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Shaming TMF Members who Upload Copyrighted Clips in Public Forums

I think a lot of pirates, many of which are in different countries, have socialist mentalities

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May they walk the plank to a world with only(legal) Cal-Star vids

I am glad the U.S./Canada border is so well guarded.....Maybe we better send some of them TSA dudes with cold and dirty hands as reinforcement, just in case....😉 I have had renters cheat me out of payment on my one house slumlord empire before. They act like no one really lost anything, since it was only "rent". But you can't turn off their water, gas or electric or they would find money for an attorney in a heartbeat. $100 million settlements and one way tickets to death row are impressive, but the lawyers that scare me most are any 5 like minded-ones on the "divine-nine" Supreme court. 'Specially if they are legislating from da bench!!!
 
The only thing this thread has done is shown me which producers I'm no longer going to support. You're just scaring away customers. Piracy doesn't harm business as much as you make it out to, and there's nothing you can do to make it ever go away. That's like trying to get rid of prostitution or drug use, it's never gonna happen. You just do the best you can and be glad you live in a region where you can even make any money off people jacking-off. Besides, your material isn't that good, and that's why people don't buy it. This goes for every one of you producers whining about how much piracy hurts your profits.
 
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The only thing this thread has done is shown me which producers I'm no longer going to support. You're just scaring away customers. Piracy doesn't harm business as much as you make it out to, and there's nothing you can do to make it ever go away. That's like trying to get rid of prostitution or drug use, it's never gonna happen. You just do the best you can and be glad you live in a region where you can even make any money off people jacking-off. Besides, your material isn't that good, and that's why people don't buy it. This goes for every one of you producers whining about how much piracy hurts your profits.

Wow... Oh, this commentary will go over well.....:facepalm:

Did you really just give that opinion? Dude, there is a reason why producers get upset when their stuff is pirated. They are not on the same scale as music producers so they spend a ton of cash to produce clips for us to enjoy. If someone is giving away their stuff for free, that hurts their profits. That's hurts their ability to recoup the cost of their work.

For example, if YOU made something that costs you a thousand dollars to produce plus YOUR TIME AND ENERGY, and you sell it to recoup your loss and make some profit (which is the reason why you made it in the first place), you would simply shrug it away if someone is giving it away to people for free and you MAKE NOTHING? Stop bullshitting man. You would be pissed off beyond belief. So why are you even crying about the producers being pissed off?
 
Here's what I never understood. WHY pirate materials and show them to everyone for FREE? What benefit do these pirates get for buying a clip and sharing it with everyone? I can understand the freeloaders loving it, but the pirate? He gets nothing for it.

Actually, he does. He gets free shit.

No matter how many different ways pirates try to dress up what they do in crazy theories about how "information wants to be free" or any other self-justification, the fact is, people like free shit. That's all it is. For some, there's also the ego boost in being the one to have stolen it in the first place.

Software piracy in countries like China and Russia (or whatever the kids are calling it these days) is usually far more organized that someone just putting free shit up on a server. It's done for profit - when I was in China, it was damn near impossible to find stores selling actual, legitimate music CDs - every single one of them was dealing in bootlegs. There's also the issue of reverse-engineering; I don't know if it's still that way, but originally, the vast majority of Russian software education came from tearing apart pirated American software. And the first thing they had to figure out how to break... was the encryption.

Pirated media is the kind of thing organized crime thrives on - it's low risk and provides tons of funding for seedier operations. And no, I'm not exaggerating.

Sure, you can't estimate how much money developers lose to piracy, and not everyone who pirates a video or a game would have bought it... but I do know that World of Goo, a brilliant little indie title, was pirated by 92% of the people who played it. Now, imagine if the developers actually saw money from even half of those clowns...

(I just realized that my opening remark was assuming the pirate got the videos for free, originally. Which... is not what prime said at all. It's the meds, I swear.)

Okay, well, pirates who share stuff they bought probably do it to get access to stuff they didn't buy. Like, if I bought Yaqi's entire catalog, I could then trade it for, say, Tickle Abuse's entire catalog. Like was mentioned before, a lot of these piratey-types just like to swap media. A lot of them don't even watch it... they simply have too much of it to ever actually use.
 
