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i truly now can say that ghost exist

Wow ticklish 9 and john now i know you have no reserch on the bible it self no where in the bible it says that god said to kill, rape, murder,or do harm to children you dont know to much and you really don't pay to much attention didn't you read what I wrote about Albert Einstein.
Though intuitively by nature many of us 'believe' to the thought of its phenomenal existence. The natural phenomena is also said being part of nature in this universe..
Beside still many others base it in its spiritual nature.
Ghosts are known as non physical entities, present on other dimensional life. But it possesses an energy force that is known to be as existing.

And Albert Einstein had proven that existence of energy that survives..It only changes its form.
__________________
what do you think that means I think its a pretty strong point and also many of the greatest minds in the history of the world believed in god I'm pretty sure if god was evil then why would they follow him till there last days Sir Issac Newton, Albert Einstein, Shake Sphere, Abraham Lincoln,Ben Fraklin and so on brillant minds and your telling me that they were dumb enough to follow an evil god wow its just sad to see people can be so blind even when people have very strong points and evidence they chose to call it something they to can't explained I'm not say that when something weird happens all the its an act of god but whenyou can't explain it and you know for a fact the laws of physics don't apply you chose to ignore the sign or act and say oh its this complicated universe and I can't explain it its complicated and very complexed for a very good reason but know very little of this universe and of this world we still have much to learn about life and its mysterious ways. Let me ask you this do you feel love ,and sadness,hate angry,happiness how can you explain that if you can't see it you can't just pull it out of your body or theres no special organ that makes us feel that way and if you know theres no afterlfe then why go on with life why be a part of it your not going to exist way longer than you existed so if you have no meaning then why should you continue to if know in a few decades that your going to be just food for bugs and thats it no glory after life no nothing forever thats the atheist belife that sounds so exciting for your guys afterlife.

As we get closer and closer to the Second Coming of Christ, there will be increasing and widespread doubt about whether Jesus even existed. People will also start wondering if God really exists and believers will leave the Christian faith (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, 1 Timothy 4:1-2, and 2 Peter 2:1-3). Do you think we're already seeing these signs?

Wow, really? The bible doesn't say that God told unto Moses to lead his people against the Amalekites, and after he has slaughtered the men, women and boys, he and his followers may take the female virgins for their own?
The bible doesn't say that you may stone your children to death if they disobey you?
:whoah:

T'is not I sir, I think it is you who hath never read the Bible, good sir!

EDIT: No, I think you're fucking stupid. Sir Isaac Newton was a spiritualist, not a Christian! Albert Einstein was an atheist, not a Christian! Abraham Lincoln was a deist, not a Christian! Benjamin Franklin was a deist who HATED Christians! Get your facts right before you drag people's names through the mud, especially these men!
 
like i said you must not know how to read engish I said that believed in god not that they were christians like i said you obviously have a lot of haterd towards their belife its funny because white people are the ones who started the chirstian faith no I'm not a racist but i can see you getting mad over this cause your running out of explainations so you insult me and albert einstein did believe in a god but not a personal one.
Properly title myself as a Christian” then what am I? If I accept the existence of God then I must believe in Christianity.

As for stoning as far as I know only the Muslims behave in such ways, you talk about certain individuals I presume this only occurs in the USA?

Let's not take scientific laws into the equation here because scientists keep changing their minds every decade, example global warming

5 months ago 6 Jesus said in John 14:6: I am THE Way and THE Truth and THE Life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through ME. 1 John 5:12 says: he who has the Son has life, he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.
 
like i said you must not know how to read engish I said that believed in god not that they were christians like i said you obviously have a lot of haterd towards their belife its funny because white people are the ones who started the chirstian faith no I'm not a racist but i can see you getting mad over this cause your running out of explainations so you insult me and albert einstein did believe in a god but not a personal one.
Properly title myself as a Christian” then what am I? If I accept the existence of God then I must believe in Christianity.

As for stoning as far as I know only the Muslims behave in such ways, you talk about certain individuals I presume this only occurs in the USA?

