Very interesting interview on HDNET with Hulk Hogan which aired 5-20-11

[FlockOfSeagulls]

Very interesting and honest interview with Hulk Hogan by a interviewer who was obviously a big wrestling fan growing up .

Things I learned ...

Hogan said at his zenith he was a tick over 6'7'' with no shoes . He shrank to right at 6-4 with all his back , knee , hip , and pelvic injuries . He had some rods recently inserted and said now he was standing straighter and was measured at just over 6'5'' .

Originally was ready to retire at 38 but his wife at the time decided to build the 20,000 sq ft mansion seen in Hogan knows Best . This made him rethink retirement alltogether .

Was incredibly complementary toward Randy Savage considering their history . When he answered the question of who was his biggest rival he also answered Savage . Also said Savage was one of the most professional wrestlers in all of wrestling . This interview was taped before tragic news of Savage car accident .

Hogan also had nothing but glowing comments about Andre the Giant . He mentioned his match at WM III against andre as his biggest match .

Hogan also said he bent is pelvic bone permanently over the years because of his famous leg-drop finnishing manuever . Wishes he had known and would have comeup with another finnisher .

When asked who was the greatest wrestler of all-time he said overwhemingly it was Ric Flair .

At WM I he had to convince Orndorf & Piper that Mr . T angle was good for growth of wrestling . Orndorf orginally wanted to beat the crap out of Mr.T for real .

The Ultimate warrior angle of beating Hogan for title was McMahons idea because he felt Hogan was just too big and felt he overshadowed all the other wrestlers in WWF . Tried as they might the Hulkamaniacs wouldn't let happen so they scrapped the idea soon afterwards because of such negative feedback .

When asked who was the one wrestler he could go back and face he said Stone cold because he never wrestled him and fans would like to see it .

I was never a huge Hogan fan , I was a Flair fan and always liked the NWA over the WWWF . But I always respected what Hogan & Flair did , they made wrestling main-stream for the masses. Seeing this honest side of Hogan has me having newfound respect for his career and character

 

[SlaverTickler]

Originally was ready to retire at 38 but his wife at the time decided to build the 20,000 sq ft mansion seen in Hogan knows Best . This made him rethink retirement alltogether .

Guilt does terrible thing to a man.

Was incredibly complementary toward Randy Savage considering their history . When he answered the question of who was his biggest rival he also answered Savage . Also said Savage was one of the most professional wrestlers in all of wrestling . This interview was taped before tragic news of Savage car accident .

I've never heard Hulk ever say anything bad about Savage as a performer. He claims Savage blamed him for his divorce from Liz, and then when "George" left him, but other then that all I remember was hearing him praise "The Macho Man".

Hogan also had nothing but glowing comments about Andre the Giant . He mentioned his match at WM III against Andre as his biggest match. It's just to bad that when it was Hulk's turn to do it 6 years later he forgot all about what Adre did for him.

He should, Andre allowing Hogan to beat him at Mania III was a passing of the tourch. Andre had been the biggest name in Pro Wrestling, and Hulk beating him is really what made Hogan the man.

Hogan also said he bent is pelvic bone permanently over the years because of his famous leg-drop finnishing manuever . Wishes he had known and would have comeup with another finnisher .

I think the Heart Punch would have been a good one for him, but it is sort of a "Heel" move.

When asked who was the greatest wrestler of all-time he said overwhemingly it was Ric Flair .

Koff, Koff... bull shit... koff koff... Flair sucks... koff, koff.

At WM I he had to convince Orndorf & Piper that Mr . T angle was good for growth of wrestling . Orndorf orginally wanted to beat the crap out of Mr.T for real .

The reason the match at Mania I ended the way it did was because Roddy Piper refused to let Mr. T pin him. Pipper hated Mr. T with a pasion, and I can't say I blame them. Who is Mr. T to come in at WrestleMania and lay a pin on an established performer who's worked his ass off to get where he is.

The Ultimate warrior angle of beating Hogan for title was McMahons idea because he felt Hogan was just too big and felt he overshadowed all the other wrestlers in WWF . Tried as they might the Hulkamaniacs wouldn't let happen so they scrapped the idea soon afterwards because of such negative feedback .

Um... did Hogan forget he lost the title to the Warrior at Mania 6? I was there, I saw it happen. Then again he thinks the Montreal Screw Job happened at a WrestleMania with Shawn pinning Bret... so... ya know.

When asked who was the one wrestler he could go back and face he said Stone cold because he never wrestled him and fans would like to see it .

Now this is funny, because before Steve Austin was "Stone Cold" he was "Stunning", and when he tried to work with Hogan in WCW Hogan refused, so... ya know... Hogan is full of shit.

I was never a huge Hogan fan , I was a Flair fan and always liked the NWA over the WWWF . But I always respected what Hogan & Flair did , they made wrestling main-stream for the masses. Seeing this honest side of Hogan has me having newfound respect for his career and character

Have you read his first book... Hulk Hogan is a total ass.

