Tickling, for FUN or for PAIN??

[MistressValerie1]

Many normal people, male and female, have fantasies of being dominated or even sexually assaulted, but they enjoy this only in fantasy. Likewise, many people enjoy reading or writing about extreme scenarios that they would never want to enact in real life.

I've always enjoyed reading Milagros' true-life experiences, because I know they are consensual He is an outstanding author, and I've even been honoured to have two of his experiences posted at my former Yahoo Group.

On the other hand, I personally dislike extreme sadomasochistic fantasies, and as a group/forum owner, I have decided to prohibit that kind of material at my own sites. Among my members, about half would like to see more-violent material, and about half want to keep it the way it is. I have decided to err to the side of caution in this regard.

I applaud TT for allowing a wide range of material, including my own stories (which some people might consider disturbing because of the foot-domination aspect). Still, I can understand the desire for a subforum to house the more-extreme stories. I'm not sure if it would be practical to subdivide the story section, because it would create a lot of work for the moderators (vetting every story, moving material back and forth), so the system now in place is probably the best for now: having the authors label their own work as extreme.

Quot homines, tot sententiae

Love to all,

 

[tukano_2]

there are two types of non consensual tickling .....consensual-non consensual tickling where it is just sort of a turn on/game to act like it is against their will when in fact it totally is wanted, or the real form of non consensual when the victim truley does not want it at all. the second is what i find similar to rape.

Exactly, and:
1) Milagros' stories, as well as other extreme stories posted here and in other forums, belong to the first category (consensual-non consensual tk), since they are fantasies that the writer feels to share with other people with similar tastes.
2) People doing non consensual tk, non consensual at the extent to be considered abuse and involving other form of violence and constriction, are criminals and need professional psychiatric help.

It's perfectly understandable that you may not like Milagros' and similar stories, sometimes they are a bit too much for me too, but still they have the right to post them and there are many people here interested in them.
I think everyone in here understand your point; if we can say that those stories are not to be considered as comparable to incitation to or praise of rape, we all just need to learn to skip what we don't like or we are not interested in.

...
I'm not sure if it would be practical to subdivide the story section, because it would create a lot of work for the moderators (vetting every story, moving material back and forth), so the system now in place is probably the best for now: having the authors label their own work as extreme
....

Perfectly agree

I saw your country of origin and to be quite honest I assumed English was your first language and that you moved to Italy later in life.

Never gone outside Italy before I was 32, so far never gone in a anglophone country. However thank you again Actually what really let me learn English was reading tickling stories, browsing tickle forums and chatting with people from all around the world about tickling! That could be a good promotion for tickling: it improves your education I'm trying to do the same with German, which I'm learning.

...I do sometimes like to fantasize that I am being dominated.Not raped, per se, but more like being forced upon. I guess that makes me strange or abnormal...but then...that doesnt really bother me anymore.

From polls and scientific researches in a wide variety of magazines and books, and from what I heard from women I knew personally it is a quite common female fantasy, without need or will to turn it into reality. I think that outside this forum you would be considered much more strange or abnormal for your love for tickling

 

[MistressValerie1]

Hi, Tukano; I'd like to second what Nessie said, that you (and also fellow Italian Kalamos) write English better than most native English-speakers It's always a pleasure to read your posts.

 

[alf1]

I applaud TT for allowing a wide range of material, including my own stories (which some people might consider disturbing because of the foot-domination aspect). Still, I can understand the desire for a subforum to house the more-extreme stories.

That's true the TT forum allows to express each persons points of view and likes/dislikes. After it's up to you to see material you want. It still exist some that see material clearly stated and after are saying : oh it disturbs me.
Some ask for less foottickling / no nudity in clips or pix / clips redoing themselves by miracle to be viewed / more upperbody tickling and on and on.
It's not a shop though

A little bit digressed. Nevermind

 

[tukano_2]

Hi, Tukano; I'd like to second what Nessie said, that you (and also fellow Italian Kalamos) write English better than most native English-speakers It's always a pleasure to read your posts.

Thank you so much! But to be honest, Kalamos is far better than me with English!