Let's not take scientific laws into the equation here because scientists keep changing their minds every decade, example global warming

5 months ago 6 Jesus said in John 14:6: I am THE Way and THE Truth and THE Life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through ME. 1 John 5:12 says: he who has the Son has life, he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.

Really? The Palestinians were white 2000 years ago?
Maybe YOU can't read English, Spiritualists and Deists don't believe in an intervening God who appears in our lives and changes reality because we prayed for it. Benjamin Franklin and Abraham Lincoln believed that there probably was a God who created the planet because they didn't know how else we could've got here, Thomas Jefferson used to ask why sea shells were found so high up on cliffs (I'm not sure why this bothered him) but a lot of things they didn't know -that we now know- are the reason they believed in a creator, but not an intervener, that's the difference between a deist and a theist.

If you think only Muslims have ever stoned anyone, you really must read the bible, you are COMMANDED by God to stone certain people to death.

Yes, scientists keep changing their mind every time they are proved wrong about something by other scientists. Religious people have NEVER proved a scientist wrong about ANYTHING. Scientists are humble enough to admit when they're wrong because they're interested in the truth.
However, when we discovered that the clouds in the sky were not the entrance to heaven, religious people just kept pushing God further out into space, now he is no longer merely the creator of Heaven and earth, he's the creator of the Heavens and the universe.
Oh, so God's even more brilliant than we thought!
:doh:
 
"Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system, I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." ―Sir Isaac Newton
Ben Franklin was not for separation of Church and state. There is nothing that suggests it anywhere especially not in the Constitution. Frankln brought prayer into Congress and it was in every part of US fabric. We were founded on Christian Law and principles
 
"Lighthouses are more useful than churches" -Benjamin Franklin.

I SAID spiritualists and deists don't believe in an INTERVENING God.

Sir Isaac Newton (though I respect him) was completely insane. He kept setting fire to his house. He also went to seances to listen to babblings from the beyond.
 
"Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system, I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." ―Sir Isaac Newton
Ben Franklin was not for separation of Church and state. There is nothing that suggests it anywhere especially not in the Constitution. Frankln brought prayer into Congress and it was in every part of US fabric. We were founded on Christian Law and principles

The American Constitution is secular, I think you know that. You can believe what you like as long as you don't make it policy.

I already said that in Newton's time, there wasn't any reason NOT to believe in a creator.
 
Shane, many of the greatest minds in history also believed the Earth was the center of the solar system. They were wrong about that, too. Your argument is flawed.

As just one of many examples, read Levitics 24:10 where God specifically commands his followers to slaughter anyone who speaks ill of Him. Very mature, God.

It's not Einstein who proved the law of conservation of energy, but no matter. You're right that energy can be neither created nor destroyed, only change form. But are you really saying energy can be neither created nor destroyed, only change form - therefore ghosts, which are energy in a different form, are real? That's completely illogical. The fact that energy cannot be destroyed in no way proves that ghosts exist.

Your next argument is probably the worst one - you asked, if I know there is no afterlife, then why go on with life? That makes absolutely no sense. Much more logical would be to ask - if you know there IS an afterlife, and it's an afterlife of beauty of perfection, then why waste any more time in this life? I'm sure you have an answer, and that's great, because I don't want you to kill yourself. But knowing there is no afterlife has no bearing on the incredible gift of my current life, which gives me an opportunity to love, to live, to learn, to enjoy, to build, to create, to educate, and to cherish. All of which has nothing to do with some imaginary sky man and his afterlife.


If the bible is true, then the universe we see should reflect the universe described in the bible. So please prove to me that God exists, and that he wants me to do the things he says in the bible (like slaughtering people who blaspheme against Him) without using the bible (you can use the information in the bible for ideas, but quoting a hodge podge of old books that weren't even put together until a hundred years after Jesus died, and even then were only selected by a council for their political ends, is not compelling evidence in the slightest).

I await your evidence.


