nylon tickling piracy

[snapnuts11]

Hello friends,

Well, I don't know whether to be flattered or pissed off. Here's the dilema:

While browsing the dailymotion site I found that someone by the screen name of "TickleStephanie2009" had posted, in their entirety, two videos from my clip store. The first is one of my early videos "shear and jeans tied" and the other is one of my more recent "tickled in black opaques". I thought for a while how to handle it and decided that rather than go through all of the nonsense of notifying dailymotion and maybe (or maybe not) achieving resolution of the matter, I would instead just hyperlink directly to the offending addresses. If daily motion is anything like youtube, enough hits on a hyperlink typically gets the video removed. In the mean time, if I'm going to be losing out, I at least wanted my friends and supporters here to derive some benefit from the pirate so that this act is not completely in vain. Enjoy and, as always, thanks for the continued support.

Store: http://www.clips4sale.com/studio/20814

shear tan nylons in jeans with tied ankles

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgqllb_12-shearandjeanstied_fun

black opaque hose and pants

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgqln2_tickled-in-black-opaques_fun

 

[Fat Bastard]

You’re not alone. If you look through the entire list of tickle clips there, I believe you’ll see copyright violations for almost every producer in the business.

Not much you can do now because once a clip shows up on one hosting site, anyone interested has already ripped the clip to their drive, and you’ll likely find the same clip on multiple sites soon after.

It’s discouraging to be ripped off like that, but it’s the nature of medium that makes it impossible to control. My suggestion is to be sure you keep flashing your Clips4Sale site at various times throughout all your clips, so those who are interested in seeing more of your work will know where to go.

 

[turtleboy]

It happened to me and some of my full vids appeared on dailymotion....I wouldn't particularly mind in reality, but for the fact that when I post my own previews on there they get deleted instantly, the vids get blacklisted and I have my account deleted - apparently for breach of copyright!! It's happened any time I post anything of my own on DM, but others can apparently share my vids on there without fear of the same treatment...

 

[trepak]

Since this is a phenomenom that cannot be stopped (ask Universal, Warner, Paramount, whoever), because it's in the nature of the internet, be flattered and happy about the advertising that's completely free for you.
People who might not even know your store get to see your clips. And maybe it turns them into customers...

It's the only way to see it, because it can't be changed and it can't be stopped. And, believe me, as a professional music-producer I know what I'm talking about. I don't see it as crime anymore, I see it as an opportunity. It gets out there, creates buzz - and that's actually the best thing that can happen to you...

 

[jmsdarke]

Actually, I'm working on a solution. I've been watching video piracy and had discussed it with Sony at length since '94 and '95 - before they committed $30M to combat it and retreated after spending $20M.

I think it's no longer a matter of deep pockets to solve this issue.

I actually think there's a reasonable way to combat this but it's still months away from being able to test it.

I'm actually deeply inspired by the pirates to innovate in ways that empower the paying customer - and no, it's not DRM.

As for the argument of advertising benefit, I'm fairly sure that argument doesn't hold the day. People who get things for free value the source of free stuff much more than the source of fee stuff. Humans!

JD

 

[ndj101982]

Actually, I'm working on a solution. I've been watching video piracy and had discussed it with Sony at length since '94 and '95 - before they committed $30M to combat it and retreated after spending $20M.

I think it's no longer a matter of deep pockets to solve this issue.

I actually think there's a reasonable way to combat this but it's still months away from being able to test it.

I'm actually deeply inspired by the pirates to innovate in ways that empower the paying customer - and no, it's not DRM.

As for the argument of advertising benefit, I'm fairly sure that argument doesn't hold the day. People who get things for free value the source of free stuff much more than the source of fee stuff. Humans!

JD

I agree 100% with you regarding free stuff. Let's face it, regardless of the quality of video resolution, or if it's only a 3-minutes segment as opposed to the whole clip, if it's enough for a dude to whack off to he isn't going to go pay full price for the clip.

As the saying goes, "why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?"

 

[ndj101982]

I have to say that the one producer that comes to mind who is absolutely getting "raped" by this piracy is Tickle Central. That poor guys full clips are all over daily motion. If I am not mistaken, I believe it was this piracy that made him decide to stop producing new clips for nearly a 2 year period.

