The homeless in your town...

[steph]

Is this a problem where you live?
I just hopped off my shuttle bus this morning and was walking to the main hospital when I saw this lady. She was clapping her hands and saying "pancakes" over and over. AND she was staring at people!
Now, 2 thoughts occured to me:
1) SHE was the one causing the commotion, what right did she have to be staring at anybody?
2) Then I thought, "lady, you need to be walking TOWARDS the hospital, not away from it.


I don't live in a city, per se, more like a large town. Downtown, where I work, it's a huge problem, people are always beating them up. Fortunately, my home is in the burbs, where it's not such a big problem. So I got to wondering, if it's a problem where you live, how does the town deal with it?
XOXO

 

[alwayssilver]

The police actually round all the homeless on a bus, drive them 10 miles out of town, they make sure to take a lot of turns to so they can't remember their way back, and than they drop them off. It keeps our city streets clean of the less fortunate, and walking eye sores.

Of course this is a sarcastic statement, I think the fact that there are homeless people is a problem. But our attitudes towards them is the biggest one.

 

[maniactickler]

i say round them up and place them on an island somewhere in the north pacific. the weather is good there and they can enjoy a tropical paradise. plus it keeps the streets cleaner and safer for us. you kill two birds with one stone.

 

[chicago]

My opinion on the homeless changes all the time. I wouldn't say we have a big homeless problem here in Chicago, at least not in comparison to like LA or something, but I do regularly see crack heads asking for money, people sleeping on benches, etc.

Most of the time I feel sorry for these people, but then there are those times where I think "Why don't they just get a job, get help, go to rehab, etc?" I know it's not that easy though.

My father was homeless for about ten years and, with my help, is just recently starting to get his life back together. It is definitely not as easy as those who have it good seem to think it is. That said, where there's a will there's a way, and it is possible.

 

[Goodieluver]

Chicago mayor richard M Dayley made a choice on the homeless. He fenced off the underpasses of bridges where homeless people lived during winters so they couldnt sleep there anymore. Where they ended up...who knows

There is 1-2 homeless persons in my town here, pretty much you see one of them every day, he just walks from one end of town to another every day, during the winter he was found trapped in a heat exhaust vent of the main library. He's a decent guy and never caused trouble, just he's there

 

[steph]

Oh I'm sure it's no picnic.
We're more like LA in that aspect I think, (panhandlers) the weather's pretty mild most of the time. Here, they're more a danger to themselves, I think than anyone else. We're always getting them admitted and for the most part they fit the same profile. They'd had too much to drink, wander the streets in the dark and a car (which 9 times out of 10 I beleive never even saw them) hits them or runs them over.

Remember that whole de-institutionalization thing back in the 80s? The institutions were overcrowded and if the person wasn't some crazed axe murderer, they just released them into the general population. I wonder how many of these aren't cases like that, who now, for whatever reasons are facing problems with maybe drug/alcohol or AIDS-related delirium...

There seems to be different categories I notice. I think there are people who've just fallen on bad times, people who like being homeless (yes I see some!) and then those who probably belong in the custody of adult protective services, because they're psychologically incompetent and can't care for themselves.

That's a nice thing you did, helping your Dad.

XOXO
PS~Interesting goodie! They live under bridges out here too, mostly by the river. I'm not sure if fencing off would be do-able in this area.

 

[Goodieluver]

Oh I'm sure it's no picnic.
We're more like LA in that aspect I think, (panhandlers) the weather's pretty mild most of the time. Here, they're more a danger to themselves, I think than anyone else. We're always getting them admitted and for the most part they fit the same profile. They'd had too much to drink, wander the streets in the dark and a car (which 9 times out of 10 I beleive never even saw them) hits them or runs them over.

Remember that whole de-institutionalization thing back in the 80s? The institutions were overcrowded and if the person wasn't some crazed axe murderer, they just released them into the general population. I wonder how many of these aren't cases like that, who now, for whatever reasons are facing problems with maybe drug/alcohol or AIDS-related delirium...

There seems to be different categories I notice. I think there are people who've just fallen on bad times, people who like being homeless (yes I see some!) and then those who probably belong in the custody of adult protective services, because they're psychologically incompetent and can't care for themselves.

That's a nice thing you did, helping your Dad.

XOXO
PS~Interesting goodie! They live under bridges out here too, mostly by the river. I'm not sure if fencing off would be do-able in this area.

