LovesHeels
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My friend wants to kill himself :(
- Thread starter LovesHeels
- Start date
I'm very sorry to hear this. It sounds to me like your friend is in need of help with a professional. I dont know what would work,. but perhaps an intervention with those closest to him, to sit him down, to get psychiatric help, and deal with this behavior, for himself, and the good of his family. He needs to be told that even if he hates himself enough to want to commit suicide, to think of the consequences to his kids and his family.
I can understand why you have had it with him, but some last ditch effort needs to be done. I hope something can be worked out. My thoughts are with him. Good Luck in your efforts in talking to and dealing with him.
Mitch
I can understand why you have had it with him, but some last ditch effort needs to be done. I hope something can be worked out. My thoughts are with him. Good Luck in your efforts in talking to and dealing with him.
Mitch
Agreed. One authority or another needs to be informed. I would consult local law enforcement for guidance. Why?
You only need one gun and one bullet to kill yourself if you have any competence. Why the second gun and "a whole lot of ammo"? If these guns are in fact a part of his plan, that's the most concerning thing to me. If he has a suicide plan that involves multiple guns and a lot of ammo... ...well, it's very troubling.
If he's determined, you won't be able to stop him. No one will. I appreciate your desire to reach out to him and your heart's in a good place, but you might be trying to bring down Godzilla by throwing stones at this point. Besides, I'm suspecting you are mostly a caring friend and not a professional counselor.
Counseling is one thing, but measures need to be taken to protect those around him. If you think these guns are part of his plan, I would express concern to local law enforcement first and foremost, and ask for further guidance. Depending where you're at, state law, and the facts of the case, there may be a provision for involuntary commitment to contain potential danger. The police would know. I don't mean to overblow it, and what I address is the worst-case scenario, of course, but when you're talking in terms of life and death, and the potential lives of others involved, worst case scenarios warrant consideration.
I wish you luck.
Terra_Ascension
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Sending some very powerful prayers to him and to you and to the whole family and the entire situation!
TA
TA
please keep us posted babe?
http://suicidehotlines.com/national.html
We should all be so lucky to have a friend as caring as you.
XOXO
http://suicidehotlines.com/national.html
We should all be so lucky to have a friend as caring as you.
XOXO
johnttickle
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We fortunately have some suicide and grief counselors in our midst here on the forum, hopefully they will contact you with advice and resources...
We pray for you, and this guys family also, because this affects all of you....
We pray for you, and this guys family also, because this affects all of you....
- Joined
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This is a difficult situation from all sides.
Based on the descroption you have given there are a lot of behaviors going on. You've been able to share the ones that are visible, but odds are there are a lot of other ones active that cannot be seen from the outside that are driving events.
The substance abuse seems to be a both a result of the deeper issues, and in turn a fuel for further depression, and problems. Getting it under control will help, and is a good place to start but it will not solve the issues that are at the base of this persons suicidal feelings.
This is a snap read, the sort I'd do in a basic counceling if I stepped in cold:
There is a deep chronic depression taking place here that has been set off by deep life issues that *may* be based in self image and life path.
As you note he's not happy with how his life came out, and now that it's unfolded, feels that what he has is of no worth, when compaired to the fantasy of what he dreamed of having. In short, his desire for 'other' is so large that he has discarded the value of the real things around him.
This includes his marrage and children, and also those friends that are trying to support the 'realistic' view of his life. As he has rejected his life as 'no good' anyone that works against that view is attemptign to disrupt the world view he has chosen, and they will be faced with anger and hostility. This cycle will push people away over time, and produce the sort of feelings that you are having toward him.
Your own feelings are 100% natural and correct to have. You wish to help, and have tried, and for you troubles you have been abused and ignored. Imagine trying to help a wounded pet. You want to help it, but as you reach out to do so it bites and scratches in response due to the pain it is feeling. You did not cause the pain, but you are a real thing that is handy to strike in frustration. You are a part of the hated world that hurts. Not the happy one that is dreamed of.
Dealing with people in situations like this can feel very much like banging ones head into a wall over and over. One is rejected, yelled at, etc. It gets disenhartning and in honesty one can only do so much in such cases, as you can utterly drain yourself trying to hold such a person up. All you CAN do is tell the person that you care, and don't want to see them hurt themselves (you don't say that you don't like seeing them unhappy, as suicide is a solution to that issue) and that you are there to listen to and talk to.
In this case playing up how good his life is currently (all the positives that he has) will be inneffective. He has discounted that view and is not ready to accept it nor will he. It's a waste of time. The only real direction that you can come at things from is to slowly take apart the thinking that he's attached to this 'fantasy' life he felt that he should have had. That is going to be slow and hard work. And one that a Pro in the mental fields will need to do. I'd not try it as a spot councelor.
