about the word bitch......

[primetime]

like i said, see what happens when you assume......

anyway, kis123, the bastard that called you that wasnt justified in calling you the names he called you. i am not saying that whenever the word "bitch" is used, it is justified, but there are occassion where i can see how the name fits. in your case, no, the name doesnt fit. i'm happy to see you overcame the crap that your ex and father put you through because you are worth something and i commend you for being the special person that you are. i can see why the word is sensitive to you. but remember, no matter how many people use the word, never let it take away anything that you accomplished in your life as a person.

but, i will admit that the word can be justified. not all women are nice, sweet, educated, well mannered, etc. some of them are downright evil women. when women who abuse, manipulate, and are just mean, are called bitches, it is because they brought it upon themselves. i cant respect someone who doesnt respect me. that is the point i am trying to make. as for the word "nigga", well, blacks are the ones who came up with it, but again, it does take the sting out of the word it came from. it all depends on the context that it is used in. does it mean its okay? depends on who you are. for you kis123, the words are truly terrible. for others, it doesnt bother them. amazing world we live in.....

 

[lt21]

isnt this america....you can say anything you want....i am the most open minded person in the world and thats exactly why no word will bother me....the person has the right to say it....they sound extremely ignorant when they do say it....but becuz i dont like doesnt mean it cant be said......i wouldnt get pissed if i heard someone use the term engine.....im not upset about the atlanta braves or the washington redskins......everyone has a right to their own opinion and if that opinion is racism or sexism then thats their loss, not the black person,or the hispanic, or the white persons (white people arent the only racists).....everyone can think whatever they want...they cant act on it, but they can think it....in the long run, a racist or sexist will get the short end of the stick for their views and wont even know why.....and beyond that i dont think the issue of racism will ever be remotely helped until everyone can talk and joke...YES JOKE about it....as long as people are all uptight about the issue...it will always be a problem

 

[drew70]

Originally posted by primetime

tell me Drew, WHERE do you see Ice Cube dissin' a woman who wont go out (smile, have sex with, etc..) with him?

It's basically what I'm seeing as the root of his frustration, shown in this phrase here, if you're perceptive enough to catch it.

it makes them go deaf in the ear that's why
when you say hi, she wont say hi
are you the kind that think you're too damn fly
bitch eat shit and die
Ice Cube coming at ya at a crazy pitch

Listen to what this loser is saying Prime. He's coming after her just because she didn't return his hello. Wants her to eat shit and die. Why? What was her "crime"? Only that she didn't fall for his pitiful attempts at wooing her over. Are you beginning to see the depths of this asshole's arrogance? In his world, any woman that won't talk to him is a bitch, deserving of death.

as for saying Ice Cube is a loser to the nth degree shows me the ignorance you have in regards to rap music.

Dude, how much does one need to know about shit to deem it unpalatable? Whether it's dogshit, catshit or mooseshit makes no difference to me. I'm still going to try and avoid stepping in it.

Ice Cube is an ICON in the rap music business. he's made movies, including one which is a cult favorite, "Friday". the movie "Barbershop" is also a successful movie. he doesnt sound like a loser to me.

Monetary success does not negate losership. Sadam Hussein had millions, I don't know, maybe even billions. He was still a loser, and the last memory most of us have of him is being checked for lice on Fox News. My assessment of Ice Cube's losership isn't based on his popularity or his wealth. It's based on his character. The best way to discern someone's character is to listen to what he says.

again, if you know nothing of rap, stop making asinine comments like you have been doing. Ice Cube a loser? man, you really need to stop.....

Again, how much does one need to know about shit to decide not to swallow it? The comments I'm making are based on the evidence YOU are providing.


what did you think of 2pac's lyrics?

I found them to be every bit as deep and meaningful as an episode of Jerry Springer.

i find it hilarious though that you accuse me of not seeing something in the lyrics even though i listen to the music, but someone who doesnt can tell me what they mean. shall we call the man who wrote them and ask him what he meant? i can guarantee you it wont be your intrepretation.

Prime, you seriously over-estimate my stake in this. You asked for my opinion, and I gave it.

now, for the word "nigga". i know i shouldnt, but i will assume (yeah, yeah we know what happens when you assume) that kis123 or Drew isnt African American.

I'm not, but Kis is. However I'm a firm believer that if something is wrong, it is wrong for all races, genders, whatever. To say that it's okay for black people to call each other niggas but not for white people...that's racial discrimination, plain and simple.

actually it doesnt matter, but the word "nigga" is actually different from "nigger".

Oh really? Would that difference be the same as the difference between "wonder" and "wonda," as in "You wonda why they call u bitch"? The only difference is the refusal to acknowlege the letter "R," a disturbing trend, to say the least.

blacks dont call each other "nigger", we call each other "nigga". now, this may be hard to understand, but calling each other "nigga" is okay to some black people. if one black person calls another black person "nigga", how can it be an insult?

It's an insult to everybody. Racial slurs show nothing but hatred and ignorance. Whether they are used by black people or white, they serve no purpose other than to perpetuate such unreasoning attitudes. How can prejudiced white people be expected to set aside such bigoted ideals when black people are calling each other "niggas"? It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen. Are your imaginations so limited that you can't come up with something better to call each other???

plus, if you think about it, if the word is used in a positive manner to call someone, it takes the "bite" out of the word. same with "bitch". that's why some women call each other "bitches" (actually some men call each other bitches). but one thing i noticed is, only black people can call each other "nigga". if another race does it, then anger will result.