 

[primetime]

What else should I expect from you? Only in your mind does Ric Flair suck. Seriously dude, Ric Flair is definitely considered one of the greatest of all time. Where you think he sucks is beyond me. This guy sucked so bad, they let him be the champion 16 times and be the face of the NWA in the 80s. Yeah, he was soooo terrible...

I guess you didn't understand what Hogan meant about the Warrior angle. Read the quote again. True or flase, the Ultimate Warrior ended up losing the title less than a year after beating Hogan? McMahon tried to get the Warrior over by beating Hogan, but the majority of the fans didn't like the move over time. Next thing you know, Hogan gets his title back and the Warrior is never in the title picture again. Sounds like what Hogan said is true....

Again, Hogan said he would have loved to face STONE COLD Steve Austin since the fans would want to see that. Did the fans really want to see Hogan vs STUNNING Steve Austin? nope....

I have read Hogan's book. Very informative. It comes from his point of view. Just like your opinions are YOUR point of view, what Hogan wrote are his. For years people think your opinions are, well, full of shit.....

Stop hating on Hogan...

 

[SlaverTickler]

What else should I expect from you? Only in your mind does Ric Flair suck. Seriously dude, Ric Flair is definitely considered one of the greatest of all time. Where you think he sucks is beyond me. This guy sucked so bad, they let him be the champion 16 times and be the face of the NWA in the 80s. Yeah, he was soooo terrible...

I guess you didn't understand what Hogan meant about the Warrior angle. Read the quote again. True or flase, the Ultimate Warrior ended up losing the title less than a year after beating Hogan? McMahon tried to get the Warrior over by beating Hogan, but the majority of the fans didn't like the move over time. Next thing you know, Hogan gets his title back and the Warrior is never in the title picture again. Sounds like what Hogan said is true....

Again, Hogan said he would have loved to face STONE COLD Steve Austin since the fans would want to see that. Did the fans really want to see Hogan vs STUNNING Steve Austin? nope....

I have read Hogan's book. Very informative. It comes from his point of view. Just like your opinions are YOUR point of view, what Hogan wrote are his. For years people think your opinions are, well, full of shit.....

Stop hating on Hogan...

Flair does suck, he has the same match almost every time. If you saw him wrestle Steamboat once, well, you probably saw every match they ever had. Same with Harley Race, and most likely all the others. His birth parents didn't want him, his adoptive parents shipped him off to boarding school, the AWA tossed him, WCW tossed him, McMahon got rid of him (TWICE), and TNA left his ass in Europe because he's a trouble making ego maniac piece of shit drunk.

10 guys that were better in the ring then Flair
Dynamite Kid, Bret Hart, Owen Hart, Arn Anderson, (pre-roids)Scott Stiener, Brian Pilman, Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Davyboy Smith, and Curt Hening

I could have added another 10, but I'm working nights now and I am a bit tired. And don't forget how Austin claims Flair tried to bury Pilman with locker room politics. It's all on the Brian Pilman DVD that was out a few years back. It's also easy to hold the title 16 times when 15 of them were in the NWA/WCW, where they really didn't have anybody worth putting the title on. All the big stars had jumped over to the WWE.

Maybe they would have been interested in a match between Stunning Steve Austin and Hulk Hogan if they developed an interesting story around it. Austin's idea (apparently) was to make him Hogan's cousin, and they would work together and then Austin would double cross him at some point. But hey that was the story with WCW to begin with. Of course when Austin and Hogan were going to have a match at WrestleMania 18 they couldn't agree on the finish so Austin got stuck working with Scott "Borrachón" Hall.

Did you find the part where Hogan claimed he main evented Summer Slam in the UK informative too. You remember that part? Where he claims he did a "Babe Ruth" deal with some kid in the hospital... so was he the guy with the braided hair and the Union Jack titles or was he t he guy in with the slicked black hair and the pink and black tights.

As far as the Warrior goes, I don't remember him holding the title again, however he did challenge for the title against the late, great Randy Savage (ironically at a Summer Slam show I believe). Warrior's probable was the stunt he pulled at Summer Slam 91 (you know... allot happens at Summer Slam) when he demanded McMahon pay him extra or he wouldn't go down to the ring. The weird thing is, for all the people Vince had ripped off for money he actually owed, he gave the Warrior the extra money, and then he fired him. Warrior deserved to be fired, but he never should have got that extra money. If Warrior hadn't pulled that, I do believe Hogan/Warrior II would have happened.

Here it is...
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... and Warrior won this match by way of a count out.

It's very easy to hate somebody when they are willing to take pot shots at a person who is bed ridden after suffering a stroke, witch I remember hearing Hogan did a few years back. Something to the effect of "Bret Hart is back in Calgary, and can't even remember his own name.". I don't have much use for Bret Hart these days, since he made a total ass out of himself in that match with McMahon, and going back to the company that caused his brothers death is pretty disgusting in my opinion.

Once Upon a Time people like you used to tell people like me we were full of shit for thinking the world was round and that the earth rotated around the Sun. We were right then, and we're right now.

By the way, I watched a full raw for the first time last night... what a piece of shit. 30 min's of talking followed by a bunch of crappy, poorly thought out matches. The highlight of the night was CM Punks tribute to the Macho Man by styling his attire in a similar way.

