so why is there a difference between how we view f/f and m/m clips?

[isabeau]

This may be dodging the question, but I think it's fair to say that most of the tickling depicted here is sexual in nature. There may be some exceptions, but that's a legit assumption to make. So assuming, or thinking about a sexual relationship of some sort between 'ler and 'lee isn't a stretch.

Of course that begs the question of why people are more comfortable with (male) gay sex than with lesbian sex...

that makes sense..

 

[PainTrain]

Of course that begs the question of why people are more comfortable with (male) gay sex than with lesbian sex...

Are you serious? Hell, in todays society, lesbianism is considered "hot" by the average straight guy. At least, the ones I know, hehe.

 

[drew70]

I wonder how casual that expression of disinterest is, Drew. It certainly wasn't apropos of the thread, was it? Suppose every time someone posted a clip, everybody who wasn't interested in it posted to say so? I'd get mighty tired of seeing that, I can tell you. While that particular thread did turn into an absurd pissing match, I think the point is that there's really no need to post in a clip thread the fact that you don't like that style of tickling. It would be like taking the time to open a non-tk foot pic only to post that you don't like feet. Why bother?

Lynn, come on. The thread was titled hot M/M action. The guys simply stated that they personally didn't view any M/M action as hot. How is this any different than somebody saying I personally don't dig tickling with feathers. But oh, we have to be soooo careful of "disrespecting various preferences" that we jump all over the most innocent and nonconfrontational opinions to the contrary.

As for being tired of seeing any particular opinion expressed, I'll bet everybody on this forum could point out opinions and posts they are tired of. For example, I have no interest in feet whatsoever. Imagine how tired I am of seeing post after post regarding feet? If I were a mod, would I be right in using that position to discourage people from expressing interest in feet, merely because I'm tired of seeing posts about it?

You're right that there was no need for the guys to post their disinterest. But when do we ever really post out of need? Don't we post most of the time simply to express our opinions? That's what's on trial here. The mods in question will say their objection was based on a breach of protocol, when in fact it's based on opinions they find personally unpalatable.

My understanding of the Golden Rule is that it's okay to express disagreement, as long as it's done in a way that doesn't cast disparagement on the other members. I understand the need to keep order and civility, but Christ Almighty, allow at least SOME room for people to have an opinion.

To bring this around to the topic, I'm attempting here to explain why I think M/M is not taboo at all, except to express any disinterest in it. Given current events, I maintain that M/M is currently the most protected gender preference to embrace.

 

[PainTrain]

Given current events, I maintain that M/M is currently the most protected gender preference to embrace.

I think if that were the case, you would see more of it. 90 percent of everything on this forum is either m/f - f/f - */f ect...

Now, I have a feeling that if we had people posting in those threads, saying things like "f/f is gross" or "is it possible for f/f to be hot?" ... I don't think, I KNOW the mods would act in the same manner as they did in the m/m thread. As I said though, that kind of thing never happens in the f/f threads.

 

[lk70]

Lynn, come on.

Oh, ok! Sorry - I should have seen it that way to begin with 😛

But oh, we have to be soooo careful of "disrespecting various preferences" that we jump all over the most innocent and nonconfrontational opinions to the contrary.

I think the point is to try to make everyone feel welcome here. If someone's preferences are consistently attacked, they won't. That's not right.

For example, I have no interest in feet whatsoever. Imagine how tired I am of seeing post after post regarding feet?

AH! But how much time do you spend posting that you don't like feet? Very little as far as I can tell. And I suspect it's because you don't feel threatened by foot action.

You're right that there was no need for the guys to post their disinterest. But when do we ever really post out of need? Don't we post most of the time simply to express our opinions? That's what's on trial here. The mods in question will say their objection was based on a breach of protocol, when in fact it's based on opinions they find personally unpalatable.

You might be partially right, but still - it was a clip thread, not a discussion thread. This particular topic might get more protection than some, but I think that's because it's more violently attacked than others.

My understanding of the Golden Rule is that it's okay to express disagreement, as long as it's done in a way that doesn't cast disparagement on the other members. I understand the need to keep order and civility, but Christ Almighty, allow at least SOME room for people to have an opinion.

To bring this around to the topic, I'm attempting here to explain why I think M/M is not taboo at all, except to express any disinterest in it. Given current events, I maintain that M/M is currently the most protected gender preference to embrace.

Drew, come on. 🙄 You know that when people post against M/M, no matter how benignly it starts, it always gets a lot uglier that an expression of disinterest.

