jordan could have been on the same team?

kis123, thank you! there is someone else out there who see Shaq for what he is. an arrogant, greedy, selfish ball player. he is always crying he doesnt get the ball enough. does anyone really believe he is going to defer to Dwayne Wade? give it a year or two. Mr. Wade is going to annoy O'Neal because O'Neal wants the ball. period. you might see the same thing you saw in LA.
 
Re: Just a scenario to consider..

tickletoy3 said:
Players knows he's going to court. Player knows he needs money to pay accuser - LOTS Of money. How does player get money? Get rid of highest paid player - get rid of highest paid coach. How does player get rid of player and coach? Lose championship to Detroit. Sign new contract for LOTS of money. Problem solved.


Hmmmmm...let's take a look at this from a different perspective.

Do you actually think Kobe has that much pull considering his present situation? I think Kobe is happy he still has a job, let alone control the demise of coaches and players. You must have him confused with John Elway of the Denver Broncos or someone like that who gave management the ultamatum of "it's either him or me" regarding his former coach (who's name is just not coming to me right now). There's no way Kobe has that much pull. Besides, the likelihood of that woman getting a lot of money is about as realistic as me wearing a pair of size 2 jeans. Take it from me, that's never gonna happen. Shaq and Phil Jackson are just two arrogant overpaid babies who didn't get their way and need a scapegoat to bury their axes in.
 
Kobe played the NBA

It's simple math. Give Shaq the ball and let the team be "coached" by Phil Jackson - the Lakers win championships. Let another player try to 'run' the team - the Lakers lose to Detroit. If it works don't fix it. Kobe tried to fix it. Simple math.
 
Re: Kobe played the NBA

tickletoy3 said:
It's simple math. Give Shaq the ball and let the team be "coached" by Phil Jackson - the Lakers win championships. Let another player try to 'run' the team - the Lakers lose to Detroit. If it works don't fix it. Kobe tried to fix it. Simple math.

Is there somewhere in the archives where it's printed that Shaq's trade and Phil Jackson's departure (both which have happened with other teams even before Kobe even came to the NBA) are because of Kobe? Or is that what people are assuming because of Kobe's other mistakes? I don't see anyone having that kind of pull in the NBA today. Shaq and Phil have done this before and they played the blame game instead of looking in the mirror for their problems. This has nothing to do with Kobe.

The Lakers lost to Detroit because they thought they were just going to run over them like they've done with every other team in the NBA. Every dog has its day, and it was time for the Pistons to win, and the Lakers to lose. That's it and that's all. Just because the almighty Lakers lost a championship and it happens to be the same time Kobe gets into trouble is merely circumstantial.

How well are the Baltimore Ravens doing these days? Jamal Lewis is about the only one doing well,and he's the one in legal trouble now. People are reaching long on this one blaming Kobe on the championship loss. They lost because they lost-folks need to stop playing the blame game and get over it. If the Lakers are rebuilding, then they're in rebuilding and folks are either fair weather fans or they're for real. As soon as the NBA stops building teams around one man, they'll have better teams, period!

I must mention that I'm not a fan of Kobe, men's professional baskeball, or the NBA. All of them are a bunch of overpaid, immature, unprofessional acting babies who whine, moan, and complain instead of taking responsibility for their behavior on and off the court. We place too much emphasis on someone's ability to bounce a ball down a court and dunk into a net. There are substantially more important things in life to be concerned about.
 
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