Your goal should be trying to move him toward Pro Help in any form. He'll need a lot of time with one to get to any level of peace.
As for the weapons, they should be removed from the home if he's showing suicidal thoughts. The hassle of having to go out and buy a gun is often enough to stop an attempt when it comes on suddenly. So removing the tools that could be used on impulse can save a life. This is a job for his wife. If it makes him angry tough shit. (and it will) She has a right and possible responsibility to remove these tools from his access.
Over all it seems you are doing what is best. Be supportive of the fact that you know he is unhappy. And feel free to say that you don't understand why and get him to talk about it. You can ask why he thinks that being a playboy would make him happy (what aspects of it does he fixate upon? Easy Sex? The Travel? The idea of Freedom?) Once you have specific aspects you can open discussions on them and how they don't in yoru eyes seem to make for a better life.
Push for him to see help. Work on the substance issues.
Best of luck
Myriads
Based on the descroption you have given there are a lot of behaviors going on. You've been able to share the ones that are visible, but odds are there are a lot of other ones active that cannot be seen from the outside that are driving events.
The substance abuse seems to be a both a result of the deeper issues, and in turn a fuel for further depression, and problems. Getting it under control will help, and is a good place to start but it will not solve the issues that are at the base of this persons suicidal feelings.
This is a snap read, the sort I'd do in a basic counceling if I stepped in cold:
There is a deep chronic depression taking place here that has been set off by deep life issues that *may* be based in self image and life path.
As you note he's not happy with how his life came out, and now that it's unfolded, feels that what he has is of no worth, when compaired to the fantasy of what he dreamed of having. In short, his desire for 'other' is so large that he has discarded the value of the real things around him.
This includes his marrage and children, and also those friends that are trying to support the 'realistic' view of his life. As he has rejected his life as 'no good' anyone that works against that view is attemptign to disrupt the world view he has chosen, and they will be faced with anger and hostility. This cycle will push people away over time, and produce the sort of feelings that you are having toward him.
Your own feelings are 100% natural and correct to have. You wish to help, and have tried, and for you troubles you have been abused and ignored. Imagine trying to help a wounded pet. You want to help it, but as you reach out to do so it bites and scratches in response due to the pain it is feeling. You did not cause the pain, but you are a real thing that is handy to strike in frustration. You are a part of the hated world that hurts. Not the happy one that is dreamed of.
Dealing with people in situations like this can feel very much like banging ones head into a wall over and over. One is rejected, yelled at, etc. It gets disenhartning and in honesty one can only do so much in such cases, as you can utterly drain yourself trying to hold such a person up. All you CAN do is tell the person that you care, and don't want to see them hurt themselves (you don't say that you don't like seeing them unhappy, as suicide is a solution to that issue) and that you are there to listen to and talk to.
In this case playing up how good his life is currently (all the positives that he has) will be inneffective. He has discounted that view and is not ready to accept it nor will he. It's a waste of time. The only real direction that you can come at things from is to slowly take apart the thinking that he's attached to this 'fantasy' life he felt that he should have had. That is going to be slow and hard work. And one that a Pro in the mental fields will need to do. I'd not try it as a spot councelor.
Your goal should be trying to move him toward Pro Help in any form. He'll need a lot of time with one to get to any level of peace.
As for the weapons, they should be removed from the home if he's showing suicidal thoughts. The hassle of having to go out and buy a gun is often enough to stop an attempt when it comes on suddenly. So removing the tools that could be used on impulse can save a life. This is a job for his wife. If it makes him angry tough shit. (and it will) She has a right and possible responsibility to remove these tools from his access.
Over all it seems you are doing what is best. Be supportive of the fact that you know he is unhappy. And feel free to say that you don't understand why and get him to talk about it. You can ask why he thinks that being a playboy would make him happy (what aspects of it does he fixate upon? Easy Sex? The Travel? The idea of Freedom?) Once you have specific aspects you can open discussions on them and how they don't in yoru eyes seem to make for a better life.
Push for him to see help. Work on the substance issues.
Best of luck
Myriads
what Myriads has suggested makes the best sense to me..my mom was very much like this friend of yours..she however succeeded in ending her life..however she was delusional at the time, and it wasn't a rational choice..
the best of luck whatever advice you decide to follow..i'd go with Myriad's myself..
the best of luck whatever advice you decide to follow..i'd go with Myriad's myself..
Mistress Aura
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Forgive Me If I Seem Harsh--
As always, Myriads' cool logic and wisdom makes the most sense and has effectively calmed the fire that was about to pour from my hands when I read this. Still, I feel a finger in the middle of my back pressuring me to add my two cents worth. I mean no harm or disrespect to anyone, the majority of this is my own.
