We're Going To Space?

[Marquis De Sade]

There's a shuttle launch in about 10 seconds. Last flight for space shuttle Atlantis. I had no idea we were going to space. I usually don't even though I do watch and pay attention to the news somewhat.

I've seen in old videos and read about time where a space shuttle launches were a huge deal. People gathered round their TV's and radios and whatever in groups and it was this epic, epic event.

Now it seems I only hear about when we land. It'll be a 30 second clip of a shuttle having landed safely but I have no idea why they were up there in the first place.

Do we care? Does anyone still want to be an astronaut?

This Random Thought brought to you by Raisin Bran Cereal.

 

[PurpleStyle]

You have inadvertently summoned the local astrophysicist. Proceed with caution.

....We go into space ALL THE TIME!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_space_shuttle_missions#Launches_and_orbital_flights

I care. You should care. I'm nobody to tell people what they should and shouldn't care about - but this is an exception. Long story short; anybody with a decent view of history can see that humanity really only grows when we take risks and explore the boundaries of what we can and cannot do. Besides, we exponentially deplete resources as our already-barely sustainable world population rises. Plus, there is the unavoidable destruction of the Earth. Oh, and this. These types of things are potentially hazardous, too. Kind of puts things in perspective to realize we have all 7 billion eggs inside of a shooting range.

😀

 

[Marquis De Sade]

You have inadvertently summoned the local astrophysicist. Proceed with caution.

....We go into space ALL THE TIME!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_space_shuttle_missions#Launches_and_orbital_flights

I care. You should care. I'm nobody to tell people what they should and shouldn't care about - but this is an exception. Long story short; anybody with a decent view of history can see that humanity really only grows when we take risks and explore the boundaries of what we can and cannot do. Besides, we exponentially deplete resources as our already-barely sustainable world population rises. Plus, there is the unavoidable destruction of the Earth. Oh, and this. These types of things are potentially hazardous, too. Kind of puts things in perspective to realize we have all 7 billion eggs inside of a shooting range.

😀

*laughs* Thank you for the links. I do indeed care, to an extent though. You bring up the topic of how we deplete our resources, which is true. But looking for another planet to do the same thing to isn't the answer I believe. Anyway I haven't looked at the links yet so I could be talking out my ass here. I'll read 'em later this afternoon as I'm always curious about...well, everything. 😀

 

[Artoo]

Hooray! Project Orion will soon be underway!

 

[Angel77]

I used to want to be an astronaut. I'm still fascinated with astronomy and all but yeah, it doesn't seem to be a big deal anymore media-wise. I still will get up at 2am and head outside if there's a meteor shower coming.

Man, I remember every time there was to be a launch when I was as kid.........it was a big deal!!!!

Sadly, not so much anymore. 🙁

 

[Marquis De Sade]

I used to want to be an astronaut. I'm still fascinated with astronomy and all but yeah, it doesn't seem to be a big deal anymore media-wise. I still will get up at 2am and head outside if there's a meteor shower coming.

Man, I remember every time there was to be a launch when I was as kid.........it was a big deal!!!!

Sadly, not so much anymore. 🙁

Yup. That's what I was going on about. Just wodnering when that happened, that lack of interest.

Is it because we never found space aliens? Another planet with life? When we have found signs of life, it's like...germs.

Not something I'd throw a party about personally.

Shrug.

 

[Angel77]

Yup. That's what I was going on about. Just wodnering when that happened, that lack of interest.

Is it because we never found space aliens? Another planet with life? When we have found signs of life, it's like...germs.

Not something I'd throw a party about personally.

Shrug.

Perhaps that could be part of it. It started to lose the mystery of "what's out there."

The thing is, there is SO much out there to study!!!! Oh well, you're not alone in your wonder of space.

To infinity and beyond!

 

[seanwoj]

There's a shuttle launch in about 10 seconds. Last flight for space shuttle Atlantis. I had no idea we were going to space. I usually don't even though I do watch and pay attention to the news somewhat.