 

[Maelstrom]

"regardless of the quality of video resolution, or if it's only a 3-minutes segment as opposed to the whole clip, if it's enough for a dude to whack off to he isn't going to go pay full price for the clip"

James is absolutely correct with the above statement.

You can't stop a viral movement, but given this seems isolated for now, I would go at that individual with both barrels if he won't pull it.

The good news is if you IM the posters on DailyMotion with a copywrite appeal, a lot of them will take it down and apologize pretty quickly - surprisingly.

Your material is too good to just slip through the cracks like that.

 

[mabus]

It happened to me and some of my full vids appeared on dailymotion....I wouldn't particularly mind in reality, but for the fact that when I post my own previews on there they get deleted instantly, the vids get blacklisted and I have my account deleted - apparently for breach of copyright!! It's happened any time I post anything of my own on DM, but others can apparently share my vids on there without fear of the same treatment...

Find out who reported you, turtleboy, and post the e-mail address here.

Zen Tickling had this same problem a while back. Another producer who no longer produced clips was sabotaging him, lying to Youtube and saying Zen had stole his clips, when in fact they were Zen's clips.

It sounds like the same thing's happening to you.
It's not fair.
You work hard on your clips, and on the previews for our enjoyment and as powerful advertisements. Folks on dailymotion and youtube, who never visit here, will see your previews and buy your clips. You deserve the fair gaining of customers because of all the hard work and time you dedicate to your store....as do all the other current active producers!!

 

[snapnuts11]

Thanks everyone for the encouragement. I didn't realize how widespread it had become. I knew that ticklecentral had fallen victim and question whether or not that was the reason that the site seemed to dissapear. I'm pissed byt not discouraged and plan to make some new stuff when I get a free moment.

 

[trepak]

I do not agree with JD's statement above. And I'm pretty sure, the guys who are just looking for free stuff to get off quickly, no matter how bad the quality is or how much spyware dailymotion puts upon them, are not the guys that would spend money on clips anyway. Those are the guys who are right here among us, complaining about a preview that's not 5:00 minutes long etc. They wouldn't pay anything anyway, so why bother with them.... On the other hand, people who are willing to pay don't want to spend hours searching for a certain clip in crappy quality just to save 5 bucks, because time and effort is alot more expensive than that...

I have bought a lot of stuff (ticklevids, DVDs, music), because I had the chance to view/hear it in advance. I would never upload anything, but if it's there I'll probably check it out. I'm willing to pay for good material, but I'm not willing to throw my money out. So show me what you got and I'll decide if I want to pay for it. This is just an extension of that.

However, I do of course agree, that sometimes this goes too far (like with TickleCentral for instance) - but, as sad as this may be, those are still exceptions.

I'm looking forward to the solution, if there will be any. But I think you can always only react to piracy and not be ahead of it. You can only get a ticket AFTER you drove too fast - not before to prevent you from speeding in the first place...
So the pirates will find ways and others will find ways to stop 'em and then it starts all over again...


Anyhoo, there's different opinions on this subject - and we'll probably never find out who was right, if there even is such a thing in this matter.

 

[tabuzz]

once i purchase a clip from said producer,don't i have the right to upload or post it where ever i choose..after all i did pay for it with my own money

 

[dskodj]

I have bought a lot of stuff (ticklevids, DVDs, music), because I had the chance to view/hear it in advance. I would never upload anything, but if it's there I'll probably check it out. I'm willing to pay for good material, but I'm not willing to throw my money out. So show me what you got and I'll decide if I want to pay for it. This is just an extension of that..

what he said. also, when these things happen, it has introduced me to a few different producers i didnt know of or think was any good based on previews, and ive since become a customer (espessaly in today's tickle vid market which is lacking HIGHLY for the stuff im into).

so, the way i see it (unless its like whats happened with tickle central where the damn near entire catolog was posted), it's free promotion to reach out beyond the tickling forums and to show a piece of your work in full.