Lance Storm liked Flair but even he had to admit Flair screwed Scott Steiner at Clash of Champions...
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I think this is the match Lance is talking about...
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[SlaverTickler]

One thing I think we all can agree on though, Hulk should have got to keep his boat.

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

What else should I expect from you? Only in your mind does Ric Flair suck. Seriously dude, Ric Flair is definitely considered one of the greatest of all time. Where you think he sucks is beyond me. This guy sucked so bad, they let him be the champion 16 times and be the face of the NWA in the 80s. Yeah, he was soooo terrible...

I guess you didn't understand what Hogan meant about the Warrior angle. Read the quote again. True or flase, the Ultimate Warrior ended up losing the title less than a year after beating Hogan? McMahon tried to get the Warrior over by beating Hogan, but the majority of the fans didn't like the move over time. Next thing you know, Hogan gets his title back and the Warrior is never in the title picture again. Sounds like what Hogan said is true....

Again, Hogan said he would have loved to face STONE COLD Steve Austin since the fans would want to see that. Did the fans really want to see Hogan vs STUNNING Steve Austin? nope....

I have read Hogan's book. Very informative. It comes from his point of view. Just like your opinions are YOUR point of view, what Hogan wrote are his. For years people think your opinions are, well, full of shit.....

Stop hating on Hogan...

Prime , don't waste your time . This guy is beyond help when it comes to wrestling . Remember he turned his back not to long ago on his biggest hero in life in Bret Hart only to comeback crawling on his knees later .

The fact that some of the true legends in wrestling i.e HHH , HBK , the Undertaker , Stone Cold , Batista have all credited Flair for being the all-time greatest and the reason they got into the biz is somehow lost on him .


I was never a Hogan hater or huge Hogan fan either . But the truth is the man is overwhelmingy considered in the top two of all-time along with the ''Nature Boy ''

 

[The Fallen Angel]

I agree that Flair is waaaaaaaayyyyy overrated, does he suck? absolutely not. However he is not one of the greatest ever in my opinion, he would be outside my top 20-30

 

[SlaverTickler]

Prime , don't waste your time . This guy is beyond help when it comes to wrestling . Remember he turned his back not to long ago on his biggest hero in life in Bret Hart only to comeback crawling on his knees later.

My biggest hero in my life has always been my father, and in case you're wondering, he wouldn't have gone back to work for a company if their incompetence had caused his brother's death. I haven't come crawling back to anything, Hart is still and ass hole for going back to work for McMahon.

The fact that some of the true legends in wrestling i.e HHH , HBK , the Undertaker , Stone Cold , Batista have all credited Flair for being the all-time greatest and the reason they got into the biz is somehow lost on him .

HHH a legend, well... considering your low standards I can see how you might feel that way. The only thing HHH is famous for is sucking Vince's cock for years after the "MSG Incident", oh, and carrying Hall and Nash's bags back when he was playing Bitch-Boy to the kliq. The fact that you even consider a no talent muscle head like Batista to be a legend is solid proof that you are the one who is lost when it comes to pro-wrestling. Stone Cold and Undertaker are definitely legends, and I will tip my hat to Shawn Michaels, but remember two of them (Austin and HBK) were made on matches with Bret Hart. I guess if Orton is the Legend Killer, Hart must be the Legend Maker.

One question though? If Austin loved Flair so much why did he shit all over him for trying to keep Brian Pillman burried? I guess when you actually meet the man your opinion of him can chainge quite quickly.

I was never a Hogan hater or huge Hogan fan either . But the truth is the man is overwhelmingly considered in the top two of all-time along with the ''Nature Boy ''

Hogan could cut a great promo, but in the ring... seen him once seen him a million times. His cross over appeal is undeniable, and yes both he an Flair are legend, not because they are great, but because fans have all been brain washed into believing they were better then they are.

Flair sucked so bad, that he could even throw a convincing looking punch, but I am supposed to believe he is the greatest wrestler of all time... right.

 

[SlaverTickler]

I agree that Flair is waaaaaaaayyyyy overrated, does he suck? absolutely not. However he is not one of the greatest ever in my opinion, he would be outside my top 20-30

Nah, he sucks, he wouldn't even make 30 on my list. Considering Randy Savage vs Ricky Steamboat is considered to be one of (if not the) greatest match of all time (or at least ever recorded) not Savage vs Flair or Steamboat vs Flair, I think that pretty much speaks volumes about that useless puke.

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

My biggest hero in my life has always been my father, and in case you're wondering, he wouldn't have gone back to work for a company if their incompetence had caused his brother's death. I haven't come crawling back to anything, Hart is still and ass hole for going back to work for McMahon.




HHH a legend, well... considering your low standards I can see how you might feel that way. The only thing HHH is famous for is sucking Vince's cock for years after the "MSG Incident", oh, and carrying Hall and Nash's bags back when he was playing Bitch-Boy to the kliq. The fact that you even consider a no talent muscle head like Batista to be a legend is solid proof that you are the one who is lost when it comes to pro-wrestling. Stone Cold and Undertaker are definitely legends, and I will tip my hat to Shawn Michaels, but remember two of them (Austin and HBK) were made on matches with Bret Hart. I guess if Orton is the Legend Killer, Hart must be the Legend Maker.