Yea, the genius idea, wanna get rid of em? just fence em away, heh

Ive spoken a few times with the homeless guy in dekalb, he seems rather decent, i just dont know his story. He's also not one of those change seeking persons, he just walks, and walks, and....walks

 

[isabeau]

if it hadn't been for mom being fairly well off and having a good daughter so to speak, she would probably have been on the streets, mumbling to herself, living in her own distorted world...i give to my local homeless shelter every month...not all homeless choose to be, there are those who lost everything and have nothing left...there are also the mentally ill, such as my mother, who either because they don't have family, or the means to pay, aren't in a psych hospital , where they belong...

if i had been first lady or President, the homeless would have been my platform..

 

[Mastertank1]

In Pittsburgh where I live now;

there is very little homelessness, because the people and the city government are so compassionate;
churches let them sleep in the basement and give them a meal or two a day.
Landlords with empty buildings often let homeless use them, free of charge, and get the electricity turned on and provide heat in the cold months!
There are very comprehensive programs to help them find homes.
Most of the very few long term homeless here are those who refuse all help, usually due to clinical paranoia, leading them to not want to have any fixed abode on the grounds that it would make them an easy target.

In NYC, where I moved from in 2004, homelessness was a MASSIVE problem.
50% of this country's homeless live in NYC!
In the 1970s and 1980s, busloads of homeless people and recently released mental institution inmates would arrive in northern Manhattan neighborhoods daily, discharge their 'cargo', and drive away. Each person had a cheap suitcase with a few articles of clothing, 50 or 100 dollars, and clean clothes on. This happened so often in the same spots that there was a small cottage industry of lowlife street hustlers waiting around just to rob these unfortunate people as soon as the bus left, or sometimes even while the driver watched and did nothing. I HAVE SEEN THIS HAPPEN WITH MY OWN EYES!
In the 1990s the practice stopped because the New York State Attorney General sued the various states of origin in Federal court. Some of them tried transferring them to commercial busses in New Jersey which would let them off at one of the two Port Authority Bus Terminals in Manhattan, but that ended because the commercial bus lines started not accepting them as passengers and reporting the matter to the local New Jersey police, which arrested several of the drivers and handlers.

The city government of NYC is caught in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation between two different groups of liberal, bleeding-heart, self appointed 'advocates for the homeless'.

One group takes the attitude that the homeless are all incompetent and must be taken care of regardless of their own wishes in the matter. They have obtained court orders requiring the NYPD to take the homeless in to shelters against their will if they do not consent to go.

As soon as the city government began to comply with that court order, a second group, taking the contrary attitude that the homeless have a right to choose to remain homeless, got another judge to issue a cease and desist order forbidding the police to take anyone to a shelter against their will.

Both orders, last I heard, remained in force. It is not possible to obey one without violating the other. I think they should lock the two judges in a room and make them fight it out, or maybe the two groups of 'advocates for the homeless' or maybe both.

The problem is compounded by two other factors;
1-The homeless shelters in NYC are a f****** SNAKE PIT! They are dangerous, unhealthy, generally disgusting and insecure. No item of value is safe unless you are either part of a gang or as an individual are either so bad or so insane that no one is willing to mess with you! There are very good, very sane reasons to prefer homelessness on the streets to entering those shelters!
2-NYC has about 90% of a group very rare elsewhere; working homeless.
These are individuals who hold regular, full time jobs, but who simply cannot earn enough to afford housing anywhere in the city, often because they have a family to support.

In NYC the working homeless have constructed several more or less permanent towns or villages in various unused spaces around the city. They often have pirated electricity and heating, and are expert at patching up discarded appliances so that they more or less work. They use any materials they can scrounge. Abandoned cargo containers are fought-over prizes! So are stacks of wooden cargo pallets. Any construction site must be guarded at night to prevent theft of literally anything useful. It's not just anything not nailed down. If it's not guarded too, they'll pry out the nails! There are towns of as many as a couple of thousand people in some places.

It's a serious problem, and no one I know of has solved it yet.

 

[Goodieluver]

In my upper class, white, conservative town (that should be read to reek of my distaste) there has only been one homeless person that I've been aware of. There are others I'm sure.

The city bought him a bus ticket and sent him to Chicago just to get him out of town. No joke.

Around here it's "let's not ugly up the pretty place with homeless people. We'll just send them somewhere else".

Heh wow, never heard of a city sending its problems somewhere else like that before

 

[Mastertank1]

Check out my earlier post in this thread.