No shit. And that should tell you something. And that something is that it's wrong to address each other by terms born of ignorance and hatred. Shame on every black person or white who calls somebody a "nigga." If we're ever to share this country and this planet in peaceful harmony, THE SAME RULES HAVE TO APPLY TO ALL OF US!

everyone will have their opinions and i know some wont change from this thread. i felt that there should be another view as to why women are refered to as bitches. there are two sides to every story. i also find it quite amazing that someone who doesnt even like the genre of rap can tell fans of the music what is actually going on in it. Drew, you are one funny man.....

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to come to those conclusions, Prime. It doesn't take hours of listening to Rap to see how shallow it is, or how it's lacking in art and imagination, or how it's overflowing with bad english, unreasoning violence, and a contempt for women who don't play the game.

Originally posted by Kis123

As far as I'm concerned, it describes a female dog.

But it goes a lot farther than you are concerned, Kis. It's not all about you. No one person can decide which definitions are legitimate and which aren't. Are you saying that because you personally reject the dictionary definition, the rest of us should as well??

I don't know how old you are, but when I was a kid, the only definition in the book was that to describe a female dog. I, my dead mother, nor my daughter fit into that category.

I'll be 47 next month. And ever since elementary school, the only context I've ever heard the word used in it's noun form was in the second, third, and fourth definitions. The only places I ever heard the word used to describe a female dog is in a few books. Never in actual conversation. And may I ask why you continue to refer to your dead mother and daughter? I don't see anywhere in this thread anybody referring to them except you.

I don't believe in evolution either so I can't be sold on that theory.

Kis, you know as well as I that we're not talking about Darwin's theory of evolution. The word "evolve" means to change over time. That's all. Are you saying that nothing changes over time?? You don't think that the accepted meanings of certain words can change over time? Okay, fine. Continue in your denial, but don't be surprised if the rest of the world disagrees.

 

[MrMacphisto]

I gotta be honest guys and gals; I am in no way a fan of Ice Cube or Tupac, but it would seem that Cube is touching on a subject that needs to be addressed before "bitch" can be truly understood in its derogatory usage. Many women in this country like to perpetuate the paradox of putting themselves on a pedestal yet wanting to be regarded as equals to men. The traditional role of a woman put them into the category of the "fairer" sex, which meant a lack of independence was allowed for them, but they were insulated from certain dangers in society, like a draft. Men were supposed to show chivalrous behavior like opening doors for them and keeping their language proper around them. Of course, this all changed when the sexual revolution occurred.

Now, it would seem that women are attempting to keep the best of both worlds. They want the respect afforded to them by the traditional outlook on women, but they want the equality given to them by the modern outlook. If you want equal privileges, you have to assume equal responsibilities (like susceptibility to military drafts), and this means that chivalry must be abolished as well. When you add this tendency for women to want the best of both worlds to the uppity nature of some women, you end up with a lot of men like Ice Cube and Tupac that see these women as bitches. Once again, this is not an attack on all women, but certain women fit right into this label. As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, it's a free country, so bitch will continue to be used to regard certain women. Get over it and accept it....

 

[kis123]

Originally posted by primetime

tell me Drew, WHERE do you see Ice Cube dissin' a woman who wont go out (smile, have sex with, etc..) with him?

It's basically what I'm seeing as the root of his frustration, shown in this phrase here, if you're perceptive enough to catch it.

it makes them go deaf in the ear that's why
when you say hi, she wont say hi
are you the kind that think you're too damn fly
bitch eat shit and die
Ice Cube coming at ya at a crazy pitch

Listen to what this loser is saying Prime. He's coming after her just because she didn't return his hello. Wants her to eat shit and die. Why? What was her "crime"? Only that she didn't fall for his pitiful attempts at wooing her over. Are you beginning to see the depths of this asshole's arrogance? In his world, any woman that won't talk to him is a bitch, deserving of death.

as for saying Ice Cube is a loser to the nth degree shows me the ignorance you have in regards to rap music.

Dude, how much does one need to know about shit to deem it unpalatable? Whether it's dogshit, catshit or mooseshit makes no difference to me. I'm still going to try and avoid stepping in it.

Ice Cube is an ICON in the rap music business. he's made movies, including one which is a cult favorite, "Friday". the movie "Barbershop" is also a successful movie. he doesnt sound like a loser to me.

Monetary success does not negate losership. Sadam Hussein had millions, I don't know, maybe even billions. He was still a loser, and the last memory most of us have of him is being checked for lice on Fox News. My assessment of Ice Cube's losership isn't based on his popularity or his wealth. It's based on his character. The best way to discern someone's character is to listen to what he says.

again, if you know nothing of rap, stop making asinine comments like you have been doing. Ice Cube a loser? man, you really need to stop.....

Again, how much does one need to know about shit to decide not to swallow it? The comments I'm making are based on the evidence YOU are providing.


what did you think of 2pac's lyrics?

