Produced a Non-Consensual Clip (Kinda)

[ZenTickling]

Question for producers, and maybe everyone else too. I just starting doing more F/F so I'm not very experienced in managing models. Yesterday I worked with two beautiful and ticklish girls. One was a model and the other was her roommate who was also interested. I had them sign the release.. explained the safe word. During the shoot the girl being tickled yelled the safe word, and her friend laughed and ignored it. They both seemed fine, and the other girl got her revenge (although I lost some of the footage due to my being a dumbass), but still. This was 100% authentic stuff. After we shot I explained to them that people might get mad seeing them ignore the safe word, but what was I supposed to do? They're best friends and roommates. I almost had to drag one off the other. Anybody have any experience with this?

Note: The whole clip wasn't non-consensual, just a few seconds. It was very real, and pretty intense.

 

[AngelOfDarkness]

*shrugs* They know each other. A lee and the producer ler would make it a whole different ballgame.

 

[vladtickleman22]

I might catch some shit for this. But here it is anyways... I don't really see this as a non-con thing since they signed the release and knew they would be tickled. Seems more like one friend just messing with the other a bit. Especially since it was only a few seconds.

The problem would be more if they did not know what was going to happen or if one just plain did not stop for a few minutes or more. What you've explained seems more like a "haha you can't stop me! coochie coochie coo" kinda thing.

 

[ZenTickling]

I might catch some shit for this. But here it is anyways... I don't really see this as a non-con thing since they signed the release and knew they would be tickled. Seems more like one friend just messing with the other a bit. Especially since it was only a few seconds.

The release says if they are pushed to the limit and absolutely need a break, they say the safe word. I know it doesn't seem like a big deal, but a lot of people are extremely strict when it comes to safe words, and rightly so.

 

[C.K. Storyteller]

I agree that this is a murky area, but I think the other posters are right. If you were the tickler, and hadn't stopped, then this would be a totally different situation.

Did the girls sign anything that described responsibilities as the tickler?

As long as the girls were fine with it, then I'd say its a non-issue. Kudos to you for bringing this to our attention, though.

 

[vladtickleman22]

The release says if they are pushed to the limit and absolutely need a break, they say the safe word. I know it doesn't seem like a big deal, but a lot of people are extremely strict when it comes to safe words, and rightly so.

I completely 100% understand that. If i were in the position of the lee, i would absolutely consider having that line crossed a big deal. As you stated though, it was only a few seconds. The arguement can be made that a few seconds turns into several and so on. Which is why that part is in the contract.

All in all you were able to pull one off the other. So, in my opinion a few seconds is not a big deal. I am not a producer so i cannot give advice speaking from experience. However, i can offer one bit on the contract. Clearly stating the safe word must be obeyed and having that ignored is breach of contract. Which is legal grounds for not paying the models. If you have to deal with these two again, you may bring that up. Which will at the very least make them think twice before messing around like that.

 

[ZenTickling]

Well I'm definitely going to have them back.. they were great. As long as they didn't care I was fine with everything. I remember seeing posters jump on producers who disrespected the safe word, even though the whole thing was staged. Wasn't sure what the community would think about the issue.

 

[rhiannon]

If they want to do it again, I guess she didn't think it was that bad. And if she did, it is the problem of the ler, not you! It's up to the lee to rip her ass if she chooses to.

 

[ViperGTS]

It all depends on your use of a safewords. In my productions, the safeword is only to be used in case of pain or severe discomfort, not because it "tickles too bad." So your results may vary.

 

[rhiannon]

It all depends on your use of a safewords. In my productions, the safeword is only to be used in case of pain or severe discomfort, not because it "tickles too bad." So your results may vary.

Like not being able to breath or muscles hurting from laughing, exactly.

 

[ViperGTS]

Like not being able to breath or muscles hurting from laughing, exactly.

Right. The way I see (and this may just be the "evil Dom" part of me talking here), if my lee uses her safeword, her weight better be fully supported by the ropes holding her in place. If she can still walk in a straight line immediately after using her safeword, then she used it too damned early.