One question though? If Austin loved Flair so much why did he shit all over him for trying to keep Brian Pillman burried? I guess when you actually meet the man your opinion of him can chainge quite quickly.



Hogan could cut a great promo, but in the ring... seen him once seen him a million times. His cross over appeal is undeniable, and yes both he an Flair are legend, not because they are great, but because fans have all been brain washed into believing they were better then they are.

Flair sucked so bad, that he could even throw a convincing looking punch, but I am supposed to believe he is the greatest wrestler of all time... right.

Dude , you talk out of both sides of your mouth . Your absolute hatred for Vince skews every apsect of your opinions on wrestling . Like the guy hate the guy ; I don't care . But you mention the MSG when people are talking about Gorgeous George , Sable or Abdullah the butcher . Get over it ....evidently Hart did

The fact that you DON'T consider HHH a legend shows you know NOTHING about pro wrestling .

You mention Steamboat , guess who made him a him a superstar? thats right Ric flair . It was actually Flairs idea to bring him in to start heat with him . Basically Steamboat came in for One Man Gang in a talent swap and the rst is history .

You gripe because HHH married into the McMahons . Bret Hart had the advantage of being in the most famous wrestling family along with the Von Erichs . Hart was a tagteam guy UNTIL Hogans first run was over with WWF . He only became a maineventer AFTER Hogan was done and they started looking for a replacement .

 

[SlaverTickler]

Dude , you talk out of both sides of your mouth . Your absolute hatred for Vince skews every apsect of your opinions on wrestling . Like the guy hate the guy ; I don't care . But you mention the MSG when people are talking about Gorgeous George , Sable or Abdullah the butcher . Get over it ....evidently Hart did

See this is why I try not to waist my time with you Flock, Hart had nothing to do with the "MSG Incident". Do you even know what the MSG Insodent is? And why should I give a flying fuck about what that ass hole sell out in pink tights thinks or likes. Anybody who would go back to work for the company who was to cheap to insure his brother’s safety is a low life.

The fact that you DON'T consider HHH a legend shows you know NOTHING about pro wrestling .

Boring matches, boring promos, yep, sounds like a legend to me.

You mention Steamboat , guess who made him a him a superstar? that’s right Ric Flair . It was actually Flairs idea to bring him in to start heat with him . Basically Steamboat came in for One Man Gang in a talent swap and the rest is history .

Yes, this is true, Flair claims he is the reason Steamboat was brought over to the NWA, but that doesn't change the fact that it is Savage vs Steamboat that is considered one of (if not the) greatest matches of all time.

You gripe because HHH married into the McMahon’s . Bret Hart had the advantage of being in the most famous wrestling family along with the Von Erich’s . Hart was a tag team guy UNTIL Hogan’s first run was over with WWF . He only became a Main Eventer AFTER Hogan was done and they started looking for a replacement .

You totally contradicted yourself. If being from a famous wrestling family was such an advantage, then why did Bret have to wait until Hogan left before he got the chance to main event. On top of that why didn't Ric want to work a program with Bret... aside from the fact that Bret wouldn't let him call the matches anymore because he kept trying to sabotage them.

I’ll make it simple, so you can understand it. I don't like Flair. His matches were boring, his promo's were retarded, in fact the only good thing about him where usually his 4 Horsemen running mates . He sucked then, he sucks now, and he will suck forever. I tip my hat to the “Nature Boy” for conning all of you into thinking he was ever any good at all.

By the way, your comments regarding the MSG Incident proves just how much of a fool you are, so I will be ignoring any comments you make about the industry from now on. You obviously have no clue to what your talking about.

 

[SlaverTickler]

Here is Ric in all his B.S. glory...

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... what an ass hole.

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

Here is Ric in all his B.S. glory...

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... what an ass hole.

that is edited

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

See this is why I try not to waist my time with you Flock, Hart had nothing to do with the "MSG Incident". Do you even know what the MSG Insodent is? And why should I give a flying fuck about what that ass hole sell out in pink tights thinks or likes. Anybody who would go back to work for the company who was to cheap to insure his brother’s safety is a low life.



Boring matches, boring promos, yep, sounds like a legend to me.



Yes, this is true, Flair claims he is the reason Steamboat was brought over to the NWA, but that doesn't change the fact that it is Savage vs Steamboat that is considered one of (if not the) greatest matches of all time.



You totally contradicted yourself. If being from a famous wrestling family was such an advantage, then why did Bret have to wait until Hogan left before he got the chance to main event. On top of that why didn't Ric want to work a program with Bret... aside from the fact that Bret wouldn't let him call the matches anymore because he kept trying to sabotage them.

I’ll make it simple, so you can understand it. I don't like Flair. His matches were boring, his promo's were retarded, in fact the only good thing about him where usually his 4 Horsemen running mates . He sucked then, he sucks now, and he will suck forever. I tip my hat to the “Nature Boy” for conning all of you into thinking he was ever any good at all.