Here's what I never understood. WHY pirate materials and show them to everyone for FREE? What benefit do these pirates get for buying a clip and sharing it with everyone? I can understand the freeloaders loving it, but the pirate? He gets nothing for it.


I'd imagine that they obtain the material for free and then host it somewhere along with advertising that pays them...
 
.... after re-reading my comment, I think I was a little too harsh. You guys have every right to protect your material from theft. And though my views of piracy in large part remain unchanged, I admit that in a small-knit community such as this, you guys really feel the loss much greater than say, Metallica and James Cameron do......
 
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that's wack, yo

what's the website URL so I can check and see if my clips are on there?
 
I'd imagine that they obtain the material for free and then host it somewhere along with advertising that pays them...

exactly, people that upload on megaupload, hotfile, fileserve, etc. get paid per download (filesonic pays 30$ every 1,000 downloads, megaupload 100$ every 100,000 downloads, hotfile 0.01$ every download).

file hosts who don't pay, die (look at rapidshare).


The only thing this thread has done is shown me which producers I'm no longer going to support. You're just scaring away customers.

Yeah, and I didn't know clips4sale was so unsafe for privacy



All too often, when you talk about piracy, the person being pirated just sees red. All they see is their content that they worked hard to produce, available for free. And I get that. I get that anger. Makes sense. But stop and think about the possible positive effects.

Hypothetical: you've got a guy posting Yaqi clips online. Do you suppose that this is person went to Yaqi's clip store, thought "I'm gonna buy this clip, solely to give it away to others for free! MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA" *twirls mustache evily*. Or do you suppose maybe this person is a member of our fetish community, who's bought a more than just one clip from Yaqi, who's bought clips from other producers? Now he posts the clip, and 30 people download it. A few of these people have never heard of Yaqi, and get into the studio, and buy a clip or two.

That's what usually happens to me, but I buy only monthly subscriptions (or yearly subscriptions, talking about general porn), this can't work for clips. In the internet I think it's easier to sell a service (a subscription) than a product (a clip): the perceived value of a digital clip for most of the people is zero, but you can't tell the same about the value of a monthly subscription. Looking for pirated files is very time-consuming and the links die quickly, in fact many people BUY 60$ yearly subscriptions to file-hosting services to download quickier.

I'm afraid that the clip-selling business model has no future.


One last thing: did you ever consider that maybe many people that buy your clips can afford them because they don't pay for music & movies and have more money to spend?
 
You're just scaring away customers. Piracy doesn't harm business as much as you make it out to, and there's nothing you can do to make it ever go away. That's like trying to get rid of prostitution or drug use, it's never gonna happen.

Actually, all of those things can disappear, but lawyers and fines won't do it. If the mentality of the pirate/drug addict/John changes, then piracy/drug-use/prostitution won't exist. I could pirate games, but I never have out of respect for the industry; if people respect the tickling/porn industry, then they won't pirate or upload clips.

Also, is the Canadian the only person you have in mind, Yaqi? You made it sound like you had a full list of offenders before.
 
Chrisums,
You must be a liberal, it would take one to hold your position on this subject. First of all I am a member of Missy's site, and I will also forward that I knew her before she started her site. Missy is a kind person and a smart business woman, I have never seen anything other than professionalism from her and in all aspects of her site.

Missy is very simply stated is a live and let live person. If you don't try to intentionally hurt her, Missy would only offer her help in just about any situation.

She has the right to protect her investments, and if she would fight dirty, so be it. If the person never stole from her in the first place, there would be absolutely reaction.

As far as I see, If one doesn't want to go to jail don't rob a bank. If the in this case, thief doesn't want to have his info to be put forth, then all he has to do is steal from someone else.

When Missy first started her site, she allowed DLs, but soon after opening it her videos were showing up on other sites. She told me that she was going to take that feature away from members. I advised against it, letting her know there would be potential customers she would loose do to her policy. She told me that the money lost would be a small consequence to keep her sanity

I am sure Missy lost customers to this policy, but she insulated herself, as much as she is able to. She did this just so she doesn't run into this problem.

What you fail to see, is the person stealing from Yagi was not forced into it, and lets say he was outed, it doesn't get Yagi's money back, but it may prevent the next potential thief from stealing.

