Thought of the week from TC Video

[MrPartickler]

There are only a few things I'm certain of...

1) We'll never know of the existence of a higher being and/or understand his/her/its ways or intentions.

2) Whenever someone is 100% certain they are somehow privy to this divine knowledge and ability to distinguish between good and evil, they're wrong (albeit amusing at times).

3) That was a crap prayer, IMHO. I find it difficult to extract the few gems of truth buried beneath all the generalizations, over-simplifications, and false implications. (Perhaps that's why prayers are best when made silently, huh? lol)

 

[BigJim]

And by the way, Jim, you made an interesting point about religion, death in the name of God and narrow-mindedness. But I wouldn't apply that to everyone with a belief in God. You've referred to me in the past as a relatively wise person (shows how much you know, eh?) and I have a very deep-seated faith. The thing is, I have no need for, or trust in, any organized religion. And that's what I think you were talking about. BIG difference between Faith and Religion. 😎

I wouldn't apply it to everyone either; especially as I count myself as someone with a "faith" of sorts. The difference between my spirituality and most others who'd use the word "religious" to describe themselves, is that I give more credit and power to God than they do. Religious people tend to regard "God" as the chief/king/boss of a pantheon of spiritual beings, inhabiting some other sphere of existence; call it heaven/ nirvana or the seventh dimension, you get what I'm driving at. When I think of "God", it represents the super-consciousness that is the sum total of all consciousness in ALL spheres of existence. Guess why that's the reason the old bastard can have eyes everywhere, eh? I choose not to put a name to either me or my faith, as that would build walls and border it's potential. I just am; I am One, part of the Infinite, a single cell in the body of the Almighty, etc.

I would almost agree with your last sentence if you'd said "BIG difference between spirituality and religion." Maybe that's just because organised religion has monopolised the word "faith" over time. I find spirituality and religion to be diametric opposites; with religion often bordering on psychological fascism. Even when I was a Christian it was like you; no need for it to be organised. My church was my house. I still found it limiting though. It constrained me. It didn't allow me to sail freely on the ocean of Spirit, only paddle in the shallows of one particular beach. Anyway, in thew end it doesn't matter. As I said the day before yesterday on Tickle Theater, I feel sympathy for those people who are devoutly religious and live for their church. If I'm wrong and they're right, I could give 50% of my wages to charity, spend my spare time doing volunteer work for the local pensioners forum and be kind to all sould I meet, I'd still go to hell because I'm not washed in the blood of the Lamb. But if I'm right in my belief, then it doesn't matter what name you give to God, what religious building you pray in, what you call your holy man or even if you HAVE a holy man; you'll go home to "heaven". So either they're wasting their lives depriving themselves needlessly of stigmatised things that they'd enjoy (just ask bloody Scott!), or their God is a picky, fascist bastard.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter to me what faith someone has, or how deep it runs in them. They have the absoloute right to believe whateevr they want to and I have no right whatsoever to insist that they believe what I do. The biggest thing is that differences are something we can celebrate and compare, not bitch over. The way some people act, you'd think diversity was a crime! (And indeed, some people have tried to make it so.) If we can compare the differences in what we believe and then buy each other a pint of Old Mother Arkwright's Feotid Dog Testicle, we're halfway to heaven already.

 

[BigJim]

I'd like to explain why I disagree with two points made here...

1/ To be spiritual you have to suspend logic and push the "just have faith" button.

Since my spiritual alarm clock started to ring (way back in 1999) a lot of things that had previously confused me have since begun to develop a skein of sense and coherence. At the same time though, many new things have appeared on the horizon that I have yet to "explain" to myself. Since that year I've felt the "Force" like it was a living, breathing creature that's walked beside me every day of my life. I would go into specific detail about some of the things I mean, but most people already think I'm nuts enough after reading my conspiracy threads, so I'll refrain from doing so publicly. If anyone wants to know more, please feel free to PM or e-mail me. Suffice it to say that I've seen and felt things working that defy "conventional" science AND religion.

Scientific thinking and spirituality don't mix.

Great leaps and bounds are being made these days by a small-ish but growing number of scientists. Chief amongst these is the discipline of quantum physics and mechanics. Science is coming round to the idea of alternative frequencies (dimensions) of existence, where it would be perfectly possible for being to live who would be intangible to this one. If their frequency crossed ours, we might see a holographic seeming figure or a phantasm. It's also coming to the realisation that time only exists because we believe it to and that outside of our conception of it, the past present and future are happening at the same time. (Hence why you might visit a battlefield and "see" a gost of a soldier stroll past.)

So I believe that "conventional science" is just as narrow minded and dependent on defending shitty dogma ad fundementalist religion is. Progressive movements in both science and spirituality are finding common ground and actually proving the existence of things that would have been laughed at not long ago.