I have absolutely no patience with suicidal threats and thoughts. Not because I'm harsh or heartless, not at all...but because I suffer from bouts of that very thing myself. When I'm at the bottom of the cycle, the idea of sucking on the muzzle of a pistol seems to be as soothing as cool water on a burn. I've researched the best and worst ways to end things, from the most effective and unstoppable ways to slice to the best and worst meds to take to the best weapon and placement of such for a clean, immediate "parting shot" during some of my worst periods. I understand fully and completely what your friend is experiencing--and if he doesn't get professional help, there is not a thing you can do to stop what he's fixated on.
There are two groups of people in the suicidal pile, with a subgroup that straddles the "gray area" fence. Group one, those who thump their chests and shout about their plans, both to garner full and focused attention from their friends and family as well as a "traditional" cry for help...and group two, those who tell no-one of their plans; they set their affairs in order, go off someplace and just do it. If he begins giving away his stuff and really just stops discussing it totally, beware--he's almost there.
When I look at my own actions, I realize my greatest problem is that depression is merely disguising an out-and-out temper tantrum. EOD. That's what it is for me, that's all it is for me. I can't have my way, can't have the game go the way I want it to go, so f*ck it, I'm going to take my toys and go home. When a child has a temper tantrum, how is it generally dealt with? I know how I handled my own son's.
When I'm at the top of a cycle and rational, I just get p*ssed off at myself. It is the most selfish, cruel, heartless thing any being can do to those who love and care about him or her--and in a spiritually faith-based situation, the ultimate act of defiance. Suicide is simply slapping God in the face with the exercising of mutated and poisoned "free will". Each person deals and believes in his or her own way, of course, but that is sometimes the final thought that keeps me from giving in to the bullsh*t that leads me down to the actual end of that path. And you know what? Once I come out of it, invariably all I feel is deeply ashamed--ashamed to have put my dear ones through the drama again, ashamed of my own weakness, ashamed of my stupidity and selfishness. You can only apologize for the same thing to loved ones so many times before they just stop hearing you.
If he's really that close to fruition, his wife needs to become very pragmatic. She needs to take every weapon from the house and just get rid of them--yeah, he's going to spit and pop, but he gave up the right to having his anger recognized when he brought them into the home in the first place...and if she's forced to take the next step, he can't have the capability of being armed.
She then needs to talk to him (and sternly!) about getting professional help voluntarily. If he refuses, she needs to examine their insurance for coverage information, then she needs to sign him into a facility for treatment whether he likes it or not, no further discussion. The long-term emotional damage being done to his own children by what they're seeing Daddy do and how he's behaving should be incentive enough to face the dragon that will emerge. (Experience speaking here. My own mother didn't bother with that when my father went through this, she simply packed her stuff when I was 15 and left him--with me. See how well I did after being exposed to it??) Be supportive of his family, but more than facing off with him, help his wife be strong. If she does what she needs to do, she's the one who'll need it.
I pray that something else wakes him up first, though, I really do. What he's feeling sucks beyond description, I know...but what everyone else will be feeling if he doesn't snap out of it will be far, far worse.
Mistress Aura
As always, Myriads' cool logic and wisdom makes the most sense and has effectively calmed the fire that was about to pour from my hands when I read this. Still, I feel a finger in the middle of my back pressuring me to add my two cents worth. I mean no harm or disrespect to anyone, the majority of this is my own.
I have absolutely no patience with suicidal threats and thoughts. Not because I'm harsh or heartless, not at all...but because I suffer from bouts of that very thing myself. When I'm at the bottom of the cycle, the idea of sucking on the muzzle of a pistol seems to be as soothing as cool water on a burn. I've researched the best and worst ways to end things, from the most effective and unstoppable ways to slice to the best and worst meds to take to the best weapon and placement of such for a clean, immediate "parting shot" during some of my worst periods. I understand fully and completely what your friend is experiencing--and if he doesn't get professional help, there is not a thing you can do to stop what he's fixated on.
There are two groups of people in the suicidal pile, with a subgroup that straddles the "gray area" fence. Group one, those who thump their chests and shout about their plans, both to garner full and focused attention from their friends and family as well as a "traditional" cry for help...and group two, those who tell no-one of their plans; they set their affairs in order, go off someplace and just do it. If he begins giving away his stuff and really just stops discussing it totally, beware--he's almost there.
When I look at my own actions, I realize my greatest problem is that depression is merely disguising an out-and-out temper tantrum. EOD. That's what it is for me, that's all it is for me. I can't have my way, can't have the game go the way I want it to go, so f*ck it, I'm going to take my toys and go home. When a child has a temper tantrum, how is it generally dealt with? I know how I handled my own son's.