I found them to be every bit as deep and meaningful as an episode of Jerry Springer.

i find it hilarious though that you accuse me of not seeing something in the lyrics even though i listen to the music, but someone who doesnt can tell me what they mean. shall we call the man who wrote them and ask him what he meant? i can guarantee you it wont be your intrepretation.

Prime, you seriously over-estimate my stake in this. You asked for my opinion, and I gave it.

now, for the word "nigga". i know i shouldnt, but i will assume (yeah, yeah we know what happens when you assume) that kis123 or Drew isnt African American.

I'm not, but Kis is. However I'm a firm believer that if something is wrong, it is wrong for all races, genders, whatever. To say that it's okay for black people to call each other niggas but not for white people...that's racial discrimination, plain and simple.

actually it doesnt matter, but the word "nigga" is actually different from "nigger".

Oh really? Would that difference be the same as the difference between "wonder" and "wonda," as in "You wonda why they call u bitch"? The only difference is the refusal to acknowlege the letter "R," a disturbing trend, to say the least.

blacks dont call each other "nigger", we call each other "nigga". now, this may be hard to understand, but calling each other "nigga" is okay to some black people. if one black person calls another black person "nigga", how can it be an insult?

It's an insult to everybody. Racial slurs show nothing but hatred and ignorance. Whether they are used by black people or white, they serve no purpose other than to perpetuate such unreasoning attitudes. How can prejudiced white people be expected to set aside such bigoted ideals when black people are calling each other "niggas"? It's the stupidest thing I've ever seen. Are your imaginations so limited that you can't come up with something better to call each other???

plus, if you think about it, if the word is used in a positive manner to call someone, it takes the "bite" out of the word. same with "bitch". that's why some women call each other "bitches" (actually some men call each other bitches). but one thing i noticed is, only black people can call each other "nigga". if another race does it, then anger will result.

No shit. And that should tell you something. And that something is that it's wrong to address each other by terms born of ignorance and hatred. Shame on every black person or white who calls somebody a "nigga." If we're ever to share this country and this planet in peaceful harmony, THE SAME RULES HAVE TO APPLY TO ALL OF US!

everyone will have their opinions and i know some wont change from this thread. i felt that there should be another view as to why women are refered to as bitches. there are two sides to every story. i also find it quite amazing that someone who doesnt even like the genre of rap can tell fans of the music what is actually going on in it. Drew, you are one funny man.....

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to come to those conclusions, Prime. It doesn't take hours of listening to Rap to see how shallow it is, or how it's lacking in art and imagination, or how it's overflowing with bad english, unreasoning violence, and a contempt for women who don't play the game.

Originally posted by Kis123

As far as I'm concerned, it describes a female dog.

But it goes a lot farther than you are concerned, Kis. It's not all about you. No one person can decide which definitions are legitimate and which aren't. Are you saying that because you personally reject the dictionary definition, the rest of us should as well??

I don't know how old you are, but when I was a kid, the only definition in the book was that to describe a female dog. I, my dead mother, nor my daughter fit into that category.

I'll be 47 next month. And ever since elementary school, the only context I've ever heard the word used in it's noun form was in the second, third, and fourth definitions. The only places I ever heard the word used to describe a female dog is in a few books. Never in actual conversation. And may I ask why you continue to refer to your dead mother and daughter? I don't see anywhere in this thread anybody referring to them except you.

I don't believe in evolution either so I can't be sold on that theory.

Kis, you know as well as I that we're not talking about Darwin's theory of evolution. The word "evolve" means to change over time. That's all. Are you saying that nothing changes over time?? You don't think that the accepted meanings of certain words can change over time? Okay, fine. Continue in your denial, but don't be surprised if the rest of the world disagrees.

Look Drew;

It is apparently obvious that you and I don't agree on this. I choose not to use bit*h or any other derogotory name to describe anyone. I consciously attempt to treat everyone the way I would like to be treated, and hope they catch on and do the same. Everyone has a limit or a name or an action that they absolutely despise. That one happens to be mine. It scrapes at my dignity. Just because you and some others feel that it is okay, doesn't mean that I'm coming on board with you.

I was on another post and someone told me that there were no incorrect opinions. Since that was shoved down my throat to the point that the entire spirit of the thread was lost, I'm choosing to practice what those people are preaching in order to prove a point. I am entitled to my opinion regardless of wheher you agree with me or not. Just because society has evolved itself to accepting self-disrespect by accepting derogotory language, doesn't mean I have to stoop to it as well. And I've taught the same things to my kids. They don't have to do what everyone else is doing, especially if it's against their beliefs or just plain wrong.

This is America. Do what you want to do. Accept whatever you want to. I certainly won't stop you. But don't think I'm gonna' join you either!

 

[kis123]

Mr Macphisto;
Before I accept this term into my vocabulary, I would eat glass and throw myself out of my second story window!!!!

It seems like every time I attempt to express my viewpoint on these threads, the ceiling falls on what I said. People are getting bent out of shape over my opinions. Isn't that just too bad? You all have the right to express yourselves. If you want to hear that language in your music, buy the record. If you want to refer to yourselves in some demeaning manner to take the "bite" out of the term, go ahead. That is your choice. As far as getting over it is concerned, I dont lose sleep over someone who's called me out of my name. They're merely expressing their ignorance and the lack of the ability to speak in an intelligent manner. As far as me accepting it is concerned, if it became the million dollar password, I still wouldn't say it!