 

[Oddjob0226]

If you contacted the advertisers on these sites they might put some pressure on the site operators to take more careful consideration of the matter. I clicked on the first link and was highly amused at the commercial running before the video. Apparently the 3 Musketeer candy bar sponsors adult-related fetish stuff. Part of their business plan?

 

[Oddjob0226]

once i purchase a clip from said producer,don't i have the right to upload or post it where ever i choose..after all i did pay for it with my own money

The producer licensed you to have a copy of the clip; that's what you paid for, the license to have that clip for your own use. You did not purchase ownership of the clip. You also didn't create or copyright the content so it is not legally yours to give away. You could take the copy off your computer and give it (or sell it) to someone, but that's not the same as spreading it around worldwide for free. That's why you can sell old VHSs and DVDs on Ebay, but selling digital copies of someone else's clips - which is what's happening to Tickle Abuse right now due to a seller in Georgia - will get your listing taken down.

This is where "first-sale doctrine" and "end user license agrements" come into conflict.

 

[trepak]

...or in simpler words: NO! You do NOT have the right to upload a clip you paid for and spread it all over the net.

One exception: if it's a custom video you ordered and bought, including all (!) the rights. Then you can do whatever you want with it.

 

[ergtic69]

that is why i miss the good old day where you could only buy the vhs/dvd version. and wouldnt have to worry much about illegal downloading

 

[webfiend]

I beg to differ, I show the clip to my friends in my house, so what. How is this any different? Other than the means to show this to my "world" of friends. I know it sucks for the producers, but thats how it goes. The only way I can see this work is to set up membership to their site, and stream the clips, that way, you don't pay, you don't get to see it, pretty simple. I would have no objections to this, and would definitely pay for good content. In fact this model should help handle the sucky content issues that come up from time to time, I know not every clip can be a winner.

 

[jmsdarke]

I beg to differ, I show the clip to my friends in my house, so what. How is this any different? Other than the means to show this to my "world" of friends. I know it sucks for the producers, but thats how it goes. The only way I can see this work is to set up membership to their site, and stream the clips, that way, you don't pay, you don't get to see it, pretty simple. I would have no objections to this, and would definitely pay for good content. In fact this model should help handle the sucky content issues that come up from time to time, I know not every clip can be a winner.

You buy a movie, show it to your family and show it to your friends - that is within the personal rights use. You start giving copies away, you qualify for matching chrome bracelets and new accommodations with interesting folks, also in extended detention.

IMHO, pirating our expensively produced video clips is the "I take no responsibility for my own decision to NOT respect the producer's intellectual property rights" that has already driven several tickle video producers out of the market for good.

It's the kind of thinking that gets you lots of support in China from the growth black market of counterfeiters.

It's illegal and we all know it. But some try to rationalize it.

This month alone, my expenses to hire models is more than $2,900.

Making this stuff costs us actual money, not philosophical pretzeling.

I've heard some people try to rationalize piracy of our content by saying producers are too greedy. It's the same rationalization and mental drivel we heard from the "occupy wall street" gang, who view themselves as the arbiters of how much a company should make. I considered them to be chronically off their meds.

I've actually considered developing a video encapsulating format to allows producers to serialze video clips and disable them remotely if they are played from more than 1 IP address (within a given time span). Unlike those who jibber-jabber professionally, I've developed private video formats in the past.

Don't worry. I know what I write is the online equivalent of pissing in the wind. I just wanted to put it here as a dissenting counter-weight to what I view as irresponsible and destructive commentary.

JD

 

[webfiend]

Jms,

I understand where you are coming from, but what is piracy anyway? In this context, its not. The web just allows one to share his item over a large scale. Again I come back to, if i show this on my computer to my friend, am I pirating? No, and there is nothing you can do about it except squawk. Bear in mind I don't direct this personally and I am not trying to offend in any way, I am just presenting the other side. I personally like your stuff very much and have purchased many of your clips my own. I do no uploading of any of this. I still maintain if you want max revenue, you need to go to a streaming model, that way you pay for your login, and you see it, no one could upload or do anything else with it, you are protected. I buy a book, dvd, or clip and pass it around, its mine to do as i please, you can't retain ownership and control once you let it go, no matter what the laws say. For all that this has been going on, you guys are all still here and continuing to produce no matter. I say let it be good advertising, people will buy, maybe not as many as you would like, but they will buy and if turns out that this ruins it as a business, so be it.