I've seen in old videos and read about time where a space shuttle launches were a huge deal. People gathered round their TV's and radios and whatever in groups and it was this epic, epic event.

Now it seems I only hear about when we land. It'll be a 30 second clip of a shuttle having landed safely but I have no idea why they were up there in the first place.

Do we care? Does anyone still want to be an astronaut?

This Random Thought brought to you by Raisin Bran Cereal.

I care somewhat, but not much.
Thank you Raisin Bran Cereal for your random thought.

 

[Bugman]

There's a shuttle launch in about 10 seconds. Last flight for space shuttle Atlantis. I had no idea we were going to space. I usually don't even though I do watch and pay attention to the news somewhat.

I've seen in old videos and read about time where a space shuttle launches were a huge deal. People gathered round their TV's and radios and whatever in groups and it was this epic, epic event.

Now it seems I only hear about when we land. It'll be a 30 second clip of a shuttle having landed safely but I have no idea why they were up there in the first place.

Do we care? Does anyone still want to be an astronaut?

This Random Thought brought to you by Raisin Bran Cereal.

You should have been around during the glory days of NASA, during the Mercury, Gemini and especially the Apollo programs. It was all over the news, and just about everybody knew the Astronauts names and faces. Of course, the Astronaut Corps was smaller then.

And watching Neil Armstrong take that first step on the lunar surface, live on TV..I know I'll never forget that. 😀

 

[50greg]

I agree with our local astrophysicist up there. It's critical for humanity's long term survival to move into space, and may be critical shorter term, as well. Governments around the world are spending trillions of dollars like-- well, like they have it. They don't. The way out, as far as I can see, is either wild inflation or a vastly larger human economy. One way to expand the economy is to bring in resources and opportunities from beyond Earth. A new industry is emerging, trying to do precisely that. Here's something to remember: The usual way to back the value of paper money is to have reserves of gold. There is vastly more gold iin the Solar System beyond Earth than in Earth.

 

[Marquis De Sade]

You should have been around during the glory days of NASA, during the Mercury, Gemini and especially the Apollo programs. It was all over the news, and just about everybody knew the Astronauts names and faces. Of course, the Astronaut Corps was smaller then.

And watching Neil Armstrong take that first step on the lunar surface, live on TV..I know I'll never forget that. 😀

I would've loved to have been. The closest I got was that Tom Hanks movie which first sparked this curiosity in me as to what happened. It's like we got all excited about the possibility and then when we didn't find anything, we all lost interest.

Personally, on the subject of space shuttles alone, I watched the launch this morning and have thought for a long time that the fuel they use, the giant fuel tanks and whatnot, seem pretty archaic to me. By now I suppose I expected us to have come up with some sort of alternative fuel to get us up there faster and allow us to go further. It's basically a giant flying car that costs a bazillion dollars.

Did the lose of interest have anything at all to do with the space shuttle that exploded? I watched that on Youtube and it was really, really sad. The teacher had all of her students watching. 🙁

 

[Angel77]

I would've loved to have been. The closest I got was that Tom Hanks movie which first sparked this curiosity in me as to what happened. It's like we got all excited about the possibility and then when we didn't find anything, we all lost interest.

Personally, on the subject of space shuttles alone, I watched the launch this morning and have thought for a long time that the fuel they use, the giant fuel tanks and whatnot, seem pretty archaic to me. By now I suppose I expected us to have come up with some sort of alternative fuel to get us up there faster and allow us to go further. It's basically a giant flying car that costs a bazillion dollars.

Did the lose of interest have anything at all to do with the space shuttle that exploded? I watched that on Youtube and it was really, really sad. The teacher had all of her students watching. 🙁

That's an interesting theory and I'm willing to bet that could be one of the reasons why some folks lost interest.

I remember watching it in school. I was in second grade and our entire school gathered in the gym to watch it. Very sad indeed.