Heh wow, never heard of a city sending its problems somewhere else like that before

Cities and towns in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana and Arkansas used to send them to NYC in chartered busses!
They sent both homeless and recently released (for budgetary reasons, not because they were well) mental institution inmates until they were ordered to stop by Federal courts.
Personally, I thought that was a disgusting shirking of responsibility.

 

[Chuck D]

Clearly she was celebrating her love for pancakes, and probably hoping someone would clap and say it with her.. I usually skip threw the grocery store and shout "dr. pepper!!" repeatedly whenever i feel that people aren't getting the message that it should be greatly appreciated.

 

[steph]

Hmph, I leave you for a few hours and see what happens~how did some of you get to be so smart?

Seriously though. It's getting to be pretty bad out here too. Those who live on the streets are extremely territorial MasterT. They fight over "prime real estate," rob each other for food stamps, light each other on fire, we see it all too often.

Goodie~we have a very long, very popular bike path that a good part runs parallel to the river or close to it, it's why the fencing wouldn't work here. Too many people rely on the bike path to get to University, their jobs, etc.
You know, a few years back, there was a proposal to convert one of the closed Army barracks into housing for the homeless here. I don't know exactly what happened other than the locals went ballistic and the idea died out in a hurry. I'm guessing one of the politicians killed it.

XOXO

PS~and spanks for Chuck! 😛

 

[Goodieluver]

Hmph, I leave you for a few hours and see what happens~how did some of you get to be so smart?

Seriously though. It's getting to be pretty bad out here too. Those who live on the streets are extremely territorial MasterT. They fight over "prime real estate," rob each other for food stamps, light each other on fire, we see it all too often.

Goodie~we have a very long, very popular bike path that a good part runs parallel to the river or close to it, it's why the fencing wouldn't work here. Too many people rely on the bike path to get to University, their jobs, etc.
You know, a few years back, there was a proposal to convert one of the closed Army barracks into housing for the homeless here. I don't know exactly what happened other than the locals went ballistic and the idea died out in a hurry. I'm guessing one of the politicians killed it.

XOXO

PS~and spanks for Chuck! 😛

The fencings happened in chicago by interstate\expressway bridges that were away from the public pretty much. Also, last year a guy was found INSIDE one of the suspension bridges over the chicago river, he broke in and lived inside there, he had an outlet there so he could run a space heater and microwave

 

[Mastertank1]

In NYC when I was last there....

Hmph, I leave you for a few hours and see what happens~how did some of you get to be so smart?

Seriously though. It's getting to be pretty bad out here too. Those who live on the streets are extremely territorial MasterT. They fight over "prime real estate," rob each other for food stamps, light each other on fire, we see it all too often.

Goodie~we have a very long, very popular bike path that a good part runs parallel to the river or close to it, it's why the fencing wouldn't work here. Too many people rely on the bike path to get to University, their jobs, etc.
You know, a few years back, there was a proposal to convert one of the closed Army barracks into housing for the homeless here. I don't know exactly what happened other than the locals went ballistic and the idea died out in a hurry. I'm guessing one of the politicians killed it.

XOXO

PS~and spanks for Chuck! 😛

There were major homeless towns in several places. They mushroom up in abandoned waterfront and warehouse properties, in long stretches of abandoned subway tunnels, in a disused underground railyard, in little used sections of parks (NYC has a couple of parks that are larger than many towns, such as Prospect Park in Brooklyn, Pelham Bay Park in the Bronx, and a group of adjacent parks in Staten Island). The biggest I knew of was in a wierd structure that even most New Yorkers don't know about.
There's a section of the old West Side Highway, up the Hudson River side of Manhattan Island. It's elevated about 25 feet, on average, above the ground below. At some point someone got the bright idea of building walls with lots of windows along both sides, for a distance of some 25 blocks, which is about a mile and a quarter. The ground within these walls was leveled and paved over, and was supposed to be rented out in blocks to people who would build internal divider walls and even buidings inside. It never happened. No one who ever rented the space for any use but parking lots, and even that stopped when the area along the highway became economically depressed in the 1930s.
Around 1999, there was a town of homeless under there. There were a couple of thousand makeshift residences, inhabited by from 1 to 5 people each. The area is 1.25 miles long by 8 traffic lanes wide, and has wind and weather stopping walls along both sides. There were huge numbers of broken windows, but those had been stopped up with wood and plastic.
The residents there paid 'taxes' in kind to a town 'government'. They had a 'mayor' and 'police force' of their own. Wild. They pirated water and electricity from city pipes and cables.
I think Giuliani had them chased out and the shanties razed, because the whole thing was an incredible fire hazard.
There were also major homeless towns in abandoned warehouse buildings that were built long, long ago under the approach ramps on the Manhattan sides of the Brooklyn, Manhattan and Williamsburg bridges. I'm not talking shanties here; these were solid brick buildings, some as much as 8 stories tall. No one ever rented the space in them for very long due to the noise and vibration.