By the way, your comments regarding the MSG Incident proves just how much of a fool you are, so I will be ignoring any comments you make about the industry from now on. You obviously have no clue to what your talking about.

why don't you just not comment then ???

you say you don`t watching the WWE anymore so you can't possibly really know whats going on .

you turned your back on your favorite wrestler when all you did was tell us how great he was ...

Prime & I can dislike a wrestler yet still give the man is due . you don`t seem able to.....whats up with that ?? 😱

the true greats like Undertaker , HBK and the like do nothing but idolize Flair . I would think these guys know more about the industry and doling out credit than you and me . So basically you are saying the wrestling icons are idiots that have no clue

its time to put you on ignore....have a nice day

 

[The Fallen Angel]

By the way, your comments regarding the MSG Incident proves just how much of a fool you are, so I will be ignoring any comments you make about the industry from now on. You obviously have no clue to what your talking about.

I don't think you do either, do you really know what the "incident" was? It wasn't that big of a deal and would be thought of as nothing now, and it was at a house show that the masses didn't even see. The WWE say they "punished" HHH but come on he got the IC title a few months later and became a star anyway, the incident is a non issue made out to be a huge deal by the IWC (internet wrestling community)

Also i can understand not liking Flair, i don't either but that doesn't mean the man sucked, overrated fine, but saying he sucked is just wrong. Your argument for him sucking which ive seen you use a few times also makes no sense. So because Savage and Steamboat had an amazing match and it didn't happen with Flair is proof Flair sucks? So by that token Shawn Michaels best match ever was with the Undertaker at Wrestlemania 25, does that mean Bret Hart sucks because it wasn't with Bret?

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

I don't think you do either, do you really know what the "incident" was? It wasn't that big of a deal and would be thought of as nothing now, and it was at a house show that the masses didn't even see. The WWE say they "punished" HHH but come on he got the IC title a few months later and became a star anyway, the incident is a non issue made out to be a huge deal by the IWC (internet wrestling community)

Also i can understand not liking Flair, i don't either but that doesn't mean the man sucked, overrated fine, but saying he sucked is just wrong. Your argument for him sucking which ive seen you use a few times also makes no sense. So because Savage and Steamboat had an amazing match and it didn't happen with Flair is proof Flair sucks? So by that token Shawn Michaels best match ever was with the Undertaker at Wrestlemania 25, does that mean Bret Hart sucks because it wasn't with Bret?

exactly...

Flair was the ultimate ''heel'' for years but most true wrestling fans respected the hell out of him for perfecting his craft .

 

[Heeko]

Wasn't Flair the one who put over the greatest wrestling superstar to never set foot in a WWE ring?

 

[SlaverTickler]

Wasn't Flair the one who put over the greatest wrestling superstar to never set foot in a WWE ring?

Wasn't it you who said New Jack was a great performer?

Oh wait, you mean Sting? That glorified 3 move bodybuilder... who cares. He's just anther guy who was in a company that had pretty much nobody. Flair used politicts and a lack of skill to fuck up everybody who was good like Scott Stiener, and since Sting had no real talent he was no real threat. Sting won't go to the WWE becuase he know Vince will screw him up and burry him out of spite for WCW and Ted Turner.

 

[SlaverTickler]

I don't think you do either, do you really know what the "incident" was? It wasn't that big of a deal and would be thought of as nothing now, and it was at a house show that the masses didn't even see. The WWE say they "punished" HHH but come on he got the IC title a few months later and became a star anyway, the incident is a non issue made out to be a huge deal by the IWC (internet wrestling community)

Also i can understand not liking Flair, i don't either but that doesn't mean the man sucked, overrated fine, but saying he sucked is just wrong. Your argument for him sucking which ive seen you use a few times also makes no sense. So because Savage and Steamboat had an amazing match and it didn't happen with Flair is proof Flair sucks? So by that token Shawn Michaels best match ever was with the Undertaker at Wrestlemania 25, does that mean Bret Hart sucks because it wasn't with Bret?

Was Shawn's best match at WM25? I don't know, I didn't watch WrestleMania 25, but regardless, the match that made Shawn a Superstar was the IC title match he had with Bret at Survivor Series 1992. Also, Bret's match with Davy Boy Smith at the Summer Slam 1992 is also in league for the "one of (if not the best) match's of all time" category. Come to think of it, all of Flair's comments about Bret could be applied to Shawn as well. When Hogan was main everything HBK was in a tag team, and it was during his run as champ that the ratings actually dropped and WCW began it run at number 1.

Next, you claim the MSG thing doesn't matter? Well it seemed to matter to Ric Flair, although he was kind of selective over who he pissed on for it. Then again at his age it's possible he forgot HBK and HHH had any part in it, unless of course he was just kissing their asses, but we all know the "greatest" wrestler of all time wouldn't feel the need to do that... would he?

 

[SlaverTickler]

that is edited

Amd your point is? Oh wait, I forgot who I was dealing with again, you never have a point. You just drink the Kool Aid and move on.