 

[Marquis De Sade]

I agree with our local astrophysicist up there. It's critical for humanity's long term survival to move into space, and may be critical shorter term, as well. Governments around the world are spending trillions of dollars like-- well, like they have it. They don't. The way out, as far as I can see, is either wild inflation or a vastly larger human economy. One way to expand the economy is to bring in resources and opportunities from beyond Earth. A new industry is emerging, trying to do precisely that. Here's something to remember: The usual way to back the value of paper money is to have reserves of gold. There is vastly more gold iin the Solar System beyond Earth than in Earth.

The metaphor I would use with simply finding another place to mine is waking up one day, realizing your house is an absolute mess and instead of taking the time to clean it up, simply moving. And then doing the same thing all over again.

Or am I missing something?

 

[Bugman]

I would've loved to have been. The closest I got was that Tom Hanks movie which first sparked this curiosity in me as to what happened. It's like we got all excited about the possibility and then when we didn't find anything, we all lost interest.

Yeah, Apollo 17 was the last moon landing, in December 1972 and even by then interest was waning. It had become "routine" by then afterall.

Personally, on the subject of space shuttles alone, I watched the launch this morning and have thought for a long time that the fuel they use, the giant fuel tanks and whatnot, seem pretty archaic to me. By now I suppose I expected us to have come up with some sort of alternative fuel to get us up there faster and allow us to go further. It's basically a giant flying car that costs a bazillion dollars.

Did the lose of interest have anything at all to do with the space shuttle that exploded? I watched that on Youtube and it was really, really sad. The teacher had all of her students watching. 🙁

Well, the shuttle came along and it was new and exciting. Most people had stopped paying attention to the space program up till then. I think the lack of interest stems largely from the fact that Americans have notoriously short attention spans. Despite the two shuttle tragedies, I think most people though of space flight as "routine". That darn word again. 🙂 Another factor I suspect is the media lost intrest because space flight was no longer "sexy" so they just didn't cover it much.

 

[50greg]

The metaphor I would use with simply finding another place to mine is waking up one day, realizing your house is an absolute mess and instead of taking the time to clean it up, simply moving. And then doing the same thing all over again.

Or am I missing something?

I'd argue you are missing something. I'm not sure mining asteroids is necessary in the short term. If we send unmanned probes to assay asteroids and determine how much, if any, precious metals are there, I see no reason to mine it and bring the stuff here. Leave it there and use its value to underwrite XYZ. Of course, that would only work if all nations agreed to count that stuff as a source of wealth that could be so tapped. I'd also suggest we can do two things at once. Clean up the Earth, fine, but understand that keeping it clean over the long term will require doing things differently. One of those things may be reaching beyond Earth.

 

[Bugman]

I'd argue you are missing something. I'm not sure mining asteroids is necessary in the short term. If we send unmanned probes to assay asteroids and determine how much, if any, precious metals are there, I see no reason to mine it and bring the stuff here. Leave it there and use its value to underwrite XYZ. Of course, that would only work if all nations agreed to count that stuff as a source of wealth that could be so tapped. I'd also suggest we can do two things at once. Clean up the Earth, fine, but understand that keeping it clean over the long term will require doing things differently. One of those things may be reaching beyond Earth.

You posted some very intresting ideas here. 🙂

 

[PurpleStyle]

Sorry for the potential tl;dr, but for once I'm not railing against somebody's religious choice. Ahem, moving on...

I think the lack of interest stems largely from the fact that Americans have notoriously short attention spans. Despite the two shuttle tragedies, I think most people though of space flight as "routine". That darn word again. 🙂 Another factor I suspect is the media lost intrest because space flight was no longer "sexy" so they just didn't cover it much.

I think you hit the nail on the head with that assessment. We've been to space "a bazillion times" and therefore it isn't a big deal. That's part of the problem. The human spirit can be indomitable - when it has direction. That's something we don't have anymore.