 

[brianspencer66]

Mastertank is quite correct about the homeless situation here in NYC. I live out in Far Rockway near Kennedy Airport and in order to get into Manhattan we need to take the "A" 8th Avenue Express subway train. Many days on the way into Manhattan there are loads of homeless people sleeping in filthy blankets in the subway cars. The train stops by the airport on the way into the city and many a first time tourist to the city board the train and this is the first impression they get of New York city which is highly upsetting. For the most part the city's way of dealing with the problem is not too. Its seems only when there is a presidental convention that the police seem to do sweeps in midtown manhattan and move the homeless to undisclosed locations. About 13 years ago in the East Village, New Yorks Tompkins Square Park was sort of a shanty town with small huts and tents where the homeless lived. The city under Mayor Dinkins decided to take action and this resulted in a full blown riot where everyone in sight included non homeless people walking the streets were assaulted by out of control cops. This was the city's way of dealing with getting rid of the homeless in that park. But as Tank mentioned the probem intitially started years before the riots and go back to the late 70's early 80's when NY state under Gov Cuomo started letting people out of mental institutions and dumping people on the streets. The city shelters and the streets were overwhelmed with the shelters being a pig sty with vermon, lice and ruthless wanton criminality to the point where many would rather take their chances on the street and sleep in the subways in the winter. NYC is also notorious for very aggressive pandhandling and every New Yorker will tell you that they are asked for money all the time on the streets and always on the subways.

 

[steph]

Yep, that's the movement I was talking about, the de-institutionalization.
I don't imagine the panhandlers are all that much different here than they are there. My personal faves are the ones that ask you for money, you tell them, "I'm sorry, all I'm carrying right now is my credit card" and then they insult you!

And then, there was the guy I saw by the freeway one day, his sign said, "Cold, hungry, someone stole all my stuff. Please help." I drove the 2 blocks home, rummaged thru my purse and found a giftcard for Subway maybe worth $10, rummaged thru my closet and found an ex-boyfriend's jacket (why I still had the damn thing, I still don't know) but man, this guy looked at me like I was his fairy Godmother. He got all teary-eyed and everything. "It's not much I told him, sorry." I was in between jobs at the time and money was SO tight. "Don't be sorry, you're the nicest person I've met all day," he told me. (Sighs) Too bad those who really need the help get lumped in with the rest of the bad seeds. You really can't judge a book by the cover, eh? 😉
XOXO

But as Tank mentioned the probem intitially started years before the riots and go back to the late 70's early 80's when NY state under Gov Cuomo started letting people out of mental institutions and dumping people on the streets. The city shelters and the streets were overwhelmed with the shelters being a pig sty with vermon, lice and ruthless wanton criminality to the point where many would rather take their chances on the street and sleep in the subways in the winter. NYC is also notorious for very aggressive pandhandling and every New Yorker will tell you that they are asked for money all the time on the streets and always on the subways.

 

[isabeau]

steph that was very nice of you..i wanted to do that at Christmas when we were sitting at an intersection in another town, and this guy had a sign saying "homeless, please donate" but david wouldn't let me..said the guy didn't look hungry..then when we got to his brother's place, i mentioned seeing this guy, and david's brother says he hangs out there every day..he could have used that time to try and find a job...

and my bad..i didn't realize you asked how the town deals with it..i don't know how our town deals with the homeless..but a trial is upcoming in which a homeless man was beaten to death..we do have a pretty nice shelter, as i said i donate there every month...the shelter not only feeds and shelters them, they try to educate them and/or help find them employment...

 

[lespieds]

Here in my city - I don't really know where the homeless hang out. This city has a lot bigger issues. In this city and my old one - They had shelters where homeless could stay on really bad weather nights. I guess the city just sees them as being there, kinda neutral

I used to live in a town with a lot of homeless.
Most of them were quite harmless.