Wow ticklish 9 and john now i know you have no reserch on the bible it self no where in the bible it says that god said to kill, rape, murder,or do harm to children you dont know to much and you really don't pay to much attention didn't you read what I wrote about Albert Einstein.
Though intuitively by nature many of us 'believe' to the thought of its phenomenal existence. The natural phenomena is also said being part of nature in this universe..
Beside still many others base it in its spiritual nature.
Ghosts are known as non physical entities, present on other dimensional life. But it possesses an energy force that is known to be as existing.

And Albert Einstein had proven that existence of energy that survives..It only changes its form.
__________________
what do you think that means I think its a pretty strong point and also many of the greatest minds in the history of the world believed in god I'm pretty sure if god was evil then why would they follow him till there last days Sir Issac Newton, Albert Einstein, Shake Sphere, Abraham Lincoln,Ben Fraklin and so on brillant minds and your telling me that they were dumb enough to follow an evil god wow its just sad to see people can be so blind even when people have very strong points and evidence they chose to call it something they to can't explained I'm not say that when something weird happens all the its an act of god but whenyou can't explain it and you know for a fact the laws of physics don't apply you chose to ignore the sign or act and say oh its this complicated universe and I can't explain it its complicated and very complexed for a very good reason but know very little of this universe and of this world we still have much to learn about life and its mysterious ways. Let me ask you this do you feel love ,and sadness,hate angry,happiness how can you explain that if you can't see it you can't just pull it out of your body or theres no special organ that makes us feel that way and if you know theres no afterlfe then why go on with life why be a part of it your not going to exist way longer than you existed so if you have no meaning then why should you continue to if know in a few decades that your going to be just food for bugs and thats it no glory after life no nothing forever thats the atheist belife that sounds so exciting for your guys afterlife.

As we get closer and closer to the Second Coming of Christ, there will be increasing and widespread doubt about whether Jesus even existed. People will also start wondering if God really exists and believers will leave the Christian faith (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, 1 Timothy 4:1-2, and 2 Peter 2:1-3). Do you think we're already seeing these signs?
 
I have no interests whatsoever of enlightening you. You were never part of my original conversation.
And do me a favor, your s/n Ticklish9's is so unbecoming to you...why not something simple like Mr Smith ?


:lol: I wasn't part of your original, public, posted-on-the-internet-on-a-message-board-conversation?

I have the fierce courage of my convictions that arises from the knowledge that though I do not have all the answers, I am seeking genuine testable truth through reason and evidence. I would expect you, an avowed "seeker of truth" to have the same courage of your own convictions.


Instead, you retreat the instant your beliefs are challenged. You even toss off a paltry ad hominem in an attempt to obfuscate.


I didn't peg you for a coward, but there you go.

Disappointing.
 
like i said you must not know how to read engish I said that believed in god not that they were christians like i said you obviously have a lot of haterd towards their belife its funny because white people are the ones who started the chirstian faith no I'm not a racist but i can see you getting mad over this cause your running out of explainations so you insult me and albert einstein did believe in a god but not a personal one.
Properly title myself as a Christian” then what am I? If I accept the existence of God then I must believe in Christianity.

As for stoning as far as I know only the Muslims behave in such ways, you talk about certain individuals I presume this only occurs in the USA?

Let's not take scientific laws into the equation here because scientists keep changing their minds every decade, example global warming

5 months ago 6 Jesus said in John 14:6: I am THE Way and THE Truth and THE Life, NO ONE comes to the Father except through ME. 1 John 5:12 says: he who has the Son has life, he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.


As far as stoning he's talking about the book that underlies your entire religion. He and I both expected you to recognize the bible verses in question because they are FROM THE BIBLE. The book you claim to gird your life with.

Anyway, do me a favour and look up Deuteronomy 22:13-24, Leviticus 24:16, Deuteronomy 21:18-21 (that's the one where God tells you to stone your children for not listening to you), Exodus 19:13, and Numbers 15:32-56.

You wanted to talk about stoning, there's more where that came from. The Bible is full of cases of God asking His followers to slaughter people.

Sometimes He does it Himself, too; check out Leviticus 10:1, where God kills Aaron's sons for offering the wrong kind of incense.


Once again, just so we're clear - the Bible contains all those versus specifically telling us to kill in God's name. If you have a child who didn't listen to you one time, and you didn't kill that child, you're violating God's will. Think that over.