 

[Soulreaper]

tickling

Totally agree about situations where the victim has been forced into it and has not agreed - def not on, but I don't think theres a problem with someone being tied and tickled to the point of begging for mercy if theyve agreed to it beforehand - maybe a good idea to have a safeword if the 'lee has never been tied and tickled before though.

Personally i find the idea of being tied and mercilessly tickled by a girl a big turn on - and part of that is knowing I would be powerless to do anything about it. Would definitely need to be someone I trust though, i.e they wont run off with my wallet or start any other forms of BDSM that Im not into. I have yet to be tied and tickled bya girl, so I dunno exactly how much Id enjoy it, or even if Id be very ticklish, cos though its a big fantasy, I havent been tickled since I was a kid. Im also into the more gentle playful side of tickling.

As regards violence - I dont get off on that at all, and 'lees losing control of bodily function doesnt float my boat either. I can live with a bit of spanking in a tickle video but if it gets to extremes (where the 'lee is obviously in pain) then I wouldnt wanna watch it. As regards anything involving rape or the like - well thats just disgusting and I dont understand why anyone would be into it - and my heart goes out to the person who posted here about being put in that situation.

 

[Johnny21]

Hi FeatherFeet!My opinion on your first,long text is that YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!And I will be honest:I am a visual type,and when I read the Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen story,I ALMOST THREW UP!!!You're right about those "sickos",too!THEY SHOULD VISIT OTHER SITES ON THE WEB,WHERE PAIN IS USUAL IN TICKLING!

 

[TickledToDeath]

Where is the line drawn? And who draws it? Is INTENSE tickling considered violent? Who is to judge IF the people partaking in a very intense level of tickling and or tickle torture are INTO it and in a sense LOVING it that it is wrong or sick? While I do not know exactly what you are refering to that made you post this I can only presume that what you saw was far beyond even the most intense tickling imaginable but then again, IF those involved were into it then....... . There are things out there in the S/M world that most of us would consider sick but those people are into that so who are we to judge them.

I myself and others that I know are into all levels of tickling from mild and playful to very intense and merciless and I can take what I dish out if not more. Limits are always respected and I guess if you purposely go beyond ones' requested limits would be condidered unethical if the person truly cannot handle it and it becomes totally a painful experience both physically and psychologically.

TTD

 

[TickledToDeath]

Hi FeatherFeet!My opinion on your first,long text is that YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!And I will be honest:I am a visual type,and when I read the Mary-Kate and Ashley Olsen story,I ALMOST THREW UP!!!You're right about those "sickos",too!THEY SHOULD VISIT OTHER SITES ON THE WEB,WHERE PAIN IS USUAL IN TICKLING!

I came into this thread far into it. Where is this Mary Kate and Ashley story you refer to so I can see what is going on and get brought up to speed here.


TTD

 

[TickledToDeath]

After reading a couple of posts I wish to make comment that, sexual assualt or rape is NOT tickling and has no room whatsoever in a tickling scene/session or scenario. THAT type of violence is UNacceptable whether it be fantasy or otherwise in a tickling forum or session.
Merciless tickling while tied and vunerable IS just fine if and when agreed upon.
Tickling to the point of peeing is another story and again if it is fine by the participants, there is NO problem with that. I have done THIS to a few victims in my day(by accident really) and was told afterwards by said ticklees that it was a very intense experience. They were NOT angry. Those and others have vowed to get me back by doing the same to me and have failed to do so and I would NOT be mad at them for doing so IF they were to succeede. Violence is altogether another story and beating, raping and sexual assult is definitely wrong and has no room in tickling.

As far as specifics go here and to specific stories told and or real actions taken upon someone.......I know not of what you speak and cannot comment at this time in this post.


TTD

 

[gimboid3642]

i quite agree

 

[TickledToDeath]

General Statement

There are laws which control peoples actions. That is a good thing.
Freedom is good too to be able to do as you please to a degree. That is a good thing.
To control thoughts? :wooha: No. Not good at all. Freedom of THOUGHT cannot and should not be infringed upon so long as certain thoughts remain just that. Thoughts. Sharing thoughts in words through the spoken and the written is also a freedom that should not be taken away or controled but if actions are taken past that barrier and it infringes upon anothers saftey and well being, therein comes the control of actions through the Laws.
Big difference.
In addition everyone has a right to their own opinion as well and should be respected for it.
That is what makes us all unique and individual.
Another good thing.