The metaphor I would use with simply finding another place to mine is waking up one day, realizing your house is an absolute mess and instead of taking the time to clean it up, simply moving. And then doing the same thing all over again.

Or am I missing something?

The thing about this particular resource mine - is that is also our house! It isn't so much about cleaning up the mess as it is about trying to survive "under one roof". There are two options in going about surviving:

1. Limit the population growth. I won't even bother to get into how horribly awry this could go in any circumstance.

2. Spread beyond the Earth and attempt to populate the galaxy. I might be just a dreamer when I say things like this; but if we were to ever develop faster-than-light & terraforming technology; we could make use of many of the stars in our galaxy - and there are many. 🙂

I agree with our local astrophysicist up there. It's critical for humanity's long term survival to move into space, and may be critical shorter term, as well. Governments around the world are spending trillions of dollars like-- well, like they have it. They don't. The way out, as far as I can see, is either wild inflation or a vastly larger human economy. One way to expand the economy is to bring in resources and opportunities from beyond Earth. A new industry is emerging, trying to do precisely that. Here's something to remember: The usual way to back the value of paper money is to have reserves of gold. There is vastly more gold iin the Solar System beyond Earth than in Earth.

I'd argue you are missing something. I'm not sure mining asteroids is necessary in the short term. If we send unmanned probes to assay asteroids and determine how much, if any, precious metals are there, I see no reason to mine it and bring the stuff here. Leave it there and use its value to underwrite XYZ. Of course, that would only work if all nations agreed to count that stuff as a source of wealth that could be so tapped. I'd also suggest we can do two things at once. Clean up the Earth, fine, but understand that keeping it clean over the long term will require doing things differently. One of those things may be reaching beyond Earth.

I really like the way you think. Though in order to build the economy of tomorrow, we have to inspire the youth of today. I really think we could do that if we honestly tried. A mission to Mars perhaps. Though, believe me when I say I know exactly how difficult that would be.

Yup. That's what I was going on about. Just wodnering when that happened, that lack of interest.

Is it because we never found space aliens? Another planet with life? When we have found signs of life, it's like...germs.

Not something I'd throw a party about personally.

Shrug.

I would, considering this is as close as we've ever come to finding "life on another planet". Even microbial life on another planet would have massive impacts on both science and philosophy in general. I jumped for joy over the Phoenix spacecraft finding water on Mars. I was equally enthused when the LCROSS found a great deal of water on the moon.

Granted, I knew in the back of my mind that water existed in both places. I know it exists in other parts of the solar system, too. But to have concrete irrefutable evidence of it reflects human achievement. We have sent spacecrafts to other worlds, millions of miles away. The mathematics behind these missions are mind-bendingly complex - but also incredibly inspiring. Consider the Drake equation before poo-pooing microbes. 😛

 

[50greg]

Purple-- I like the way you think, too. Personally, I wouldn't support a Mars mission just to go to Mars, however. We should go to Mars intending to build a permanent human presence there-- and that program should be simply one aspect of overall science and technology and economic development policies.

I also think the obvious next big goal should be building an international base on the Moon. NASA would love leading such a project, too.

 

[PurpleStyle]

Purple-- I like the way you think, too. Personally, I wouldn't support a Mars mission just to go to Mars, however. We should go to Mars intending to build a permanent human presence there-- and that program should be simply one aspect of overall science and technology and economic development policies.

I also think the obvious next big goal should be building an international base on the Moon. NASA would love leading such a project, too.

Of course! I agree that we shouldn't just go there to say "we did it". Though my main point was more about inspiring the youth. The biggest problem I see in America isn't just the corrupt politics. I feel that's a symptom of an over-arching problem with having no direction as a civilization. We don't really strive for anything except for the quick gratification.

But I digress - actually putting boots on the ground on Mars would allow us to gather data on the planet that we couldn't otherwise with a robot. I think, unfortunately, that a long-term presence on Mars is many hundreds of years away. The effects of microgravity in prolonged spaceflight, coupled with radiation exposure make for a problematic journey.