Oh, and you just used a scientific law about energy to "prove" ghosts, now you're saying let's not take scientific laws into account? Make up your mind, man.
 
"Atheism is so senseless. When I look at the solar system, I see the earth at the right distance from the sun to receive the proper amounts of heat and light. This did not happen by chance." ―Sir Isaac Newton
Ben Franklin was not for separation of Church and state. There is nothing that suggests it anywhere especially not in the Constitution. Frankln brought prayer into Congress and it was in every part of US fabric. We were founded on Christian Law and principles



Sweet merciful crap, have you ever READ the Constitution?

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

That's the part that specifically makes it illegal for the STATE to involve the CHURCH. In other words, it's designed to SEPARATE the CHURCH and the STATE.


If we were founded on Christian principles, then why isn't it illegal to covet they neighbour's wife? Why isn't it illegal to have other gods before the Christian God? That's the first freaking commandment, but it's not anywhere in American law - and in fact is expressly forbidden by the Constitution from ever being a law.



Good freaking grief man, you can do better than that.
 
There are phenomena which defy science.

Religious beliefs aside, believe it or not, I've witnessed something inexplicable and you'll say, sure, you can't discuss it because no such thing happened --- I don't care. I was with more than one person who saw something very clearly that couldn't be explained by science.

Unfortunately I will also "out" myself to anyone who reads this if they know me and share this forum, :ermm: so I can only say it may seem irrational but I definitely believe there's more going on here than we can see or explain.

It would be much easier to explain Crop Circles, or the perfect ingenuity of the constructions of ancient Egypt, and I'm sure both have been at least somewhat de-mystified, if only with likely theories,
but this sort of movement was just not explainable. If I'd been alone I would not have believed I really saw it years later, but it was no dream.

Some may say that such things are evidence of God, others may say, and anything is possible, that it's aliens. And this had nothing to do with the afterlife, I CAN at least write that it was just movement that was physically impossible, close and clear as day, and I wasn't the only one to see it, several did.

Although I could say it was something very much like shadows re-arranging themselves when that was not possible, the sources weren't moving, only the shadows. Distinctly.

I'm Christian (who believes in evolution, as any Christian should... Christ spoke in parables, seven days could easily be millions of years...)
so perhaps I'm not objective in terms of (thinking it was a "sign") but on the other hand, I can't explain it.

---------Even if you disagree, there's no excuse for totally disrespecting others' belief systems or manner of expression :illogical

I'm disappointed that so many are nitpicking about someone's choice of words :facepalm: ---- I understood every post in this thread.

Which is about ghosts, and I see how that leads to religion (and unfortunately that leads to ALL SORTS of tangents....) 🙄
but I'm not assuming I do or am capable of knowing everything, or that human science can do so. It's mindblowing, but it's imperfect.

We're trained to think, for the most part, to question. Yes, even the Christians.... 🙄

There's a lot of mythology that's been de-bunked, but once you witness something that you realize cannot be explained with any physical science,

whether it's a knife suddenly moving fast, no one near it, from a stationary position on top of a box (maybe sitting in the middle of the top of the box, not even at the edge?), to suddenly rush to embed itself a few feet away,

....or shadows moving independently (it wasn't that creepy but it was the equivalent, that is a perfect parallel)

-- you'll understand --- because you'll have collected that objective data yourself.
If you're with others, all the better, you don't doubt yourself when you know others have seen the same impossible occurrance. Because I agree, our senses can fool us. But not a group of people, to that extent.
 
Just once wouldn't you love for someone to simply show you the evidence for God's existence? No arm-twisting. No statements of, "You just have to believe." Well, here is an attempt to candidly offer some of the reasons which suggest that God exists.

But first consider this. If a person opposes even the possibility of there being a God, then any evidence can be rationalized or explained away. It is like if someone refuses to believe that people have walked on the moon, then no amount of information is going to change their thinking. Photographs of astronauts walking on the moon, interviews with the astronauts, moon rocks...all the evidence would be worthless, because the person has already concluded that people cannot go to the moon.