TTD

 

[TickledToDeath]

Hmmmmm, people commenting on the Milagros story of the victim being tickled for life.....what if there was a story of someone or people who spent their lives tickling and then upon dying went to hell where he/she/they spent the rest of eternity being tickled non-stop?
Would that person who wrote that story be considered a "sicko"?

TTD

 

[TickledToDeath]

Ness

There is consensual tickling, non-consensual tickling, and then there is consentual non-consensual tickling where the 'lee is totally at the 'ler's mercy but where there IS trust that it won't go too far.
Completely non-consensual tickling is something people like to talk about but it is best left to fantasy. You have to be a pretty sick bastard to do it in real life. It's the fetishist equivelant of rape.

You forgot Non consensual consensual tickling. :weird:



TTD

 

[nessonite1]

You forgot Non consensual consensual tickling.

LOL! If you can come up with a definition I'll add it to the list.

 

[MistressValerie1]

I came into this thread far into it. Where is this Mary Kate and Ashley story you refer to so I can see what is going on and get brought up to speed here.


TTD

Here it is: http://www.tickletheater.com/showthread.php?t=10554

 

[Avenger314]

Hi all. For the most part I've been a lurker here for the past couple of years, but I want to throw my two cents in. (warning: Long post).

My feelings on this matter are pretty ambivalent, with all sides bringing in good arguments.

I often jokingly say that tickling is S&M for the squeamish. In a way, it's sort of true though--exercise of control, producing a specific reaction, and so on. There's no crash of the whip, rope marks, or blood involved, plus the hysterical laughter seems more soothing.

This leads me to my next point. Tickling is tickling. Beatings are beatings. Rape is rape. And they're extremely different. Tickling someone against her will for 2 hours is wrong, certainly. Beating someone up for 2 hours is many, many times worse. And raping someone is a thousand times worse. In my mind, they are honestly not equivalent.

Regarding consensual versus non-consensual: Here is where I see it.

Consensual would be where someone has their feet out, arms stretched over their heads, and so forth. When you tickle them, they laugh, possibly struggle through reflex, but don't ask you to stop. (or as another example, both people agreeing to enter into a ticklefight or tickle wrestling contest).

Non-consensual, as I'm sure we know, is where you tickle someone completely against their will. If it's done for more than, say, 5 seconds, it's wrong. In many circumstances, especially if it's a stranger, even a 5 second tickle is wrong as well.

Notice that I made reference to a stranger. It's here that I propose the term 'semi-consensual.' This refers to something between the two extremes. A perfect example is when I was at my friend's house yesterday. She was barefoot for most of the day. I'd occaisionally reach over and tickle. She'd squeal and pull away. Now and then, I'd try to lock her feet and tickle. She'd squeal, thrash, kick, laugh, and knock me aside eventually. Now and then she'd squeal 'noooooo!' I define this as semi-consensual. She didn't necessarily invite me to tickle her. However, she knew (based on past experience and my own discussions) that I'm a tickler. If she was truly dead-set against it, she'd have asked me to leave, put on shoes, told me to stop, or in general stopped being my friend. While she may not have consented or agreed to all specific tickling instances, she didn't have a problem with the concept in general. Thus, this is effectively implied consent. Semi-consensual.

(some of you are probably asking, "yeah, would you grope her and say 'well if you didnt' like it, you wouldn't have invited me?" Of course not! Again, I place tickling and forced sexual behavior very far apart on the spectrum).

I like semi-consensual tickling best because I feel as though I'm 'earning' my tickles, so to speak. If she just lies there and doesn't struggle, I feel like she's 'letting me win,' in a way. (not that there's anything wrong with it). If she fends me off, I feel like I lost. If she cries, calls for help, tells me I'm a jerk, says she hates being tickled, I feel like a jerk. (and I usually stop). but if she tries ineffectively to struggle away, then gives up and just laughs her head off... *shivers in ecstasy.* Again--I wouldn't do this to a stranger or to anyone who didn't know about my tickle-attacks beforehand. That's what I see as the difference between non-consensual and semi-consensual.