Of course, I pay attention to my lee - body language speaks MUCH louder than words do, especially when the body and mind are both under extreme duress. Often times, a lee's body language goes through some drastic changes before she's even aware that she should use her safeword, and that's any responsible ler's clue to focus even more keenly on her state of being.

 

[rhiannon]

If she can still walk in a straight line immedicately after using her safeword

Walk? I can't even get up after a session.

 

[ViperGTS]

My kinda girl. 😀

 

[milagros317]

The release says if they are pushed to the limit and absolutely need a break, they say the safe word. I know it doesn't seem like a big deal, but a lot of people are extremely strict when it comes to safe words, and rightly so.

Yes, rightly so. Somebody using a safeword may be in real trouble that could lead to medical jeopardy. It seems to have caused no harm this time.

What you need to do is talk to the models before a shoot about the importance of respecting the safeword. Put it in the release that they sign, that they agree to respect the safeword.

 

[-Hari-]

Its about as close as you can come to non con without getting into unavoidable trouble, Ide count yourself lucky that you were the one sat on the other end of the camera when one model broke the legal agreement and the other model one was fine with it afterwards due to prior relations.... aint like shes gonne sue her friend but arguably your technically at risk for not intervening sooner arnt you? I dont know much about these things in depth.

Im not saying that theyre gonna, but technically that could happen yeah?

Its quite a lucky bit of footage albeit short, and has worked out ok.

Props 😛

 

[ZenTickling]

It all depends on your use of a safewords. In my productions, the safeword is only to be used in case of pain or severe discomfort, not because it "tickles too bad." So your results may vary.

LOL and I thought I had trouble finding models.. I can't imagine finding many women who would want to do that. These two could hardly breath while being tickled. I let loose on one of them and she was almost in tears after ten seconds.

 

[ViperGTS]

LOL and I thought I had trouble finding models.. I can't imagine finding many women who would want to do that. These two could hardly breath while being tickled. I let loose on one of them and she was almost in tears after ten seconds.

Well if you go for broke right out of the gate....

 

[Mister Scruff]

After we shot I explained to them that people might get mad seeing them ignore the safe word, but what was I supposed to do?

Keep filming with a big old smile on your chops? 😀

Srsly though, there's a difference between a producer who's hired a model ignoring the safeword and the model's room-mate doing it, I'd say, because unless the room-mate is some sort of F/F tickling lesbian who gets off on overstepping the bounds (which would make her the world's greatest room-mate) then it's done in fun and between friends.

Also post the clip. Do it nao.

 

[ZenTickling]

Keep filming with a big old smile on your chops? 😀

Srsly though, there's a difference between a producer who's hired a model ignoring the safeword and the model's room-mate doing it, I'd say, because unless the room-mate is some sort of F/F tickling lesbian who gets off on overstepping the bounds (which would make her the world's greatest room-mate) then it's done in fun and between friends.

Also post the clip. Do it nao.

The clip is up.. http://www.ticklingforum.com/showthread.php?t=160501

If anybody has seen it let me know what you think about it. It's actually quite a short scene, but I wasn't sure if people would throw me to the dogs for allowing the safeword to be ignored.

 

[RobAce]

I know some of you may have touched on this, but I agree with vlad.

To me a true Non-Con video involves someone who does not know they are going to be tickled, does not agree to tickling, and gets tickled anyway.

Most of the ones I have seen are usually heavy BDSM videos where the model knows she is going to be spanked, candle wax, nipple clamps...etc. But when the DOM tickles her just for a lark and she starts screaming and struggling and fighting back and cursing, that is true non-con.

Rob

 

[rhiannon]

Don't models in BDSM vids get a safeword?

 

[SteakDinnerBoom]

Just to play devil's advocate...

one could say, just because Amber wasn't familiar with the world of bondage and safewords and maybe didn't understand the importance of respecting a safeword, doesn't make it right or safe. Another thing is, some people could watch this video and think "well if my lee and I know each other and are comfortable with each other, it's okay to ignore the safeword". Of course that gets into the whole "if Eminem says ________ and some dumbass thinks he's serious and does ________, is it Eminem's fault that the dumbass did ________" argument. Well, maybe not a great comparison but I think you know what I mean 😀