I hope I have clarified myself on all points. The horse is stinkin' up the joint at this point. Can we move on now? If not you can always continue this subject matter by yourselves because I'm personally done with it!

 

[primetime]

Drew, again you prove my point. you know nothing of rap music. how in the hell you ever came up with the conclusion that Ice Cube is calling a woman a bitch because she wont respond to his advances is beyond me.

lyrics:
it makes them go deaf in the ear that's why
when you say hi, she wont say hi
are you the kind that thinks you're too damn fly
bitch eat shit and die

did it ever occur to you that the lyrics simply mean a stuck up woman has passed him by? example, let's say you're at a store, restuarant, wherever and you see a woman and you simply say "hi". then the woman responds to you by rolling her eyes and turning her nose up at you like you are hideous life form that doesnt deserve to breathe oxygen. did you make any forward advances? did you try to hit on her? NO. you simply said hi and the woman blew you off as though you had 4 heads. THAT IS WHAT THOSE LYRICS MEAN. for you to even see something else is ridiculous. see, if you understood rap music, those lyrics make perfect sense. but NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, you want to see something else JUST BECAUSE you dont like the music. again, if we were to approach Ice Cube and ask him what the lyrics meant, i GUARANTEE you, your interpretation would be way off. face it, you make no sense and your feeble attempts of trying to intepret the lyrics shows exactly that you know absolutely nothing.

now as for Ice Cube, how is he a loser? since his fame, movies and money doesnt make him a loser, what does? you say it is his character and what he says. what did he say? i'm interested in your response..

now as for the word "nigga". i figure you wouldnt understand because you are not "involved" with young black teens. i'm glad you feel that the word is vulgar because it is. but, in the context that it is used amongst the African American youth, it isnt an insult. dropping that "r" and having an "a" makes quite a difference. i dont figure you would understand. but, so i can at least try to help you get an idea, if a black person calls another black person a "nigga", how is it an insult? the person calling the other person a "nigga" is black too. that is a reason why some blacks call each other "nigga". the word doesnt have the same kind of bite as when another race calls a black person that word. again, i dont think you will understand, so its a moot point.

now the funniest thing you wrote is: "Dude, how much does one need to know about shit to deem it unpalatable?" first of all, rap music isnt shit. that's your opinion, but who says you're right? second of all, i dont know much about polka music, but i am not going to go out of my way to analyze a polka song and make claims on what the song is about, ESPECIALLY if the person i am debating against LISTENS TO THE MUSIC. it's like a person who doesnt watch football and hates the sport tell a person who does watch the sport how the 46 defense works. YOU DONT LISTEN TO RAP, so how can you tell ME what the lyrics mean? but that is way over your head and i cant wait to read your comical response......the ball is in your court.....

 

[JoBelle]

lyrics:
it makes them go deaf in the ear that's why
when you say hi, she wont say hi
are you the kind that thinks you're too damn fly
bitch eat shit and die

did it ever occur to you that the lyrics simply mean a stuck up woman has passed him by? example, let's say you're at a store, restuarant, wherever and you see a woman and you simply say "hi". then the woman responds to you by rolling her eyes and turning her nose up at you like you are hideous life form that doesnt deserve to breathe oxygen. did you make any forward advances? did you try to hit on her? NO. you simply said hi and the woman blew you off as though you had 4 heads. THAT IS WHAT THOSE LYRICS MEAN.

OH, I get it now. She didn't use her best manners and return the greeting from a total stranger? OK, yeah. Call her a bitch. That makes sense.

Frankly, using a word that the RECIPIENTS view as base and vile is just unacceptable. How would you like to be called a "nigger, gook, dego, wop, honkey" or anything else just because a person may think that it fits YOU? I know a LOT of confederate flag waving rednecks that would think it's just as acceptable to call a black person a nigger because they gave them a bad look. Is that ok too?

Justifying it to fit a certain description that YOU think fits DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT. I teach my kid not to insult people. Like them or not, it's not their place to step on them.

Where do these men get the idea that insulting a woman in a song is ok? That's it the "thing to be done?" That's plain pathetic. I'm sure there are better things besides hate and discontent that can make a buck...but not until certain types of people wake up and stop buying the crap.

 

[Ayla ny]

oh ok! I get it!

so I get to call the guy that I DO say hi to, who then assumes that he has the right to throw a drunken arm around me and slur into my ear, cool stuff too!

works for me! think it’ll sell records?

 

[ticklebutton]

You guys can defend it until you're blue in the face, but the fact remains:

...using a word that the RECIPIENTS view as base and vile is just unacceptable.

Justifying it to fit a certain description that YOU think fits DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT.