 

[BigJim]

Lawd, I didn't actually comment on the prayer yet! lol

Well to me it sounds like it was written by a conservative, non-progressive, stuck-in-their-ways, old fart. Comment enough? 😉






n.b. Brian, what the hell did you unleash? lol

 

[tickler_n_black]

n.b. Brian, what the hell did you unleash? lol

lol. im not sure. time will tell...

 

[Flatfoot]

lol. im not sure. time will tell...

LOL Isn't it fun to stir things up, sometimes? 😀

 

[venray]

BigJim said

"When I think of "God", it represents the super-consciousness that is the sum total of all consciousness in ALL spheres of existence. Guess why that's the reason the old bastard can have eyes everywhere, eh? I choose not to put a name to either me or my faith, as that would build walls and border it's potential.I just am; I am One, part of the Infinite, a single cell in the body of the Almighty, etc ."


Hell Mate! You and I have got to get together for a one on one dicussion face to face. We are very close to being on the same page line for line. Read the book "God's Debris" by Scot Adams. It will hurt your brain about halfway through, but it's a good way to kill about 90 minutes.


Ray

 

[Flatfoot]

BigJim said

"When I think of "God", it represents the super-consciousness that is the sum total of all consciousness in ALL spheres of existence. Guess why that's the reason the old bastard can have eyes everywhere, eh? I choose not to put a name to either me or my faith, as that would build walls and border it's potential.I just am; I am One, part of the Infinite, a single cell in the body of the Almighty, etc ."


Hell Mate! You and I have got to get together for a one on one dicussion face to face. We are very close to being on the same page line for line. Read the book "God's Debris" by Scot Adams. It will hurt your brain about halfway through, but it's a good way to kill about 90 minutes.


Ray

The same guy who writes the comic strip Dilbert? I gotta check that book out...

 

[venray]

It is indeed by the same guy, but though the book has it's share of humor, it is in reality a whole new prospective on God and religion and life in general. It is a short book but I guarantee it will blow your mind.



Ray

 

[BigJim]

Hell Mate! You and I have got to get together for a one on one dicussion face to face. We are very close to being on the same page line for line. Read the book "God's Debris" by Scot Adams. It will hurt your brain about halfway through, but it's a good way to kill about 90 minutes.

I'll try that one for sure. 🙂 It's comforting to know I'm not the only who thinks this way. 😉

My spirituality gives me a distinct dislike of "superhero syndrome". The idea is that people look around and see everything's shitty and crap is going on every day. Their solution? Wait for the guy in the spangly costume with the super powers to come and make everything right for them. A lot of Christians do exactly that with Jesus Christ. My whole philosophy is that everyone walking the Earth is a potential "Christ". Didn't the Bible say "The Kingdom of heaven is within you"? Instead of being so insular and righteous about their own little corner of the morality playground, it'd be great to see people get off their collective arses and stop waiting for Superman, Batman, Jesus, The Incredible Hulk or the X-Men to sort the world out for them.

It's also my spiritual perspective that makes me laugh in the face of anyone who thinks a particular race is better than the others, or that a particular race is responsible for the world's problems. We're all part of the Infinite One-ness, right? That essentially means there is no we, them, our, they're or those; just one enormous I! It's like someone believeing their arms are racially superior to their legs when you see it from my perspective. All problems in the world are caused by OUR lack of perspective, nowt else. No-one else is responsible for anything in our lives except for us. When you realise that all the shit in your life is manifested by your own focus, you also realise that by switching your mental polarity you can manifest all the good things into your life, and de-manifest all the shit out.

 

[red indian]

JESUS SAVES!!!!!..............

..........but Richer scores on the rebound!!

 

[Deleted member 2452]

i like the idea of killing abortionists.

actually i hate evangelists, and most "christians", but i found i agreed with everything that "prayer" said.
we could use a lot more morality around this rock we call earth.

steve

 

[MrMacphisto]

Ah yes... killing abortionists... very moral... maybe in the eyes of Attila the Hun...

 

[kis123]

Ah yes... killing abortionists... very moral... maybe in the eyes of Attila the Hun...

I believe that most if not all of the people at the TMF would agree that killing abortionists is just as wrong as killing anyone else. I will not open the door on the issue of abortion. I know exactly where I stand on that issue and no amount of dialog will change that. However, killing these people will never be justified, and those that think so need serious help.

Steve, I'm sorry you hate most Christians. There's a lot of them I don't care for either. But hate is a very strong word for me, and I'm not into hating people.

Once again, turning back to the spirit of the original post....

 

[MrMacphisto]

Kis123, since we're on the same wavelength on this one, I thought I'd share a little irony with you...