I asked a couple of them [in a polite manner] why they prefer to be homeless. They would say that they just don't want to have to deal with all the responsibilities of normal life.
Everyone has their level of what they want or need. Some need to have a complex yet lucrative life, and some people can deal with owning little to nothing. I do not judge how people choose to live.

I never gave them a hard time even tho I saw them a lot in the store I worked at, I figured they didn't have 1/2 the things I enjoy and didn't need anyone giving them more shit. Most homeless are more friendly than some rich bitch, I guarantee you that...

If you ever talk with then you discover that they are human just like the rest of us.
And it is a fact - that is how they want to live usually. Some will even tell you that. I don't say this in a "hell with them they chose that".

 

[Chuck D]

Sad homeless story

For around 10 years there was a homeless guy that walk back and forth every day between a couple of towns on maui.. he walked back and forth on a stretch of road call 'The Pali'(pronounced like - polly) so he pick up the nickname 'The Pali Walker'.. The thing about him though, he never asked anyone for anything.. people would give him food at times and he would be appreciative.. but as far as i know, he never begged for anything.. most residents on maui know of him because he is seen walking the same stretch of road every day.. and he walks on the side of the road with traffic coming at him so no one would stop and ask if he wanted a ride.. few months ago i realized i hadn't seen him in a long time so i started asking around.. turns out he had amnesia.. found out that he had been invited to church and went.. while they were singing songs he remembered some of them.. to make a long story short, 10 years ago he was on a business trip, and was jumped and beaten badly.. ever since he had been just walking around unable to remember who he was or what was going on.. after authorities found out who he was, he has been flown back to his family.. apparently he also had wife, but i don't know the story more than that.. he had been missing for the entire time.. its ashame for something like that to happen..

 

[locker669]

I work in Worcester and I see a person with a "Vietnam Vet please help" sign at a busy intersection. There used to be a bunch of them standing at intersections asking for moneyu. It got so bad we got letters in the mail from a non profit organization asking not to give them money but to donate it to them. It was an organization that helped homeless get back on their feet.

 

[steph]

Oh. Well thanks Izz, like I said, it was nothing, I'd have gladly done more. It was nice to see the look in his eyes, someone truly grateful for such a small gesture.

And I know about the kids HappyBoy. One of my towns biggest charity drives (and a personal favorite of mine) goes down at the start of every winter, for the Wynd Youth Center, which houses, feeds and clothes homeless kids. Though most are in their teens, primarily runaways or "throwaways," they have kids there as young as two. TWO. Homeless at two. What the heck is wrong with our society? We all know what a joke the CPS system is, but that's just wrong beyond words.
XOXO

40% of the nations homeless are children. Homelessness should be this countries #1 priority!!!

 

[Mr. Blue]

Mastertank and Brian pretty much nailed the NYC Homeless problem...so I don't have to write much more on it. I can say that a lot of homeless people are good people that just slipped through the cracks.

When I lived in the city I befriended one or two homeless people and they really were some of the nicest people you'd ever want to meet...I did my best to help them out and one actually did get on his feet and we still write back and forth.

Now I live in the suburbs you don't see the homeless problem as much. There is one though and he hangs out in one grocery store, he collects cans, etc, and is a working homeless person. Him I give money to regularly and also set aside all my recycled cans, etc, for him to cash in...instead of just letting the garbage men pick it up. I wish I could do more though...sometimes life just deals a person a bad hand and they need a little help.

 

[locker669]

Every time I visit my brother and sister in New York i'm sickened by the homeless. They get treated worse than rabid street dogs. =QUOTE]

Do you think it's because people in NY are desensitized by it? I mean the first homeless person you see begging for change you feel sorry for. But what happens when the 100th person in as many days is doing the same thing? Maybe people don't do anything about it is because they don't notice it anymore.

 

[steph]

I dunno. Do you think you can get to a place when you "don't notice it anymore"? When you see it all the time? I think the challenge we face is how to help those who truly are in need, like the gentleman I helped by the side of the road and how to NOT enable the ones whose eyes you can look into and just tell, whatever $ you give them is going to contribute to some sort of alcoholic haze, or something they're injecting from a lighter-heated spoon...
XOXO

Do you think it's because people in NY are desensitized by it? I mean the first homeless person you see begging for change you feel sorry for. But what happens when the 100th person in as many days is doing the same thing? Maybe people don't do anything about it is because they don't notice it anymore.