When I'm at the top of a cycle and rational, I just get p*ssed off at myself. It is the most selfish, cruel, heartless thing any being can do to those who love and care about him or her--and in a spiritually faith-based situation, the ultimate act of defiance. Suicide is simply slapping God in the face with the exercising of mutated and poisoned "free will". Each person deals and believes in his or her own way, of course, but that is sometimes the final thought that keeps me from giving in to the bullsh*t that leads me down to the actual end of that path. And you know what? Once I come out of it, invariably all I feel is deeply ashamed--ashamed to have put my dear ones through the drama again, ashamed of my own weakness, ashamed of my stupidity and selfishness. You can only apologize for the same thing to loved ones so many times before they just stop hearing you.
If he's really that close to fruition, his wife needs to become very pragmatic. She needs to take every weapon from the house and just get rid of them--yeah, he's going to spit and pop, but he gave up the right to having his anger recognized when he brought them into the home in the first place...and if she's forced to take the next step, he can't have the capability of being armed.
She then needs to talk to him (and sternly!) about getting professional help voluntarily. If he refuses, she needs to examine their insurance for coverage information, then she needs to sign him into a facility for treatment whether he likes it or not, no further discussion. The long-term emotional damage being done to his own children by what they're seeing Daddy do and how he's behaving should be incentive enough to face the dragon that will emerge. (Experience speaking here. My own mother didn't bother with that when my father went through this, she simply packed her stuff when I was 15 and left him--with me. See how well I did after being exposed to it??) Be supportive of his family, but more than facing off with him, help his wife be strong. If she does what she needs to do, she's the one who'll need it.
I pray that something else wakes him up first, though, I really do. What he's feeling sucks beyond description, I know...but what everyone else will be feeling if he doesn't snap out of it will be far, far worse.
Mistress Aura
So he wants to kill himself cause he didn't get to travel the world and sleep with a bunch of women?
That was once my dream....
We all have broken dreams. I realise that each day at work when I go to my shitty excuse for a job.
I doubt the guy will kill himself cause usually those over 20 something years old who are serious will not talk about it. They know people will try to stop them so they do't say anything. maybe this guy is just craving attention? I don't blame you for getting fed up.
That was once my dream....
We all have broken dreams. I realise that each day at work when I go to my shitty excuse for a job.
I doubt the guy will kill himself cause usually those over 20 something years old who are serious will not talk about it. They know people will try to stop them so they do't say anything. maybe this guy is just craving attention? I don't blame you for getting fed up.
*~Game Girl~*
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I was once suicidal myself. and I did cut myself and ended up in hospital. Worse fucking thing I've ever done..
Sometimes people feel the whole world is against them, and they believe death is the only escape. But alot of the times, suicide threats are not a cry for attention. It's merely a cry for help. Do not ignore it. Even if it is attention seeking. You never know. Do NOT take the chance in ignoring it. or that person could really hurt themselves or can even succeed in killing themselves. Best thing to do is get to the bottom of the problem, and sorting out what to do. After I came out of the hospital I was put through therapy and I'm great now. I'm happy, though I am prone to mood swings. (I have bipolar disorder which dosen't help.)
Just talk to your friend. Do NOT let him hurt himself. It does NOT make things better.
Sometimes people feel the whole world is against them, and they believe death is the only escape. But alot of the times, suicide threats are not a cry for attention. It's merely a cry for help. Do not ignore it. Even if it is attention seeking. You never know. Do NOT take the chance in ignoring it. or that person could really hurt themselves or can even succeed in killing themselves. Best thing to do is get to the bottom of the problem, and sorting out what to do. After I came out of the hospital I was put through therapy and I'm great now. I'm happy, though I am prone to mood swings. (I have bipolar disorder which dosen't help.)
Just talk to your friend. Do NOT let him hurt himself. It does NOT make things better.
Well it seems he was enjoying the attention.....
yeah, anyways, the best thing to do is not get involved with people who are an emotional wreck in the first place. I have had friends like that and I just don't deal with it. This guy is burdening his friends and family. Even if he did kill himself, it would be his choice. His friends did whatever they could. What more can one expect?
I can understand the feeling of life wasting away. I think most people look at their life and have a list of woulda shoulda coulda's. People tend to forget that everything carries an opportunity cost. The grass is not greener...
All we can do is live each day best we know how, learn from mistakes, and do better next time.
yeah, anyways, the best thing to do is not get involved with people who are an emotional wreck in the first place. I have had friends like that and I just don't deal with it. This guy is burdening his friends and family. Even if he did kill himself, it would be his choice. His friends did whatever they could. What more can one expect?
I can understand the feeling of life wasting away. I think most people look at their life and have a list of woulda shoulda coulda's. People tend to forget that everything carries an opportunity cost. The grass is not greener...
All we can do is live each day best we know how, learn from mistakes, and do better next time.