Many Pro-Lifers like to label abortionists as baby-killers... The other side of the issue is that people like Eric Rudolph could be labeled as doctor-killers...

 

[Deleted member 2452]

i wouldn't kill an abortionist myself

because it's illeagle, and immoral. but there is a bit of poetic justice to it, and the couple times it's happened, i have said good.
my dislike of most christians is based on how i and my family have been treated by them. most christians would do to remember some of their leaders teachings, and to remember he was a jew, and never a "christian" himself! it was good enough for god to have jesus raised as a jew, keep that in mind when you call a jew a kike!

steve

 

[kis123]

Re: i wouldn't kill an abortionist myself

because it's illeagle, and immoral. but there is a bit of poetic justice to it, and the couple times it's happened, i have said good.
my dislike of most christians is based on how i and my family have been treated by them. most christians would do to remember some of their leaders teachings, and to remember he was a jew, and never a "christian" himself! it was good enough for god to have jesus raised as a jew, keep that in mind when you call a jew a kike!

steve

Yes, Jesus was raised as a jew. His purpose was to usher the Gentiles into Christianity. He ate with prostitutes, tax collectors, and other "sinners" and took the abuse in order to fulfill His purpose on the earth.

We have no business calling anyone derogotory names under any circumstances. And I do know how terrible people can be treated at the hands of so-called Christians. I've been one of the mistreated on several occasions. Considering I'm in a race of people who has been called many foul names, I can respect your point of view on this one.

MacPhisto, my opinion on abortion is obvious at this point without mentioning. My opinion on murder should be as obvious. These abortion doctor killers make Christians look bad. A lot of times we have proven that we can make mistakes and mess up without anyone's help. Those that kill and it wasn't self-defense (and I mean self-defense, too) should give their own life in exchange, simply put.

 

[MrMacphisto]

Re: i wouldn't kill an abortionist myself

because it's illeagle, and immoral. but there is a bit of poetic justice to it, and the couple times it's happened, i have said good.
my dislike of most christians is based on how i and my family have been treated by them. most christians would do to remember some of their leaders teachings, and to remember he was a jew, and never a "christian" himself! it was good enough for god to have jesus raised as a jew, keep that in mind when you call a jew a kike!

steve

Poetic justice... I think the person who came up with that phrase probably didn't realize how much it has in common with hypocrisy.

I'm not going to delve into the reasons why people discriminate against Jews, because I'll probably get labeled as an Anti-Semite, but let's just say this: There is just as much self-righteousness on the part of Jews as there is among fundamentalist Christians. The majority of both groups are decent people, but it's unfortunate that a small but significant portion of each group is made up of pricks that give both religions a bad name. It's always the self-righteous types that are the most vocal.

 

[Admiral Trouser]

Primarily because the self-rightious types beleive that there faith in there religeon is unshakable and all-encompassing. Prejudice combined with faith is a bad, bad mix...

 

[BigJim]

Many Pro-Lifers like to label abortionists as baby-killers... The other side of the issue is that people like Eric Rudolph could be labeled as doctor-killers...

True, but that doesn't count because they're "doing the work of God" and the end justifies the means. (According to the insane anyway.)

When I see this desperate need to sink to the same level as the people you disagree with, it makes me want to abort myself.

 

[BigJim]

Re: Re: i wouldn't kill an abortionist myself

Those that kill and it wasn't self-defense (and I mean self-defense, too) should give their own life in exchange, simply put.

I quite often see doublethink on the TMF, and I think this is another example.

For those who havn't read 1984 by George Orwell, doublethink is the practice of holding two totally conflicting ideas in one's mind, whilst believeing both to be true. (For instance: "We seek justice through love", as said by George W. Bush to jusitfy the deaths of more than six thousand Afghani civillians, two thirds of whom weren't within three hundred miles of a Taliban target, during the invasion of Afghanistan.)

The execution of someone who is shackled to the electric chair, tied hand and foot on a gibbett or locked into the gas chamber, couldn't under any circumstances be described as self-defence. Yet many Kis, would use similar sentiments to those you expressed above to justify capital punishment; which in my opinion, is a blatant example of mankind's willingness to let itself sink to the level of that which it most hates. (Perhaps because it is easier to smash the mirror than change what is causing the displeasing reflection?) To steal a line from someone from a similar background to Steve...

"You cannot solve problems with the same level of intelligence that created them." (Albert Einstein.)


Now I don't wish to be pigeon-holed as a liberal, a criminal lover, or limp-gutted; I just wish to cause people to think. Does wanting to cleave to ideologies that espouse freedom only if you believe what the makers of that ideology believed, really serve all the denominations of people in America? (Especially when the people who espoused those ideologies were the biggest hypocrites on the continent.) Does it really allow for evolution? Does it really let us learn anything, except to blindly follow what has always been, just because it has always been?