Without going into too much detail; this is how a trip to Mars would go:
The astronauts (if any of them were even alive, which I seriously doubt) would arrive bloated and atrophied, with bones so brittle that they would likely break most of them upon landing (and then die), even on a world such as Mars with lower gravity than that of Earth's. Another reason to inspire the youth of today and tomorrow - better technology that DOESN'T INVOLVE A DAMN CELL PHONE! 😀

 

[usgrant]

At least in a "Democracy" you can choose your corrupt politicians.

 

[Bohemianne]

This Random Thought brought to you by Raisin Bran Cereal.

^ How far can this sponsor dispatch me? Where do I sign?

I need a long long vacation to the nearest blackhole. ASAP.

 

[50greg]

Of course! I agree that we shouldn't just go there to say "we did it". Though my main point was more about inspiring the youth. The biggest problem I see in America isn't just the corrupt politics. I feel that's a symptom of an over-arching problem with having no direction as a civilization. We don't really strive for anything except for the quick gratification.

But I digress - actually putting boots on the ground on Mars would allow us to gather data on the planet that we couldn't otherwise with a robot. I think, unfortunately, that a long-term presence on Mars is many hundreds of years away. The effects of microgravity in prolonged spaceflight, coupled with radiation exposure make for a problematic journey.

Without going into too much detail; this is how a trip to Mars would go:
The astronauts (if any of them were even alive, which I seriously doubt) would arrive bloated and atrophied, with bones so brittle that they would likely break most of them upon landing (and then die), even on a world such as Mars with lower gravity than that of Earth's. Another reason to inspire the youth of today and tomorrow - better technology that DOESN'T INVOLVE A DAMN CELL PHONE! 😀

I agree America needs a new sense of direction and purpose, and leading humanity in finally opening the inner Solar System to human exploration, settlement, and commerce could be a big part of that renewal.

I disagree with your depiction of the fate of the first Mars expedition, however. The fact is we're not going to send such an expedition until we know how to counter the problems involved, including the ones you point out. Research into those areas is already being pursued. Creating artificial gravity is one option, for example. I'd say, maybe with some good luck, the first permanent human base on Mars is decades away, not centuries.

 

[Marquis De Sade]

Sorry for the potential tl;dr, but for once I'm not railing against somebody's religious choice. Ahem, moving on...



I think you hit the nail on the head with that assessment. We've been to space "a bazillion times" and therefore it isn't a big deal. That's part of the problem. The human spirit can be indomitable - when it has direction. That's something we don't have anymore.



The thing about this particular resource mine - is that is also our house! It isn't so much about cleaning up the mess as it is about trying to survive "under one roof". There are two options in going about surviving:

1. Limit the population growth. I won't even bother to get into how horribly awry this could go in any circumstance.

2. Spread beyond the Earth and attempt to populate the galaxy. I might be just a dreamer when I say things like this; but if we were to ever develop faster-than-light & terraforming technology; we could make use of many of the stars in our galaxy - and there are many. 🙂




I really like the way you think. Though in order to build the economy of tomorrow, we have to inspire the youth of today. I really think we could do that if we honestly tried. A mission to Mars perhaps. Though, believe me when I say I know exactly how difficult that would be.



I would, considering this is as close as we've ever come to finding "life on another planet". Even microbial life on another planet would have massive impacts on both science and philosophy in general. I jumped for joy over the Phoenix spacecraft finding water on Mars. I was equally enthused when the LCROSS found a great deal of water on the moon.

Granted, I knew in the back of my mind that water existed in both places. I know it exists in other parts of the solar system, too. But to have concrete irrefutable evidence of it reflects human achievement. We have sent spacecrafts to other worlds, millions of miles away. The mathematics behind these missions are mind-bendingly complex - but also incredibly inspiring. Consider the Drake equation before poo-pooing microbes. 😛

LOL. Did you really just say poo-pooing? 😀

I must admit, I'm outta the loop when it comes to what's been going on at NASA and plans for Mars with the exception of something I saw on the History Channel the other night which featured a bunch of people figuring out how to design a suit that would withstand space dust. They built one suit and subjected it to a storm of kitty litter. The suit failed miserably.