When it comes to the possibility of God's existence, the Bible says that there are people who have seen sufficient evidence, but they have suppressed the truth about God.1 On the other hand, for those who want to know God if he is there, he says, "You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart, I will be found by you."2 Before you look at the facts surrounding God's existence, ask yourself, If God does exist, would I want to know him? Here then, are some reasons to consider...

1. Does God exist? The complexity of our planet points to a deliberate Designer who not only created our universe, but sustains it today.
Many examples showing God's design could be given, possibly with no end. But here are a few:

The Earth...its size is perfect. The Earth's size and corresponding gravity holds a thin layer of mostly nitrogen and oxygen gases, only extending about 50 miles above the Earth's surface. If Earth were smaller, an atmosphere would be impossible, like the planet Mercury. If Earth were larger, its atmosphere would contain free hydrogen, like Jupiter.3 Earth is the only known planet equipped with an atmosphere of the right mixture of gases to sustain plant, animal and human life.

The Earth is located the right distance from the sun. Consider the temperature swings we encounter, roughly -30 degrees to +120 degrees. If the Earth were any further away from the sun, we would all freeze. Any closer and we would burn up. Even a fractional variance in the Earth's position to the sun would make life on Earth impossible. The Earth remains this perfect distance from the sun while it rotates around the sun at a speed of nearly 67,000 mph. It is also rotating on its axis, allowing the entire surface of the Earth to be properly warmed and cooled every day.

And our moon is the perfect size and distance from the Earth for its gravitational pull. The moon creates important ocean tides and movement so ocean waters do not stagnate, and yet our massive oceans are restrained from spilling over across the continents.4

Water...colorless, odorless and without taste, and yet no living thing can survive without it. Plants, animals and human beings consist mostly of water (about two-thirds of the human body is water). You'll see why the characteristics of water are uniquely suited to life:

It has an unusually high boiling point and freezing point. Water allows us to live in an environment of fluctuating temperature changes, while keeping our bodies a steady 98.6 degrees.

Water is a universal solvent. This property of water means that thousands of chemicals, minerals and nutrients can be carried throughout our bodies and into the smallest blood vessels.5

Water is also chemically neutral. Without affecting the makeup of the substances it carries, water enables food, medicines and minerals to be absorbed and used by the body.

Water has a unique surface tension. Water in plants can therefore flow upward against gravity, bringing life-giving water and nutrients to the top of even the tallest trees.

Water freezes from the top down and floats, so fish can live in the winter.

Ninety-seven percent of the Earth's water is in the oceans. But on our Earth, there is a system designed which removes salt from the water and then distributes that water throughout the globe. Evaporation takes the ocean waters, leaving the salt, and forms clouds which are easily moved by the wind to disperse water over the land, for vegetation, animals and people. It is a system of purification and supply that sustains life on this planet, a system of recycled and reused water.6

The human brain...simultaneously processes an amazing amount of information. Your brain takes in all the colors and objects you see, the temperature around you, the pressure of your feet against the floor, the sounds around you, the dryness of your mouth, even the texture of your keyboard. Your brain holds and processes all your emotions, thoughts and memories. At the same time your brain keeps track of the ongoing functions of your body like your breathing pattern, eyelid movement, hunger and movement of the muscles in your hands.

The human brain processes more than a million messages a second.7 Your brain weighs the importance of all this data, filtering out the relatively unimportant. This screening function is what allows you to focus and operate effectively in your world. The brain functions differently than other organs. There is an intelligence to it, the ability to reason, to produce feelings, to dream and plan, to take action, and relate to other people.

The eye...can distinguish among seven million colors. It has automatic focusing and handles an astounding 1.5 million messages -- simultaneously.8 Evolution focuses on mutations and changes from and within existing organisms. Yet evolution alone does not fully explain the initial source of the eye or the brain -- the start of living organisms from nonliving matter.

2. Does God exist? The universe had a start - what caused it?
Scientists are convinced that our universe began with one enormous explosion of energy and light, which we now call the Big Bang. This was the singular start to everything that exists: the beginning of the universe, the start of space, and even the initial start of time itself.