Button 😎

 

[primetime]

wait a minute......did anyone read the scenario? you mean to tell me that if a man says "hi" to you, not with ogling eyes, not blocking your path, not looking at your chest, not undressing you with his eyes, not following you, just saying "hi", you would roll your eyes and give him a dirty look? Jobelle, Ayla Ny, and ticklebutton, i doubt you would do that. you're in the store, you look around, another man is also looking around, your eyes meet, he says "hi", nothing more, and you would roll your eyes and act like he is some kind of crazed pervert? i think not. for some crazy reason, people are reading into these scenarios as the man is doing something disrespectful to the woman, so if she responds negatively, she's called a bitch. that is NOT what is being written. i am talking about CHARACTER. i am talking about the woman's ATTITUDE. that is what the lyrics are about. they are not about a man disrespecting a woman, then when she returns the disrespect, the man calls her a bitch. news flash, women ARE NOT PERFECT. there are some sweet women in the world and there are REAL BITCHES that inhabit the planet. just like there are nice guys out there, but there are also some REAL ASSHOLES that inhabit the Earth.

i know some people wont change their opinion, and i am not trying to change that. HOWEVER, there are two sides to the argument. again, a woman who takes care of herself, well educated, trying to do something with her life and an all around good person is NOT refered to as a bitch. the term "bitch" is used to describe a woman who is not taking care of herself, has a rotten attitude towards people, men AND women alike, and just acts like, well, a bitch. that is what these artists are refereing to. i mean really, the first damn paragraph of Ice Cube's lyrics are "let's describe a CERTAIN female". he goes on to describe what TYPE of female.

now as to Jobelle's quotes "using a word that the RECIPIENTS view as base and vile is just unacceptable...." and ".....Justifying it to fit a certain description that YOU think fits DOESNT MAKE IT RIGHT". quick comments: have you EVER (and tell the truth) gave an insulting name to anyone? whether you called the person a liar, jerk, asshole, bitch, whatever, you make a derogatory remark about that person, then YOU are doing the same damn thing. dont even come back with something like another word is better than "bitch". an insult is an insult. i can simply put it back on you that whatever adjective you use isnt acceptable as well.

as for rap artists and what they rap about. these artists are describing things that happen in their life. some of their songs are about THEIR REALITY. there are people out there who can totally relate to what they are rapping about. if they are dealing with certain women who have attitude problems, then they need to address it. if they are dealing with rogue cops, then they will rap about it. if they rap about one of their friends dying in a drive by shooting, they will rap about it. i have never said if it was right or wrong. the whole reason why i even brought up this topic was to show WHY they call certain women bitches. a lot of people wonder why do they call women bitches. first of all, they are not describing all women, just certain types of women. call a spade a spade. in Church, they call people who are not conforming to the teachings of the religion, sinners. shouldnt you be in an uproar about that? like it or not, people are labeled. it is the world we live in. if you are going to make a big fuss about the word "bitch", then i want to see this crusade go on to include ALL INSULTS of the world. we are human and you better believe that we ALL have given someone an insult who we felt wronged us.

why are women defending other women who are rotten people? i dont give a damn if you're a man or woman, if you are a disrespecting person, you deserve to be called what you are. if you act like an asshole, you're an asshole. if you act like a bitch, you're a bitch. note the keyword: ACT

 

[lt21]

interesting side point.....guys never seem to be called bitches in that sense, and girls never seem to be called assholes....have u ever heard a girl be called asshole...i havent.......i only hear guys called bitches when refering to being a pussy (another female connection)....newayz go on

 

[Sunriseticklee]

again, a woman who takes care of herself, well educated, trying to do something with her life and an all around good person is NOT refered to as a bitch.

HAHAHAHA... I'm well educated, working on my Masters, I pay my own bills, take care of my family, and am trying to do something with my life on a daily basis; and guys STILL call me bitch. Heehee.

But seriously, aside from the lyrics in Ice Cube's particular song and Tupac's song there are countless other rappers that DO refer to women who don't want to fuck them as stuck up bitches. Anyone who actually listens to rap music has to admit that is true as well.

Growing up... (And I lived exactly where Ice Cube was lived and lived exactly where Tupac lived before I moved to Atlanta 🙄 ) guys called me a bitch for various reasons.

A) I knew exactly who I was. B) I knew what I wanted in life. C) I didn't take shit from anyone. And well... D) I didn’t want to fuck them. If a bitch is a snob or someone who thinks they are above someone well…. I did act like I was better than them... And hell... I was. So? If that makes me a bitch, so be it.

"Sunrise isn't easy like the rest of the girls in the neighborhood so she's a bitch."

A guy who was getting a little touchy with me once said, "Man, don't no female come to the court to play with all boys. You know why you here, bitch!" And he equally knew why he ended up landing just about face first on the black top. And why all the guys on the court told him it was best for him to leave before he got his ass beat.

I just wasn't the one. Never was the one. And if that makes me a bitch then I want to be the Queen Bitch... Ms Bitch.... The Biggest Bitch!

now as to Jobelle's quotes "using a word that the RECIPIENTS view as base and vile is just unacceptable...." and ".....Justifying it to fit a certain description that YOU think fits DOESNT MAKE IT RIGHT". quick comments: have you EVER (and tell the truth) gave an insulting name to anyone? whether you called the person a liar, jerk, asshole, bitch, whatever, you make a derogatory remark about that person, then YOU are doing the same damn thing. dont even come back with something like another word is better than "bitch". an insult is an insult. i can simply put it back on you that whatever adjective you use isnt acceptable as well.

We are all adults. I'm sure we have all said insulting things and we all knew they were wrong. Just because someone can give an explanation or justification as to why some women are called bitches doesn't make it any less base or vile. Although I personally take being called a bitch a compliment. The guy is admitting that I am better than him and that regardless of what he has, what he looks like, no matter how hard he tries, he will NEVER be up to my standards. So sad.... but true. I take guys like that as the joke they are, and I don't skip a beat!

why are women defending other women who are rotten people?