But, your post is rather inspiring. I still hold firm that humans need to fix their shit here first though before fucking up another planet - which ultimately they will probably (probably), do. We're wrecking this one, so let's live up in space seems to be a flawed philosophy to me. Of course, that's not what you're saying or what our goals should be. And I agree. But I can't help but notice that history tends to repeat itself. Plus, we find a new place to live, we need money to make it happen. Lots of it. In this case. We go someplace for a bankroll to make it happen and before we get the check, we'll have to answer the age old questions: "When and how do I get my money back?" and "How am I going to make more from this investment?"

But, as I said, your post and what some others have said, are interesting and inspiring.

As for the youth of today having no direction, not being inspired and being on phones texting all day however, people have been saying that for centuries. And it's because of the youth of yesterday of which the same thing was said about, that we were in space in the first place.

 

[PurpleStyle]

I agree America needs a new sense of direction and purpose, and leading humanity in finally opening the inner Solar System to human exploration, settlement, and commerce could be a big part of that renewal.

I disagree with your depiction of the fate of the first Mars expedition, however. The fact is we're not going to send such an expedition until we know how to counter the problems involved, including the ones you point out. Research into those areas is already being pursued. Creating artificial gravity is one option, for example. I'd say, maybe with some good luck, the first permanent human base on Mars is decades away, not centuries.

I try to be hopeful and yet realistic about our situation at the same time. Artificial gravity is a tough pill to swallow. We could use high-density matter for "natural" gravity, but where would we get it? Or we could build a ship around a sufficiently large asteroid.. then the question is: how do we "capture" one, and is the thousands of a g it produces worth the resources and time? Any ideas I can come up with have problems attached to each one.

LOL. Did you really just say poo-pooing? 😀

That I did. 😛

I must admit, I'm outta the loop when it comes to what's been going on at NASA and plans for Mars with the exception of something I saw on the History Channel the other night which featured a bunch of people figuring out how to design a suit that would withstand space dust. They built one suit and subjected it to a storm of kitty litter. The suit failed miserably.

That's no surprise, there's no drag in space. if you can accelerate a grain of sand high enough, you can turn it into something more powerful than any bullet on Earth. If somebody designed a suit to withstand an impact from that, it would just spread the force across the suit and potentially weaponize that person. 😛

But, your post is rather inspiring. I still hold firm that humans need to fix their shit here first though before fucking up another planet - which ultimately they will probably (probably), do. We're wrecking this one, so let's live up in space seems to be a flawed philosophy to me. Of course, that's not what you're saying or what our goals should be. And I agree. But I can't help but notice that history tends to repeat itself. Plus, we find a new place to live, we need money to make it happen. Lots of it. In this case. We go someplace for a bankroll to make it happen and before we get the check, we'll have to answer the age old questions: "When and how do I get my money back?" and "How am I going to make more from this investment?"

On that I agree with you.. the biggest hindrance is all of the "red tape" one has to go through, because we're not a united civilization.

But, as I said, your post and what some others have said, are interesting and inspiring.

As for the youth of today having no direction, not being inspired and being on phones texting all day however, people have been saying that for centuries. And it's because of the youth of yesterday of which the same thing was said about, that we were in space in the first place.

That's true. Though I feel people are lazier and more complacent than they were before.

 

[50greg]

Purple--- The most common way being studied to produce artificial gravity is using centrifugal force as a substitute. There might be two ways to do that. One, have a centrifuge on the ship that could give each crew member time in "gravity" each day. Or two, rotate the entire ship around a fixed point-- a small asteroid would be an excellent counterweight to the ship-- so centrifugal force would push out on the crew.