Lastly, the talk of "potentially dangerous" talk is completely farcical, and the potential law suit against Missy would most likely ever happen, and if it did, Missy would counter sue.

Please start looking at this situation as if someone stole from you, and you really have no other recourse, because with pirating you really don't. If you could prevent the theft by outing the thief, maybe you wouldn't the first time but, after a while you would. If not then you really are a liberal.
 
Lastly, the talk of "potentially dangerous" talk is completely farcical, and the potential law suit against Missy would most likely ever happen, and if it did, Missy would counter sue.

Counter sue against WHAT? That someone sued for a privacy violation?

Please start looking at this situation as if someone stole from you, and you really have no other recourse, because with pirating you really don't

Let's say the guy with the corner store has kids under 14 years of age stealing from him. He can't do anything about it, because they can only be prosecuted when they turn 14. Does that give him the right to go out and shoot them because he has no other recourse? Doubt it!
 
Also, is the Canadian the only person you have in mind, Yaqi? You made it sound like you had a full list of offenders before.

There is a long list of offenders, but I've decided to single this rat motherfucker out and make an example of him because I have 100% proof of his guilt and he has refused to return my requests to open a dialog with me and remove my material.

I don't care how much money this will cost me but I will pursue my case against him, using every legal tool at my disposal and hopefully I will achieve satisfaction in court.
 
Perhaps it's time for a lesson in capitalism.

It kind of is a conservative versus liberal things.

Many liberals worship the concept of "entitlement." They DESERVE free clips!
It's their RIGHT! Free housing, free health care, ...other things will follow.

It goes from a "want" to a "right."
If you want "affordable" whatever, and you wish to enact change that brings that about, have at that, that's what the health care industry needs.


It's pretty obvious that none of this is taught in high school anymore, much less colleges, because I've met so many people who have no clue what capitalism is or how it works. The conservatives have to go about re-educating the public on all the basics of American life in our self-centered, me-generation, entitlement world of today.

In a order for a person to "produce"......something, a product, a service, whatever, they must receive fair compensation. If they are selling a product, they must offer it for a reasonable price, based on their work, combined with what they spend creating it.

People will pay 10 cents for an okay cookie, they'll pay a dollar or two for a damn good, big cookie.....but there's no way you can sell even a big, damn good cookie.....for $67. NO one will buy it, even the rich people. Rich and poor will simply declare it "over priced."

That's why when I hear stupid news stories about gas going to $10 a gallon, or more, I want to send a few books on capitalism to the news writers.
Gas stopped at $4 a gallon a few years back, because that's when people began cutting back. $5 would probably be the maximum, the absolute cap.

At $10 a gallon, I'm walking to the grocery store.

Over that, I'm quiting my job. Almost everyone I've worked with for the past 10 years have lived 20 minutes to an hour away from work.
It wouldn't be worth it to drive to work at that point, we'd all eventually make negative dollars on our check, our entire salary going to pay for gas to go to work to pay for gas. (Not counting how much the merchandise would skyrocket because of delivery costs passed on to the stores, and then to the customers....)
So it'd be cheaper to stay home. The economy would quickly shut down to about a 2nd world country, and the oil barrons would lose money. If they charged $45 for a gallon of gas, and no one bought any, they'd be making $0, and would HAVE to drop the price, or go out of business.

The margin of profit for many businesses is usually 40% for a damn good business, and probably 10% or less for most others. My workplace makes well under 20% profit.

The major record companies and movie studios lost a good bit of money from pirates. But they can still stay afloat, because so many people still go see their movies and buy CD's or downloadable mp3's. They were able to survive, but DID lose money.

A tickling producer like Tommy, Guiltrip, Tickle Haven, Yaqi...that a WHOLE 'nother story.

A tickling video producer has a very low margin of profit, as all have told me.

Let's look at one of the cheapest videos you can make.
You have all the equipment already.

You need at least $100 to $150 for a cheap hotel room, and $100 or more for a tickle model. Double that if you want a f/f scene.

Clips4sale takes 60% of the profit, I believe, or 40%...about half, basically....

So the standard "few years in" clip costs at least $200, if you luck out.