Giggle.... are we supposed to respect and accept the character of the people who are calling women bitches instead? Why are we defending guys who can't find another way to sum up how they feel about a small group of the female species other than forever calling them hoes and bitches?

And if those guys keep attracting those same type of women.... Well dog food attracts dogs... That's all I have to say!

And as far as this "nigga" business is concerned... SIGH This comes up on TMF about once a month I think (even though it wasn't part of the original topic....)

I'm a teacher and I don't give a rat's ass how my student's talk on the street! When they enter my classroom, all of that is out the window. Black, white, green, purple... Nigga, honkey, redneck, hoe, slut, pimp.... None of those words are allowed to be uttered in my classroom. Insults are not allowed period, and I have zero tolerance.

as for rap artists and what they rap about. these artists are describing things that happen in their life. some of their songs are about THEIR REALITY.

And some (most) of the stuff they rap about is pure bullshit. Many of the rappers selling records never grew up in a ghetto. They don't know about hard times, and the "bling bling" that they have is either fake are rented. We all know. They are singing about living hard times while they are chilling in Beverly Hills. LOL How pathetic.

You think if students could get it, that adults could to. But we all know how that story goes. (And by the way, all of my students know that most of the rapper's "hard core" lifestyle is put on. LOL I mean... you see the rapper talking about "It's a hard knock life." and then you see his mansion on MTV's Cribs. HAHAHAHA! It’s just so sad that it’s funny actually!)

Now before someone of a lighter skin tone tries to jump down my throat and call themselves schooling me on a race that I have lived and breathed since I was squeezed out my mother's vagina.... Not all black people, or white people, or Hispanics, or whatever ethnicity uses those degrading terms and thinks it's ok. Nor is "nigga" part of the universal language of African American "teens". 🙄

Oh and to address the ever popular question that was asked… "Why is it ok for black people to do this and not white people..."

Who said all black people do anything? Realize that there is ignorance in every group. Don't lump everyone in your little categories because it makes you sound every bit as ignorant as the people (not the ENTIRE race) using the words in the first place. We don't ALL do it.

Do you realize what a small percent of people are walking around saying that? While the rest of us are trying to keep jobs and take care of business, there are a couple of people walking around talking like that. And there are even fewer people making money off of talking like that. It doesn't represent the majority of society or the majority of an individual ethnic culture. But they will keep making money until "we" stop buying their products. Period.

Not all of us walk down the street saying "bitches ain't, shit but hoes and tricks..." or "Nigga this... Nigga what?" I know on TV and on the radio you see all that mess, but that is entertainment, fake, unreal, put on.... Everybody doesn't talk like that! And everybody black doesn't condone it, just like every man doesn't think it's ok for a woman to be called a bitch REGARDLESS of her attitude!

Oh and before someone says it's because I don't like nor understand rap music.... I listen to ALL types of music so that argument is moot.

This was actually pretty amusing that a thread would be dedicated to explain why rappers call women bitches. It was equally interesting to see that I actually agreed with some of you.

Sunrise

 

[drew70]

Originally posted by primetime

Drew, again you prove my point. you know nothing of rap music.

I never claimed too. Truth be told, I'd be embarrassed to make such a claim. So you don't need to keep telling me how little I know of rap. It's a topic of which I'm happy to be blissfully ignorant.

did it ever occur to you that the lyrics simply mean a stuck up woman has passed him by? example, let's say you're at a store, restuarant, wherever and you see a woman and you simply say "hi". then the woman responds to you by rolling her eyes and turning her nose up at you like you are hideous life form that doesnt deserve to breathe oxygen.

This is the heart of our disagreement, I think. You seem under the impression that if you say hi to a woman--a stranger--there's some obligation on her part to return the gesture. Nothing could be farther from the truth. She's not required to return the gesture any more than you are required to offer it to begin with. What are you doing saying "hi" to a complete stranger anyway? What's your motivation, if not to strike up a conversation? Put yourself in her shoes. She's in the store minding her own business and some stranger comes up and says "hi." How's she supposed to react? You've just put her on the spot. If she's an attractive woman, it probably happens quite a bit. She's probably tired of well-meaning strangers wanting to strike up a conversation. Some women don't mind this. Others love it. But many (most?) women either aren't interested in or don't feel comfortable talking to strangers. The same woman who refuses to acknowlege you as a stranger, might very well give a warm reception if you were introduced by someone she knows.

did you make any forward advances? did you try to hit on her? NO. you simply said hi and the woman blew you off as though you had 4 heads.

Yes, believe it or not, walking up to a woman you don't know and saying hi is a forward advance. It's the first step in any pickup situation, and she knows that. So don't be surprised or offended if she's less than enthusiastic. She is well within her rights not to respond, and her choosing not to respond in no way speaks of any lack of character on her part.

now the funniest thing you wrote is: "Dude, how much does one need to know about shit to deem it unpalatable?" first of all, rap music isnt shit. that's your opinion, but who says you're right?