 

[jmsdarke]

Jms,

I understand where you are coming from, but what is piracy anyway? In this context, its not. The web just allows one to share his item over a large scale. Again I come back to, if i show this on my computer to my friend, am I pirating? No, and there is nothing you can do about it except squawk.

In this context it most definitely is piracy. As much comfort as your words may give those incarcerated for piracy of digital content, they are still in jail. As for "nothing we can do about it", the steps that we can take are challenging. So content producers are personally responsible to decide how to proceed. But we have options.

Bear in mind I don't direct this personally and I am not trying to offend in any way, I am just presenting the other side. I personally like your stuff very much and have purchased many of your clips my own. I do no uploading of any of this. I still maintain if you want max revenue, you need to go to a streaming model, that way you pay for your login, and you see it, no one could upload or do anything else with it, you are protected.

Thank you for any support you have made to my store.

I can appreciate that you are speaking philosophically and representing a point of view in a debate and that you are not necessarily personally advocating for anyone to violate producers' intellectual property rights, but I (or someone) must point out how illegal that is and how it works to undermine the efforts of the producer.

It may seem logical to assume that a streaming model would solve the issue and be profitable. It turns out that the streaming model is quite poor compared to video clip sales. The idea of buying clips that one can watch anywhere, anytime, at will is not matched by watching streaming content, for which you must visit a site to see. And streaming content can be pirated rather easily. This is not my opinion. This is my experience. I've had my streaming site for more than 4 years. On a good month, it accounts for 5% of sales. On an average month, it accounts for 2%.

I buy a book, dvd, or clip and pass it around, its mine to do as i please, you can't retain ownership and control once you let it go, no matter what the laws say. For all that this has been going on, you guys are all still here and continuing to produce no matter. I say let it be good advertising, people will buy, maybe not as many as you would like, but they will buy and if turns out that this ruins it as a business, so be it.

When you buy content (physical or digital) you have a personal license for private use. That is the legal extent to your ownership. You can transfer that ownership to anyone you chose to, thereby giving up your access to use it. In the case of digital content, you do not have to delete a clip in order to transfer the individual use license to someone else. This is why I am contemplating developing the video clip enveloping format that will allow us video producers to catch file sharing in the act and shut down all copies of a clip being pirated.

Previously, as the VP of a small telecom research firm, I've had to serve as a subject matter witness in a few legal cases on this issue and have seen the foundation of the points that you've raised. I've also seen the damage and the consequences of such beliefs to both the content producers and those who violated their intellectual property rights.

Imagination and experience do not ride on the same bus.

Thank you for thinking and offering a reasoned view on the issue.

Though I completely disagree with you, I think you are actually respectful.

JD

 

[Oddjob0226]

?...and if turns out that this ruins it as a business, so be it.

May I ask what case law you are quoting that used the "so be it defense" in regards to a legal business having their intellectual property used in an unlicensed way?

You're not arguing Booth vs. Look Magazine, are you? Or quoting The Dodd Files decision, correct?

 

[jmsdarke]

May I ask what case law you are quoting that used the "so be it defense" in regards to a legal business having their intellectual property used in an unlicensed way?

You're not arguing Booth vs. Look Magazine, are you? Or quoting The Dodd Files decision, correct?

I served as the subject matter expert for legal teams in the US, Canada and Australia on this issue class.

As I never intimated nor said that I am a lawyer, the question of 'case law' does not apply. I have been a technical advising member to cases involving tri-forcation, patents, Islamic finance, trademarks, copyrights and intellectual properties.

So no, I am not quoting the above mentioned cases.

JD

 

[TicklesFemales]

Snapnuts I love seeing your wife tickled. Wish I could tickle her myself sometime. Please make more clips of you tickling her.

 

[jmsdarke]

Snapnuts I love seeing your wife tickled. Wish I could tickle her myself sometime. Please make more clips of you tickling her.

Will probably have a new clip soon. I'm sure she'll do something to deserve it. Ha!

JD