Astrophysicist Robert Jastrow, a self-described agnostic, stated, "The seed of everything that has happened in the Universe was planted in that first instant; every star, every planet and every living creature in the Universe came into being as a result of events that were set in motion in the moment of the cosmic explosion...The Universe flashed into being, and we cannot find out what caused that to happen."9

Steven Weinberg, a Nobel laureate in Physics, said at the moment of this explosion, "the universe was about a hundred thousands million degrees Centigrade...and the universe was filled with light."10

The universe has not always existed. It had a start...what caused that? Scientists have no explanation for the sudden explosion of light and matter.

3. Does God exist? The universe operates by uniform laws of nature. Why does it?
Much of life may seem uncertain, but look at what we can count on day after day: gravity remains consistent, a hot cup of coffee left on a counter will get cold, the earth rotates in the same 24 hours, and the speed of light doesn't change -- on earth or in galaxies far from us.

How is it that we can identify laws of nature that never change? Why is the universe so orderly, so reliable?

"The greatest scientists have been struck by how strange this is. There is no logical necessity for a universe that obeys rules, let alone one that abides by the rules of mathematics. This astonishment springs from the recognition that the universe doesn't have to behave this way. It is easy to imagine a universe in which conditions change unpredictably from instant to instant, or even a universe in which things pop in and out of existence."11

Richard Feynman, a Nobel Prize winner for quantum electrodynamics, said, "Why nature is mathematical is a mystery...The fact that there are rules at all is a kind of miracle."12

4. Does God exist? The DNA code informs, programs a cell's behavior.
All instruction, all teaching, all training comes with intent. Someone who writes an instruction manual does so with purpose. Did you know that in every cell of our bodies there exists a very detailed instruction code, much like a miniature computer program? As you may know, a computer program is made up of ones and zeros, like this: 110010101011000. The way they are arranged tell the computer program what to do. The DNA code in each of our cells is very similar. It's made up of four chemicals that scientists abbreviate as A, T, G, and C. These are arranged in the human cell like this: CGTGTGACTCGCTCCTGAT and so on. There are three billion of these letters in every human cell!!

Well, just like you can program your phone to beep for specific reasons, DNA instructs the cell. DNA is a three-billion-lettered program telling the cell to act in a certain way. It is a full instruction manual.13

Why is this so amazing? One has to ask....how did this information program wind up in each human cell? These are not just chemicals. These are chemicals that instruct, that code in a very detailed way exactly how the person's body should develop.

Natural, biological causes are completely lacking as an explanation when programmed information is involved. You cannot find instruction, precise information like this, without someone intentionally constructing it.
 
Some facts about life must be taken into account before we try to form a judgement:

Man lives in a universe of cause and effect and the consequences of certain causes are inescapable. Fire burns, water drowns, disease germs destroy. These facts have moral implications. Men live in a universe in which the consequences of what they do are inescapable, and therefore their responsibility for what they do is equally inescapable. Without this burden of 'natural law' man could do as he liked with impunity, and there would be no responsibility. God made the universe this way because He is a moral God who makes men responsible beings with freewill to choose how they will act.
Man's neglect and misuse of his own life has corrupted the stream of human life itself, and left evils which fall on succeeding generations. These, again as part of natural law, may manifest themselves as hereditary weaknesses and tendencies to disease. The very stuff of life may be affected as it is passed on from generation to generation.
The consequences of man's acts are not only directly physical. The social and political evils which they have created throughout history have left a gathering burden on the generations following. People today are caught in a net of the consequences of past history, and even when they try to right one evil, another is brought to bear: "The whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now" (Romans 8:22).
SUFFERING is a problem in life that comes home to everyone. A child is born blind, deformed or mentally afflicted; and the question comes: Why? The child has done no harm.

A man or woman of fine character and in the prime of life is racked with pain in a hopeless disease that can only end in death. Why him? Why her? These are the people who can least be spared.

Millions in the world are suffering semi-starvation and disease in countries with vast populations and little fertility. Others perish or are made homeless in floods and earthquakes. Why should they suffer?