In a cage, a scientist kept 5 monkeys. He tied a banana to the roof of the cage and let it hang, far out of reach. Underneath the banana he placed a set of steps, then moved back and waited. A monkey tentatively climbed the stairs to reach for the banana and the scientist immediately squirted freezing cold water from a hose all over the other four. Pandemonium ensued with the monkeys howling and shrieking. Every time one of the monekys tried to climb the stairs to reach the banana, the others got a freezing blast from the hose. Soon a monkey only had to place a foot on the bottom step and the other four monekys in the cage would attack him brutally, to stop him climbing. The scientist removed one monkey from the cage and replaced it with a different one. Not knowing anything about freezing water or beatings, he tried to climb for the banana and was attacked by his screaming cage-mates. Bleeding and scratched, he retired to a corner and sat. A couple of hours later he tried again. Once again the other four monkeys attacked him mercilessly, throwing him off the steps. Every week the scientist replaced one of the monkeys with a new one who hadn't been there before. Every time the new arrival tried to climb for the banana and was set upon by the others. After five weeks none of the monkeys in the cage were from the original five. All had arrived since the beginning and none of them had been squirted by the freezing water.

The scientist left his job to go elsewhere and the monekys became redundant; left where they were until someone could arrange for the local zoo to take them in. The experiments being carried out on them ceased permanently. A sixth monkey arrived unexpectedly at the laboratory. At a loss as to what to do, the other scientists put him in the cage with the other five. Seeing that tempting banana hanging overhead he went to climb the stairs and the other five tore him down, biting, scratching and howling. Nursing his wounds tenderly he retired to a corner.

"What did you do that for?" he asked the nearest monkey. The monkey looked blank and replied that everyone did it. He repeated his question to each monkey in turn, and received shrugs all round.
"Don't know why. It's the way we've always done it."

Anyway, we moved slightly away from the idea of the prayer's values, and onto capital punishment. If you want to see another discussion about that topic Kis, then try this link...

Death penalty thread, enter at your own risk! 😀

 

[BigJim]

Re: Re: i wouldn't kill an abortionist myself

I'm not going to delve into the reasons why people discriminate against Jews, because I'll probably get labeled as an Anti-Semite

People discriminate anyone because they lack the imagination and the intelligence to see beyond the superficial. (No Mac, I'm not directing that to you. I'm thinking of anyone who is something-ist.)

But it has to be said that there are a cold-hearted group of people who exploit terms like "anti-semitic" for their own ends. Especially in America, to be stigmatised as anti-semitic is a career ending blow that destroys your life. Because of this many American politicians are shit-scared of speaking against some of the atrocities committed by Israel. If they do, there's every likliehood that some tit from the robotic-righteousness camp (or the Anti-Defamation League, as one of it's divisions is known) will brand them publicly with the moniker from which there is no defence. Whether it's true or not, get called anti-semitic in public and your career in public service is more fucked than Pamela Anderson's chest.
Similarly if you call a communist bastard like Robert Mugabwe a thieving, conniving little turd; then the robotic radicals will label you a capitalist empire-monger, and probably a racist as well. The sad fact is that the fear of these stigmas is played big time by people with absoloutely not morals or human decency in their bodies.

 

[MrMacphisto]

BigJim.... welcome back... heh

As far as that whole evolution spill goes, there are some of us who kind of gave up on it a while back. At this point, I simply play the Devil's Advocate on most things. It gets people thinking, but more often than not, they just try to fortify what they already believe rather than actually attempt to change their views according to facts. Because of this unfortunate tendency in humans, I find it much easier to simply get amusement out of the fervor that people have for whatever agenda they adhere to. History shows that, time after time, people "blindly follow what has always been, just because it has always been." I believe that is the definition of tradition. Religion can be similarly categorized when referring to most people. There are a few out there that actually think their way through faith and can actually expound on what they believe without spouting mindless dogma, but not enough people are truly "intellectual."

So BigJim, I'm not stooping to anyone's level, for I see myself as an equal to most people here. I just prefer to be the scientist outside of the cage, as opposed to one of the monkeys. *Machiavellian wink* 😉

 

[MrMacphisto]

oh yeah... and I totally agree with the Anti-Semitism thing and how labels have too much weight in this country...

 

[BigJim]

oh yeah... and I totally agree with the Anti-Semitism thing and how labels have too much weight in this country...

I'm glad to hear it mate. The "anti-semitic" one is probably the most exploited. Problem is, the greatest psychopathic git in recent history had anti-semitiscism as his calling-card, so some people make out you're heartless if you say that all predjudices are equally bad.