You have to make $400 profit to break even, and more if you want enough money to hire another model, and hotel room, and PRODUCE another video.

If a pirate comes along, buys ONE $10 to $15 clip, you WILL MAKE $15 from that sale. But if he or she gives it away to all your other customers, and you only make maybe $30 or $40 when that clip has run it's course...... YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO MAKE any more videos!

The girls may be nice as hell, may rub your back after your done tickling her....but at some point, she wants to be paid! She'll ask "Why am I doing all this for free?" Even if it's your best friend, she'll eventually find something else to do if there's no INCENTIVE for her to continue.

The producer would quit first, however. Everytime he or she makes a clip, they lose about $100.
Unless they were independantly wealthy....WAIT, HOW DOES SOMEONE GET WEALTHY?!! By offering some service or product for sale. So if they were rich to begin with, by some other means, nothing about them will cause them to want to produce clips for, what they rightly believe to be a bunch of selfish slackers who are producing nothing and taking their work....and then probably CRITICISING it after they got it for free!

So the more pirating runs rampant, the quicker companies will call it quits.
So there will be nothing to pirate. And no, some smart guy can't come in and have a monopoly, because his stuff will be stolen also, so we'll end up with zero companies filming tickle clips.
Unless it was some guy doing it for his own pleasure, and he's not giving it to a bunch of ingrates for free. He doesn't need any attention, he's got a video of a hot girl being tickled to keep him company!

The people who do this think along a pure emotional level - "the producers are all rich, we deserve free stuff, why should they make all the money," ...and most importantly, "New clips will always be made."

No, they won't.

So there is probably nothing the producers can really do to stop it, but the market will dictate that the whole industry will shut down from lack of profits and incentives.
 
yaqi, your last post proves to me that you should go after the guy legally.

Not only did he take your copyrighted material and use it without your consent,.. but.. the guy is so arrogant.. that he ignored it when you gave him the opportunity to rectify what he did. To me, that is brazen. No wonder why you want to get him.

I've told a few friends who are non forum members about this thread, and all of them think you should go after the guy. Stealing material that a person has a copyright or trademark on, is not only a crime, but also immoral.

I hope you are able to achieve satisfaction in your case.

Mitch
 
Yaqi, Unfortunately the only one that will win in this situation is your lawyer. I hope you do well, but from prior experience, I think the reward will not out weigh the costs. I am sorry you have to deal with this and hope you win.


There's a lot to be said for personal satisfaction. When someone is blatantly thumbing their nose in your face like this, thinking that you can't or won't do anything about it, there's something absolutely priceless about proving them utterly wrong.

There's also the deterrent factor. If Yaqi prevails in a court of law and manages to win a significant settlement against this guy, then I would advise him to broadcast the results far and wide. The words "don't fuck with me" are FAR more likely to be heeded once you've made an example out of someone. Put his head on a spike as a warning to others.
 
I don't post much, in fact not at all, however I'd like to chime in on this.

Although piracy is a huge problem and I fully support your reasoning behind wanting to stop it, there are proper ways to go about doing so. I didn't read through the whole thread, just the 1st and 2nd page where there was talk of yaqi releasing information he obtained through transactions.

Highly illegal. The only way that information would be able to legally be made public would be through a court subpoena where that information would be provided to law enforcement tasked with pursuing the person or persons you believe to have violated copyright laws.

If you are avid about pursuing these people with criminal charges (I believe they must be found guilty criminally of copyright infringement before you can win a civil settlement), you'd have to start at the local level and contact your local police department and travel your way through the channels until you get to the correct agency responsible for copyright infringement (I believe it's a division of the FBI).

Once again, you do what you need to do, but just do it the proper way so you yourself don't get into any trouble. I purchase a lot of clips from clips4sale and appreciate everything the producers do. I would hate to see any one of them get screwed because they acted out through emotion rather than logic.
 
Yaqi, Unfortunately the only one that will win in this situation is your lawyer. I hope you do well, but from prior experience, I think the reward will not out weigh the costs. I am sorry you have to deal with this and hope you win.