 

[The Fallen Angel]

Was Shawn's best match at WM25? I don't know, I didn't watch WrestleMania 25, but regardless, the match that made Shawn a Superstar was the IC title match he had with Bret at Survivor Series 1992. Also, Bret's match with Davy Boy Smith at the Summer Slam 1992 is also in league for the "one of (if not the best) match's of all time" category. Come to think of it, all of Flair's comments about Bret could be applied to Shawn as well. When Hogan was main everything HBK was in a tag team, and it was during his run as champ that the ratings actually dropped and WCW began it run at number 1.

Next, you claim the MSG thing doesn't matter? Well it seemed to matter to Ric Flair, although he was kind of selective over who he pissed on for it. Then again at his age it's possible he forgot HBK and HHH had any part in it, unless of course he was just kissing their asses, but we all know the "greatest" wrestler of all time wouldn't feel the need to do that... would he?

Yes Shawn's best match was Wrestlemania 25 it was likely the best match of all time, check it out.. But you still didn't defend your thinking on the x had a good match with y and not c so c sucks, that still makes no sense

Why would it have mattered to Ric Flair? Seeing as he wasn't even in the company in 96. and ive never said Flair was the greatest or anywhere near, just stating the MSG "incident" is nowhere near as big a deal as your trying to make it seem

 

[Heeko]

Wasn't it you who said New Jack was a great performer?

(1) I have no idea what you are talking about (2) What does New Jack have to do with Ric Flair?

Oh wait, you mean Sting? That glorified 3 move bodybuilder... who cares. He's just anther guy who was in a company that had pretty much nobody. Flair used politicts and a lack of skill to fuck up everybody who was good like Scott Stiener, and since Sting had no real talent he was no real threat. Sting won't go to the WWE becuase he know Vince will screw him up and burry him out of spite for WCW and Ted Turner.

I guess that's why he's won wrestler of the year, most popular wrestler of the year and almost every title belt you can in the business. Again you are clueless of what it takes to make it in the business. But I will agree that he will probably never set foot in a WWE ring because he refuses to work for Vince and also because he's not exactly young now.

 

[SlaverTickler]

(1) I have no idea what you are talking about (2) What does New Jack have to do with Ric Flair?

Sorry my mistake, though my point would have been if you think New Jack was good then how much could you really know about whats good... if that makes sence.

I guess that's why he's won wrestler of the year, most popular wrestler of the year and almost every title belt you can in the business. Again you are clueless of what it takes to make it in the business. But I will agree that he will probably never set foot in a WWE ring because he refuses to work for Vince and also because he's not exactly young now.

Thats the hype machiene. Sable came in 2nd for most improves wrestler of the year. All the wile Sable had no buisness being in the running (Rena is hot, but a boob job doesn't make you an improved wrestler). Same as Hogan and Flair getting "Wrestler of the Year" from PWI, there were lots of guys having better matchs then Hogan and Flair, but the hype machien built up the Hulkster and The Nature Boy so people actually believe they are the best. They are all brainwashed by the idustry. Titles aren't won, they are awarded by a comitty, and as I said he wasn't a threat in Flair's eye's so he didn't care about losing the title to him.

Watch Flair wrestle anybody (Steanboat, Sting, whoever) with the sound off, no promos, then watch Dynamite Kid wrestle Bret Hart during their time in Stampeed Wrestling under the same conditions. Hart/Dynamite will kill anything Flair does with anybody period.

Do you know why Ronnie Garvin got to be World Champion in the NWA?

With the NWA holding its first pay-per-view event Starrcade the same day WWF was holding its Survivor Series, Crockett chose to face the strong WWF competition by having Flair win the title. That meant Flair had to lose the title first and whoever beat him, would only be an interim champion. Most wrestlers declined the offer, but Garvin, assuming that at 42 it may be his last chance to hold the major NWA title, accepted to fill the role. Indeed, Garvin would hold the title for 2 months before losing it back to Flair at Starrcade.
-Wikipedia

What that basicly means is people in the NWA locker Room hated Flair so much that nobody wanted to become world champion just to drop it back to Flair 2 months later. Thats the kind of respect that prick comands in the locker room. If not for his age, Garvin probably would have said no as well.

 

[Heeko]

Sorry my mistake, though my point would have been if you think New Jack was good then how much could you really know about whats good... if that makes sence.

I don't give two shits about New Jack. What kool-aid have you been on?

Thats the hype machiene. Sable came in 2nd for most improves wrestler of the year. All the wile Sable had no buisness being in the running (Rena is hot, but a boob job doesn't make you an improved wrestler). Same as Hogan and Flair getting "Wrestler of the Year" from PWI, there were lots of guys having better matchs then Hogan and Flair, but the hype machien built up the Hulkster and The Nature Boy so people actually believe they are the best. They are all brainwashed by the idustry. Titles aren't won, they are awarded by a comitty, and as I said he wasn't a threat in Flair's eye's so he didn't care about losing the title to him.