Who needs to? Opinions aren't like facts or statements, which can be correct, incorrect, or somewhere in between. Opinions are an expression of how you feel about something. In my opinion, rap is the audio equivilant of shit. In your opinion, rap is music, full of esoteric qualities. Neither of us is right or wrong, we just feel differently about it.

i dont know much about polka music, but i am not going to go out of my way to analyze a polka song and make claims on what the song is about, ESPECIALLY if the person i am debating against LISTENS TO THE MUSIC. it's like a person who doesnt watch football and hates the sport tell a person who does watch the sport how the 46 defense works.

Again, what do I need to know about rap to have an opinion?!! This is like the third time I've asked you this and you've yet to answer. I've heard more than I care to, mostly at traffic lights where some asshole decides everybody needs to be hearing the shit.

YOU DONT LISTEN TO RAP, so how can you tell ME what the lyrics mean?

Um...because you've provided them for us?...in English?? Hello??!!...What, are you going to tell me it's in some special code? I've got to listen to rap for the next six years before I can discern the depth and brevity of "A bitch is a bitch"?? Puh-lease!

 

[primetime]

c'mon Drew, think about what you're writing first. where in my post did i ever say the woman was "approached". you mean to tell me you havent given a glance at a woman, who happened to glance at you at the moment and gave a quick "hi" and then minded your own business? you always go to a store, make NO eye contact at all with anyone, and leave. NO!!! you see men and women, attractive or not, gave them a quick "hello" as you passed them by and kept on with your business. tell me that you've done this before. if not, you are one sheltered person.

that is why i wrote (you did read my post didnt you?) it is not about a man approaching a woman, being disrespectful to her, then she returns the disrespect and she's called a bitch. that is NOT what is being said. we ALL know certain women who are stuck up. how do we know they are stuck up? is it because we are trying to approach her and try to make out moves? not in every occassion.

you make me laugh when you say the lyrics are in English, because you have a much different interpretation on what the lyrics mean, despite that fact it is in plain English on what they are talking about. have you ever heard of a gold digger? gee, that is what is being mentioned in the lyrics. go back, ask your English teacher to show you where.

the reason why i make the point of you not listening to rap is your constant attempts to tell me what the lyrics mean. i know your opinion of rap is harsh, but how can you possibly tell me what the lyrics mean? you can have your silly opinion, but dont try to tell me what the lyrics mean, when i actually listen to the genre. Drew my man, go back and read the post since you think you can understand English...

 

[drew70]

c'mon Drew, think about what you're writing first. where in my post did i ever say the woman was "approached".

Well I had assumed the hypothetical woman in question was approached because I didn't think you'd be hollering your hello from across the room. Maybe I was wrong. 🙄

you mean to tell me you havent given a glance at a woman, who happened to glance at you at the moment and gave a quick "hi" and then minded your own business?

Very rarely, but if I did, it would be out of politeness and certainly with no expectations of any kind of response.

you always go to a store, make NO eye contact at all with anyone, and leave.

I make plenty of eye contact when I go to a store or restaurant. I generally don't give a "hi" quick or otherwise unless I know the person, or unless she initiates conversation. Now, I work in a corporate office building with six floors. There are plenty of women there that I don't know. Often I find myself riding an elevator alone with a strange woman. When I say "strange" in this context I don't mean weird or odd, I mean somebody I don't know. The last thing I'll do in such an instance, is say "hi." Not to say I won't initiate conversation. It depends on my mood and her body language. If I decide to say something, it'll generally be of a humorous nature. For example, one day last week, I rode an elevator with an absolutely gorgeous woman carrying a desktop computer. We made eye contact. I looked at her, at the computer she was carrying, then back at her and said, "You know, you really need a laptop." She laughed and she got off on her floor. Now had she rolled her eyes in irritation, it wouldn't have bothered me one bit. Why? Because I refuse to judge a woman's character just from how she reacts to a stranger, which is all I am to her. Maybe she was having a bad day, and was just in no mood for small talk. There's nothing wrong with that, Prime. It doesn't make her a bitch, a hoe, or any other label you want to pin on her. It's ironic, because you keep telling me I know nothing of rap and therefore have no understanding of what's being said because I don't spend time listening to it. Yet you feel justified in labeling a woman a bitch based on the most superficial of interactions...a refusal to return a "hi." Think about that for a minute. I'll wait.

NO!!! you see men and women, attractive or not, gave them a quick "hello" as you passed them by and kept on with your business. tell me that you've done this before. if not, you are one sheltered person.

When I'm passing people in this manner, I generally have no time to say hello, but it does happen. The difference between you and I is that I have no expectations. I've done my duty of politeness, that's all that matters to me. Ice Cube on the other hand, has serious expectations, and God help the woman who shrugs him off.

the reason why i make the point of you not listening to rap is your constant attempts to tell me what the lyrics mean.

Dude, I'm not telling you anything you don't already know. I'm taking the lyrics at face value. They're written in English (bad English generally, but English nonetheless) and I speak English. What else is required?

i know your opinion of rap is harsh, but how can you possibly tell me what the lyrics mean? you can have your silly opinion, but dont try to tell me what the lyrics mean, when i actually listen to the genre.

Can you please explain to me how you "listening to the genre" makes you more qualified to read and understand plain English than me? I got to tell you pal, this one really has me stumped.

you did read my post didnt you?