This is certainly true, and one of the things I find most sickening about modern society (ok, so this shit started with the ancient Greeks, but we now do it to the extreme). Personally, I think lawyers are responspible for a lot of the 'problems' we face with our current state of civilisation - and if not responsible, then the 'lawyer mentality' is - and if not that, then they're really not fucking helping matters.
However...
There's also the deterrent factor. If Yaqi prevails in a court of law and manages to win a significant settlement against this guy, then I would advise him to broadcast the results far and wide. The words "don't fuck with me" are FAR more likely to be heeded once you've made an example out of someone. Put his head on a spike as a warning to others.

It really does seem an appropriate course of action in this case, summed up perfectly by asutickler there.
I hope you win the case. I also hope your lawyer doesn't fill his own pockets with the result - but I guess that's too much to wish for.

So, who hasn't committed the piracy sin at some point in their life? I have, and I bet you all have too, even the producers! Have you honestly never ever downloaded a single music track? Recorded chart singles from the radio? Saved a YouTube clip? Even, going back to the long forgotten past here, ever copied a VHS casette? Of course you have, who are you trying to kid?
In a court of law downloading copies the latest James Cameron flick is going to be labelled as exactly the same crime as downloading a tickling clp - when dealing with absolutes, of course it is. A bit of thought and common sense for the circumstances is needed here. Most, even if not all, of these producers are making clips for a niche market for a niche fetish - they're not 'evil capitalists' milking us for all our hard-earned cash (maybe James Cameron isn't either, although he is clearly much more lucrative than Yaqi or any of his comtemporaries).
Some of these producers were simply a part of the community back in the earlier days. Now they have to present themselves from a much more professional point of view simply because they produce. Their basic love of tickling has now gone from being something they can carelessly post on this board about, to being something they need to watch every word they say - lest our 'lawyer mentality' prompt us to label them as devils. Let's remember they're not getting rich, and they're not devils. I'm sure it must piss on some of their fireworks having to watch everything they say on this board.
I can remember the scene a decade ago. Personally I'm over the moon to see how much it's now developed, and how many more producers there are. I recently ordered some custom clips just to see the things I really wanted to see and, the more producers there are the more likely those things would be to just happen anyway (law of averages) - rather than especially requesting them. Like it or not, it is definitely within all our best interests to support these producers. 10 years ago the only people doing it were those who just did it because they loved it - and our choices were pathetically limited! Now, the incentive of extra income has prompted so many more, with much more diversity. Denying this extra income will fuck us up just as much as it will the producers.
Let's not get 'all lawyer' about it, ignore the principle of piracy if that helps you see this more clearly. From the point of view of everyone on this board, we REALLY should be encouraging our niche fetish producers. I don't believe the tickle fetish is all that common and we should be watching each other's backs here, otherwise it just may get driven straight back into the underground like it used to be. Regardless of your own personal stance on the piracy issue, just forget it and look at what is actually the case with our own (relatively small) community. This is much closer to home than whether you choose to download Avatar or not.
So go ahead, download Avatar, I couldn't give a toss about that. Please, call me immoral for saying that, call me a "very naughty boy" - it ain't just tickling that gets me off 😉
However you feel about this whole issue, just remember we're small and pirating tickling clips really is shitting in our own beds! From a common sense point of view this doesn't even compare to creaming a little off the top of James Cameron's income - this is truly the difference between whether tickling clips are even produced or not.
 
Doesn't the fact that he's outside of the U.S. complicate matters somewhat? I know that countries like Russia and China upload American music, movies, comics, etc and seem to be untouchable from a legal standpoint.

Canadian authorities are probably more willing to help than police in some other countries, but I'm not sure how much of an effort they'd make over tickling clips. I know of telephone harassment cases where men caused major damage to several US hotels by reporting false emergencies, but because they were located in Canada nothing could be done about it.

I still hope you're successful, but given how most of these cases turn out I can see why this guy is confident enough to taunt you.
 
I hope you gain satisfaction through your legal preceding, but don't make the mistake of thinking this will stop or impede piracy in any way. It's like stamping out one ant and expecting the other ants to flee in horror. You're better off going after the ant hill (the actual site). But if it's just for your own piece of mind, then proceed. Though it will likely only benefit your lawyer, and I suppose help you sleep at night.
 
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