There we have it... my two cents worth. As always, agreement and disagreement are welcome. (Flames aren't). Looking forward to see what others have to say.

Jim

 

[Ticklekiller1]

Personally I think it has a lot to do with this new era we live in. We are allowed to get away with so much these days and further more, when someone IS victimized, we treat them as though they are over-reacting because the truth is we just don't want to hear it anymore because we're too wrapped up in our own selfish "needs" (desires) to deal with other peoples problems. Also, you have to remember that lust is a dangerous element that can numb you to another person's needs, you can loose yourself in it and become blinded to what you're really doing. Coupled with an obsession, lust can become a powerful enemy that will ultimately lead to destruction.

 

[Ticklekiller1]

Now this comment always cracks me up, as if at some point in time we were all so much less screwed up....because the truth is, THERE NEVER WERE ANY GOOD OLD DAYS!! Wether you like to believe it or not, humans are historically angry, violent, insensitive creatures in the overal spectrum and wether we're cheering as boxers beat the crap out of each other or indulging in seeing someone in a non-consentual situation, its all in human nature. Nothing has changed since the "good old days" except for how open people are with their hidden desires. In the 1930s to 50s there was a consesus to keep anything "not nice" a secret and to never speak of it in public. Unless you lived in a major city, you had to hide anything unusual about yourself just to survive. Humans have a thirst, an obsession with the taboo and the unacceptable, the same reason we slow down to see a car wreck. There has always been perversion and unfortunately there always will be. I think the best representation of true human nature was in the Greek/Roman empire periods. Nothing like watching lions eat christians and then going to the local Orgy to get it on with an under age boy, BOY HOWDY!!

On a personal note, yes I have thought of images like this. (not the christians and the boy, the non-consentual tickling, LOL) I have fantasized once or twice about women and men in non consentual situations. This doesnt mean I'm going to go out and do it. The main reason why most of these authors and artists depict such ideas is so that they may use this as an outlet rather than act on their impulses....

Years back there was an individual named Terri Disisto who posed as a woman online to get young men to send him tickling videos of themselves. When the guys tried to cut themselves off from him, he began harassing them and even went as far as to crash an entire schools computer mainframe to get back at them. He was arrested, shown on the news, basically anyone in the area who did not know we existed now had a pretty demonized idea of what we were all about. Now that pissed me off but at the same time, any community needs its definition of the lowest of low, in order to contrast and compare their own ethical fundementals.....and I'm sure the average joe normal who heard the news probably had a good laugh and didnt take much offense anyway...

What I'm trying to get at is, now matter what floats yer boat or what you're into there WILL ALWAYS be those who represent the darker side of your lifestyle and there is absolutely nothing anyone can do about it. There WILL ALWAYS be those that make a bad name for the rest of us and there WILL ALWAYS be those who will make us all feel a little bit better about ourselves in comparison......oh yeah and there will always be those of the high and mighty who feel that their shit don't stink and feel they can judge others so easily for being like that..... You're beliefs are not ironclad man...until we've explored all 100% of the human brain none of us will know for sure. I mean the Society for Moral Order already makes it hard enough for people with questionable lifestyles, its supposed to be us against them, not us against us...

A fetish can be a very powerful thing. For many, their fetish is like a drug addiction, they are controlled by their own desires, unable to look away from that rape scene or unable to supress arousal watching the woman tickled till she pees. Many feel remorse, shame or guilt from indulging in their own passions but cannot control it at the same time. This is all documented by the Department for Abnormal Psychology.....Man I loved that class....

Look at it this way, you may have thought for years that you yourself was a pervert or a sicko just for being into tickling at all, now you can look at the real freaks and be like "Wow...I'm not so bad..." LOL

Wow...havent posted like this in a long while....

Well said.