Watch Flair wrestle anybody (Steanboat, Sting, whoever) with the sound off, no promos, then watch Dynamite Kid wrestle Bret Hart during their time in Stampeed Wrestling under the same conditions. Hart/Dynamite will kill anything Flair does with anybody period.

Do you know why Ronnie Garvin got to be World Champion in the NWA?



What that basicly means is people in the NWA locker Room hated Flair so much that nobody wanted to become world champion just to drop it back to Flair 2 months later. Thats the kind of respect that prick comands in the locker room. If not for his age, Garvin probably would have said no as well.

We seem to have the same idea on some of this. I'm well aware of the 'hype machine'. Actually it's called marketing, but that machine only works if the wrestler makes it work. Ironic as it sounds, pro wrestling has very little to do with actual wrestling. Good looks, charisma, attitude and the right gimmick with proper marketing will get you further ahead than if you had the wrestling skills of Kurt Angle x3.

Do you think people actually filled arenas to watch Andre the Giant wrestle? Hardly.

Do you think millions of ppv buys at Wrestlemania were because fans wanted to see Mr. T wrestle? Hardly.

Did Sunny become the most downloaded diva on the internet because she could wrestle? Um, no.

Most of the hostility comes from the changes in the industry which took place when Vince had the brainstorm that celebrity and hollywood were what people wanted to BUY and WATCH instead of so-called wrestling. The bottom line is getting butts in the seats. Much like the NFL became a totally different game in the mid 80s than in the 70s, pro wrestling did also. Problem is a lot of the veterans weren't happy about it.

Flair, Orndorf, Piper, Koloff, Mulligan, Brisco, Gagne, Backlund, Atlas, Patera, Wahoo - the list is endless - everyone of those guys busted their asses to make the business work and survive. They didn't have the luxury of a ppv every month or t-shirt sales or toys and video games and websites and wrestling shown 5 times or even more a week. They didn't have every performer you can name publish a book with their versions of 'what really happened'. Back in those days you would have been roasted if you would have even entertained such a crazy idea.

All these guys had was wrestling on saturday mornings. Yet they survived and endured when you actually had to make wrestling entertaining without the help. Those guys would get a two minute promo then go out and wrestle from 30 mins to an hour. They didn't waste time talking for 20 minutes just to have interference during the next 30 seconds after 5 minutes of pay for my time ads.

So you think Piper and Orndorf and probably just about every wrestler in the backroom was mad at T for invading their space? You're damn right and with good reason. But it wasn't personally directed at him because of him. They didn't like the idea of any celebrity waltzing in and getting the spotlight on their watch. It could have been Stallone or Arnold and it wouldn't have mattered.

That said - it's probably because of Vince's foresight the business has endured. If not for his celebrity intervention and proper marketing, WM would have probably been no better than Starrcade or any other ppv you've seen and pro wrestlers would have little or no jobs today, or at least ones with decent pay. Vince has his faults, but no one can deny he has done what it took to make pro wrestling mainstream and lucrative.

Good examples of marketing: Stone Cold is probably one of the top five names known in the business. But can he wrestle? If you call drinking fake beer and flipping people off and wrecking your pelvic area dropping yourself on a mat wrestling. Yet he's sold more t-shirts than any wrestler in the business.

Can the Rock wrestle? Actually he probably could if needed. He does have an athletic background. But he would rather raise his eyebrow and flip the crowd an elbow pad and talk smack on the mic even more. He is the most electrifying man in the business - but it isn't because of actual wrestling skill.

Hogan? We won't even go there. Open his wrestling routine playbook and you might find 6 moves, maybe 7. Hogan sucks. Yet he is the most popular wrestler on the planet even this many years after his prime years. Again, because of the proper marketing. He's been on every toy and just about every product aimed at anyone under age 10. Almost every kid and every adult today at some point has heard his name. But the man can't wrestle a lick.

But again, to be successful in the business you have to be able to work the marketing. Lots of guys have wrestling and athletic ability but lack the ability to speak publicly and the charisma to actually make people want to listen to what they have to say on the mic. Sadly because of this, most become mid-carders and underachievers. Then they blame politics, everyone and everything for their failure. Truth is, they can't make the marketing work because they lack the skill and bottom line - they can't put butts in the seats.

Again, looks, charisma and attitude and the right gimmick with proper marketing will get you way farther than any wrestling skills. Don't get me wrong, you still need some wrestling skills to pull it off completely. You can't look nice and talk forever. Eventually you're going to have to do something 'wrestling related' in the ring - but if they wanted actual wrestling skills it wouldn't be scripted.

 

[FlockOfSeagulls]

I don't give two shits about New Jack. What kool-aid have you been on?




We seem to have the same idea on some of this. I'm well aware of the 'hype machine'. Actually it's called marketing, but that machine only works if the wrestler makes it work. Ironic as it sounds, pro wrestling has very little to do with actual wrestling. Good looks, charisma, attitude and the right gimmick with proper marketing will get you further ahead than if you had the wrestling skills of Kurt Angle x3.

Do you think people actually filled arenas to watch Andre the Giant wrestle? Hardly.