Pain, torture and death have been imposed on helpless millions by the tyranny of man and the destructiveness of modern war. Countless lives are lost in acts of terrorism, by brutality and hijacking. Accidents there have always been, but the scale of today's disasters and natural calamities is often overwhelming: a passenger aircraft crashes; an oil rig blows up; fire traps hundreds in an underground train. People ask: Why does God allow it?

The questions readily rise to mind and on the surface seem reasonable: yet a candid look at them shows that they carry certain implications. They imply that suffering in human life is inconsistent either with the power or with the love of God: that as a God of love either He has not the power to prevent the suffering, or if He has the power then He has not the will, and is not a God of love. It is assumed that the prevention of suffering as it now affects the apparently innocent is something we should expect from a God of love who is also Almighty. Are these assumptions justified?

Facts of Life

It is in the light of this latter conclusion that we may understand a passage in the Letter to the Hebrews based on a saying in the Book of Proverbs:

"And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him: for whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby. Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees" (Hebrews 12:5-12; Proverbs 3:11-12).

Read in its context, the passage expounds itself. Suffering and loss are common to man, but for the children of God they are directed by their Heavenly Father as a spiritual training, and as such are the expression of His love.
 
Shane, if you copy whole texts from other sources, at least LIST your source! Otherwise it is plagiarism!
 
Crazy Jay’s! His wild thread topics are IN-SHANE!

crazyeddies.jpg
 
If only there were some perfectly rational scientific explanation for why a few people are so convinced that impossible things have happened to them...

http://memorylab.uchicago.edu/pdf/Meyersburg_2009.pdf

In other words, those of you who have had paranormal experiences, your brain just sucks at telling the difference between what's real and what's not.

Either that, or it's all a big conspiracy, wingnuts. Take your pick.
 
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ah, is so good when you find a youtube video that sums up all of your own views 😀
 
I could debate with you the theology of religion and biblical texts, as far as an afterlife is concerned I can only say that I don't believe in it. I can't prove that there isn't one, I've never been dead. However I can say that there's no evidence for it. Lazarus never talked about it and nobody ever asked him (for some reason no one seemed interested).

LOL duh, between his three day hunger and martha's obsessive bathing him how could he talk?
 
oh and yes i believe in ghosts.
not only have i seen them and heard them, but ive been attacked by a shadow person
 
LOL duh, between his three day hunger and martha's obsessive bathing him how could he talk?

You can't be serious. If you had been dead wouldn't you be eager to talk to someone about it, even if they are scrubbing your crotch?
 
oh and yes i believe in ghosts.
not only have i seen them and heard them, but ive been attacked by a shadow person

I've never heard this term before, so I'll now do some internet sleuthing...

http://paranormal.about.com/od/trueghoststories/a/shadow-people.htm

"What You Need To Know About the Shadow People"

This article is about 2 pages long, which means that the author has stabbed the logic centre of my brain approximately 1200 times. :drunktype:

Here are some highlights:
"The one detail most often noted in some shadow being sightings are their glowing red eyes."

"The dark countenance and malevolent feelings that are often reported in association with these creatures has led some researchers to speculate that they may be demonic in nature."

"Perhaps, some theorize, the vibrations of our existence are beginning to mesh with those of another dimension, which accounts for the increase in such phenomena as ghosts, shadow people and possibly aliens."

"There is no way to prove or disprove any theories about a phenomenon that is so mysterious, that happens so quickly and without warning."

Maybe not, college dropout, but Science is on the job:

http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/node/686

"The paper, published in the British journal Nature, describes the case of a 22-year-old woman with no history of psychiatric problems who was being evaluated for treatment of epilepsy. When a region of her brain called the left temporoparietal junction was electrically stimulated, the woman described encounters with a ‘shadow person' who mimicked her bodily movements.

"Similar shadowy encounters have been described by people with schizophrenia, as well as by healthy subjects, leading the researchers to believe that: 'Our findings may be a step towards understanding the mechanisms behind psychiatric manifestations such as paranoia, persecution and alien control.'"

Anything else?
 
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