 

[TickledToDeath]

After reading the story, thanks MistressValerie for the link to it, I made a short post there. Here I will say part of what I said there in that the story was quite intense and side from the foot worship and stuffing smelly sweaty socks in someones mouth, which I did not and wouldn't care for in real life, nor did I care for the spanking, although a few light smacks on the cheeks are ok in a playful way, the story was just that. A story. A fantasy story. No human could withstand what was depicted therein and to kidnap someone and do that 24/7 forever is wrong and against the law etc but that is not the question here is it? It is a fantasy and a story. That is the bottom line. The intensity of the tickling was awesome. Personally I have withstood as long as 5 and a half hours one time at a tickle party where I was the main attraction so to speak. I was the victim of some gals tickle party and 5 people total tied and tickled me practically non stop(few breaks)unmercifully for the evening. I was exhausted but I took it and was ok afterwards. Granted I asked for it and volunteered for it. It was Not Non consensual although I was begging for mercy and at times wanted it to stop when the ticklers would not stop but I never safeworded although it was agreed that they were to tickle me as long and as much as they wanted regardless of what I said or did. They did not tickle me till I peed but I think that if I said that I had to, they would not have stopped anyway but that was never an issue or even discussed now that I think about it. Milagros has his history with his stories and are all off the wall intense and are not for the squimish and while I may not agree with some of the content of his epics, I would not bash the man for what he writes. Again, there are only fantasy or at least I hope they are. I doubt even HE can take what he describes nor would he volunteer TO take what he describes. To do in real life what is in his stories is unthinkable and would not happen nor do I think he wants it to happen.
Some people sometimes overreact. Understandable but that is still an over reaction but everyone has a right to their opinion. He did make a disclaimer but sometimes they are not paid close enough attention to or taken seriously enough until you are well into the story. Hell the Texas Chainsaw Massacre was just a movie. People were not chainsawed into pieces not was it said that that was a good thing and anything other than a movie. Sick mind? Maybe but again it was just a story. Take it for what it is worth. I LOVE intense merciless tickling and tickle torture. I love all levels of tickling and I can take what I can give and visa versa so long as the lee can too as well as the ler. I know and respect limits and love to explore and push MY limits as a lee and have no clue what my limits are and if a lee of mine wants to explore HER limits, I can and will do as she pleases and know how and when to break and play safe. Again the story is just that.......a story.


TTD

 

[tukano_2]

After reading the story, thanks MistressValerie for the link to it, I made a short post there. Here I will say part of what I said there in that the story was quite intense and side from the foot worship and stuffing smelly sweaty socks in someones mouth, which I did not and wouldn't care for in real life, nor did I care for the spanking, although a few light smacks on the cheeks are ok in a playful way, the story was just that. A story. A fantasy story. No human could withstand what was depicted therein and to kidnap someone and do that 24/7 forever is wrong and against the law etc but that is not the question here is it? It is a fantasy and a story. That is the bottom line. The intensity of the tickling was awesome.
...

I completely agree

...
Personally I have withstood as long as 5 and a half hours one time at a tickle party where I was the main attraction so to speak. I was the victim of some gals tickle party and 5 people total tied and tickled me practically non stop(few breaks)unmercifully for the evening. I was exhausted but I took it and was ok afterwards. Granted I asked for it and volunteered for it. It was Not Non consensual although I was begging for mercy and at times wanted it to stop when the ticklers would not stop but I never safeworded although it was agreed that they were to tickle me as long and as much as they wanted regardless of what I said or did.
...

Wow... All 5 together tickled you non stop for 5 hours? Five people from beginning to end? In such a situation it takes stamina to do the tickling too!
My compliments for your endurance

 

[TickledToDeath]

I completely agree



Wow... All 5 together tickled you non stop for 5 hours? Five people from beginning to end? In such a situation it takes stamina to do the tickling too!
My compliments for your endurance

There were a few brief breaks but I was not untied and there were also a few instances where they vaired the amount of them tickling me. For the most part there were 5 although sometimes it was two or three or four while others partook in the party materials on hand.

I was amazed they didn't get worn out earlier :happy: :wooha: especially since ONE of them was a newbie to tickle torture. She did quite well in fact she was the last to stop tickling me!

TTD