Do you think millions of ppv buys at Wrestlemania were because fans wanted to see Mr. T wrestle? Hardly.

Did Sunny become the most downloaded diva on the internet because she could wrestle? Um, no.

Most of the hostility comes from the changes in the industry which took place when Vince had the brainstorm that celebrity and hollywood were what people wanted to BUY and WATCH instead of so-called wrestling. The bottom line is getting butts in the seats. Much like the NFL became a totally different game in the mid 80s than in the 70s, pro wrestling did also. Problem is a lot of the veterans weren't happy about it.

Flair, Orndorf, Piper, Koloff, Mulligan, Brisco, Gagne, Backlund, Atlas, Patera, Wahoo - the list is endless - everyone of those guys busted their asses to make the business work and survive. They didn't have the luxury of a ppv every month or t-shirt sales or toys and video games and websites and wrestling shown 5 times or even more a week. They didn't have every performer you can name publish a book with their versions of 'what really happened'. Back in those days you would have been roasted if you would have even entertained such a crazy idea.

All these guys had was wrestling on saturday mornings. Yet they survived and endured when you actually had to make wrestling entertaining without the help. Those guys would get a two minute promo then go out and wrestle from 30 mins to an hour. They didn't waste time talking for 20 minutes just to have interference during the next 30 seconds after 5 minutes of pay for my time ads.

So you think Piper and Orndorf and probably just about every wrestler in the backroom was mad at T for invading their space? You're damn right and with good reason. But it wasn't personally directed at him because of him. They didn't like the idea of any celebrity waltzing in and getting the spotlight on their watch. It could have been Stallone or Arnold and it wouldn't have mattered.

That said - it's probably because of Vince's foresight the business has endured. If not for his celebrity intervention and proper marketing, WM would have probably been no better than Starrcade or any other ppv you've seen and pro wrestlers would have little or no jobs today, or at least ones with decent pay. Vince has his faults, but no one can deny he has done what it took to make pro wrestling mainstream and lucrative.

Good examples of marketing: Stone Cold is probably one of the top five names known in the business. But can he wrestle? If you call drinking fake beer and flipping people off and wrecking your pelvic area dropping yourself on a mat wrestling. Yet he's sold more t-shirts than any wrestler in the business.

Can the Rock wrestle? Actually he probably could if needed. He does have an athletic background. But he would rather raise his eyebrow and flip the crowd an elbow pad and talk smack on the mic even more. He is the most electrifying man in the business - but it isn't because of actual wrestling skill.

Hogan? We won't even go there. Open his wrestling routine playbook and you might find 6 moves, maybe 7. Hogan sucks. Yet he is the most popular wrestler on the planet even this many years after his prime years. Again, because of the proper marketing. He's been on every toy and just about every product aimed at anyone under age 10. Almost every kid and every adult today at some point has heard his name. But the man can't wrestle a lick.

But again, to be successful in the business you have to be able to work the marketing. Lots of guys have wrestling and athletic ability but lack the ability to speak publicly and the charisma to actually make people want to listen to what they have to say on the mic. Sadly because of this, most become mid-carders and underachievers. Then they blame politics, everyone and everything for their failure. Truth is, they can't make the marketing work because they lack the skill and bottom line - they can't put butts in the seats.

Again, looks, charisma and attitude and the right gimmick with proper marketing will get you way farther than any wrestling skills. Don't get me wrong, you still need some wrestling skills to pull it off completely. You can't look nice and talk forever. Eventually you're going to have to do something 'wrestling related' in the ring - but if they wanted actual wrestling skills it wouldn't be scripted.

very well said ...

Vince changed the rules forever when he decided to hire Hogan from the AWA and bring him to the WWF . At that time wrestling was still very much regionalized and Vince wanted to go worldwide . Not sure that was ultimately the best thing for wrestling because that was downfall for AWA and Turner wrecked the NWA by turning it into WCW .

I'm old enough to remember Hogan from Japan & AWA and he actually was a decent tactical wrestler at one time . It wasn`t just clothelines , bodyslams , the bigboot and the legdrop . He was used alot of Suplexes , the abdominal stretch , sleeperholds and etc. I think when he came to WWF the theory with him is less is more .

Being a DFW native I cut my teeth on NWA/ WCCW and it was always cool to see the likes of Flair , Andre , Rude and others come through town 4 or 5 times a year . Being a workout rat since jr. high I've seen a ton of wrestlers at gyms over the years . Lex Luger , Tommy Rodgers of the Fantastics , Jeep Swenson , Gentleman Chris Adams , Michael Hayes , Kevin Von & Kerry Von Erich , Iceman King Parsons , and Jack Victory just to name a few

One summer at the gym me and my buddy had the great pleasure of meeting and getting workout tips from the great Tony Atlas . What a really nice and funny guy he is .

The point is these guys roamed from territory to territory at times and in order to succeed they have to have the charisma and wrestling basics to be successful

Back then these guys wrestled 30-45 minute matches in the main event and most regular matches went atleast 15 minutes . Hell nowadays most main eventers today struggle when a pay per view matches goes over 15 minutes .