Yes, but because I know nothing about you and I'm not into the genre, I felt unqualified to interpret your post. Sorry.

 

[JoBelle]

No need to reply to this as Sunrise did it so well.

Jo

 

[BellaRisa]

Uh, Drew?

I've been following this thread with interest; I have no desire to express my opinions, because those who would understand my POV have already spoken as I would. The rest simply wouldn't grok my thoughts, and I've no wish to attempt to make myself understood. However, I do have a question.

Drew, you wrote this regarding your lack of real knowledge of rap:

I never claimed too. Truth be told, I'd be embarrassed to make such a claim. So you don't need to keep telling me how little I know of rap. It's a topic of which I'm happy to be blissfully ignorant.

You're saying you don't know much of anything about rap. Um, this being the case, why do I see you mention rap so often, in such an insulting manner? Those of us who enjoy this type of music (and there are many *very* positive sub-genres of it that I doubt you've heard) just shake our heads, and frankly lose a bit of respect for you, when you make derogatory comments about it and then proudly state ignorance about that which you've just cheerfully insulted. Having met you, I know you're a better, more open minded person than that, it would be nice to see less aggression toward a topic about which you freely admit ignorance. Such blind hostility is beneath you.

One point of this thread, from what I can tell, is how dangerous it is to make generalizations when we're all unique individuals. The same can be said for the music we enjoy.

My 2 cents,

Bella

 

[Limeoutsider]

As I see it, if youre nasty, miserable, throw hissy fits, act pissy, yell at people for no reason or with no good cause, talk down to others, or look down your nose at people then yeah, you deserve to be called a bitch.

 

[primetime]

first of all, Limeoutsider, thank you. that is exactly the point i have been trying to get across. that is what the song by Ice Cube is trying to say......

Drew, since you have a hard time understanding "English", let me tell you what the song is refering to. any gold diggin (lyric: "you can tell a girl that's out for the money..."), stuck up, treats people like dirt, and just plain rude, deserves to be called a bitch. the song is talking about character and attitude. the last damn paragraph even tells you that a bitch was "described", yet you come up with something so off the wall, it's amazing. 2pac's song talks about behavior. that shows me that you obviously have a hard time understanding "English". you took one snippet of the song and interpreted the wrong way. did you even bother to read the rest of the song? no. i know you didnt pay close attention to 2pac's song. you just think it is the same. you're like the media, you only want soundbites, not the whole story.

once again folks, if a woman (or a man for that matter) has a bad attitude (not just one day, ALL the time) or character, she is labeled a bitch. men are usually labeled assholes. no one here can honestly say they havent used some sort of negative adjective when describing these type of people. now, why would anyone want to defend these type of people? to the women who wrote responses on this thread, you have all shown to have good strong character while posting on this forum. you are probably some of the sweetest people on the planet (or at least that is my opinion of you), WHY would you want to defend those certain women who are not? THOSE women are bitches. they will disrespect anyone that cross their paths. why defend them?

 

[natural tickler]

You know, I wasn't gonna respond, but after reading this, I might as well:

I have never liked the word bitch, because I don't want nobody calling my mother or sister one, so I never used it.

Secondly, people who don't understand rap music obviously is confused by the intent of the word.

Next, when the word 'nigga' is used mostly by blacks, it has turned into a fraternal phrase, and unfortunately is accepted, but whenever it is used by any other race, we get mad. Sadly, this is a glaring contradiction.

Lastly, Meredith Brooks did a song called "Bitch" and nobody complained about that. But let it be used in hip-hop and now people want to be outraged? that is also a glaring contradiction

 

[kis123]

You know, I wasn't gonna respond, but after reading this, I might as well:

I have never liked the word bitch, because I don't want nobody calling my mother or sister one, so I never used it.

Secondly, people who don't understand rap music obviously is confused by the intent of the word.

Next, when the word 'nigga' is used mostly by blacks, it has turned into a fraternal phrase, and unfortunately is accepted, but whenever it is used by any other race, we get mad. Sadly, this is a glaring contradiction.

Lastly, Meredith Brooks did a song called "Bitch" and nobody complained about that. But let it be used in hip-hop and now people want to be outraged? that is also a glaring contradiction

Very interesting points. I had not thought of it that way. But, I better not say too much more, or the opinion police may come out and arrest me again!

 

[natural tickler]

oh kis honey you're free to do as you wish, say what you like!!

btw, I have found the gymshoes necessary to chase and catch ya, and you know what happens then!!!

 

[kis123]

As I see it, if youre nasty, miserable, throw hissy fits, act pissy, yell at people for no reason or with no good cause, talk down to others, or look down your nose at people then yeah, you deserve to be called a bitch.

Many times a woman who has self respect and dignity and chooses not to be just another woman, or doesn't think and do like everyone else, gets accused of being high and mighty, acting better than others, or bi*ch. My daughter gets name called because she doesn't smoke, drink, party, or screw around. It is easy to name call things you don't or won't understand. It's just as easy to make other acquaintences or friendships and leave her alone.

Why are we always so quick to label people who don't think and do it "our way"? If she's that hateful, let her be hateful by herself. You don't have to resort to calling names, especially that one.

 

[natural tickler]

Well, its that age old theory: You are what you act😀