 

[RobAce]

You know, I keep quiet about of lot of things...
practicing my "Common Sense" approach, if you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.
Ive spoken up once on a subject, I almost regretted, but I got over it and it ended up pretty good.
Ill be honest..there are probally a lot of people out there like me, we like F/F tickling because it has been ingrained in our brains that 2 women can hug and kiss and such not be homosexual...but 2 men can not. Men dont "play" with each other like women do. Is it wrong...probally, but thats our messed up culture. Is it homophobic....whatever, I dont care. I can watch 2 women tickling each other and become aroused....if I see 2 men tickling each other, my penis backs away screaming and wont come out for an hour, even if I cover up orafices and yell snake.
Its a learned behavior and its going to take a lot more than a few MODS, clips and "interment camps for the m/m impared" to change it.
Everyone can check, I have never posted or viewed a m/m clip, nor will I. I have never posted in a thread about m/m clips...nor will I. I mean as long as it labeled whats the sense on clicking on it. Do I get sick of it, hell yeah. But its my opinion and in this wide forum my opinion ammounts to jack squat so I look for what I like and only that. Does that make me wrong....just because I wont look at something, no. Not in my eyes.
People need to get off their collective high-horses and leave well enough alone. Post all the m/m you want....enjoy it.
If someone posts negatively about it, ignore them. All they are doing is posting an opinion...and like the saying goes, opinions are like a**holes, everyone has one and they usually stink.
Lastly...my opinion.....it seems as of late certain types of "bashing" is a lot more tolerated than other forms of "bashing". To me it shows a bias...either this forum is flame-free or its not flame-free. It shouldnt be speaking against one thing is "a protected opinion and good for them" while another is "in bad taste and needs to be banned"
I plan on putting togeather a number of examples and PMing the appropiate person that can clear up this issue for me, its getting a little out of hand to me. Things need to be even-handed or hands off.

Rob

 

[tickledgirl]

Are you serious? Hell, in todays society, lesbianism is considered "hot" by the average straight guy. At least, the ones I know, hehe.

Whoops, my bad! I got that backwards. I'm gonna edit it to correct it.

 

[drew70]

um Drew where have you been??? there are two threads in here specifically about m/m clips...and there was much fighting in that thread you are talking about...i stand by what i posted.. it seems taboo to me..although of course i don't agree with it..one thread in the tickling discussion is do you like m/m clips..the other is for those who don't like m/m and to state their opinions as to why not.

There are more than two current threads regarding M/M and I've been watching them with interest and amusement. The thread in the clips sections should have died a quick death but when you attempt to police people's opinions, others tend to get drawn in.

I may be wrong, but I suspect what you meant to ask is why f/f is so much more popular and widely received than m/m. If that's the case, I'd say it's because the majority of members (particularly those who cruise the clips section) are males and they prefer seeing women to other men. I honestly don't believe it's any more complicated than that.

 

[isabeau]

There are more than two current threads regarding M/M and I've been watching them with interest and amusement. The thread in the clips sections should have died a quick death but when you attempt to police people's opinions, others tend to get drawn in.

I may be wrong, but I suspect what you meant to ask is why f/f is so much more popular and widely received than m/m. If that's the case, I'd say it's because the majority of members (particularly those who cruise the clips section) are males and they prefer seeing women to other men. I honestly don't believe it's any more complicated than that.

um didn't i ask that?? i thought i did..did i get that backwards?? sighs..i would...

Robace very well said...

 

[Deadsea7777]

i'm taking Bella's suggestion and starting a new thread regarding this issue..i know she meant for Tamia to, sorry Tamia..but i'm extremely curious as to why f/f is ok, but m/m seems to be taboo? it doesn't seem fair to me..and as Tamia said..seems a double standard issue as well...like why does it always have to be that males who enjoy being tickled by other males must be gay? and don't get me wrong..i have absolutely nothing against gay people at all..but why that standard? why when we see females tickling other females that issue doesn't seem to come up?

Dear Izzy:

I cannot give you a general answer but I can give you my opinion.
M/M tickling is not taboo, a taboo is a strong prohibition based on social premises. There are clips in the TMF, and in the Tickle theatre. And there are shops in Clips4sale. So is not taboo.
The second point is that in the TMF environment tickling is sexually charged, adult material, which means related to sex. So is not surprising that most male do not care about M/M, because most males are not gay. I do not even bothers to look at the clips M/M. I am not interested.
F/F is different they are females. If they are lesbians who cares?, every man thinks in secret that he could given the right conditions get both to get fascinated by him, probably an illusion but nevertheless a very popular one.
Is not a double standard issue, for that the same thing or fact should be judged by two different standards. I am not interested in sex between men, and so I do not care about M/M clips. That’s all, no judgment involved. The laugh of a female is a musical beautiful sound; the one of a male for me is noise background.
So for the females maybe M/M is great, so be it.
And in the TMF tickling is related most of the time to sex. Look at your own incredible stories, and in fact look at most of the stories. Sex and tickling are very often in the same cocktail.
However I will not really bothers to read one story by you or anybody about M/M is not my cup of tea. Only as a courtesy towards you will read yours if you write one. And the reason is obvious if we accept that in the TMF most tickling is somehow related as sex or foreplay, well I am not interested in M/M sex or foreplay. And I will not have any problem with females not interested in F/F sex or tickling foreplay. Or lesbians not interested in M/F sex or tickling foreplay.
But that is not a double standard, neither a matter of fair or unfair. Is simple a matter of taste: sherry or champagne or a cocktail and to each its own. To like something or not to like something is a matter of preference, not judgment and therefore not a subject of double standard.
The view of a female cleavage a Darwin pointed out gives the man an incredible sensation of wellbeing. On the same line the view of a male chest does not give me anything. But again is not a double standard, simply I do not give a dam about contemplating a male chest.
However I will give one year of my life to contemplate yours just one time, and for bury my face in your cleavage I will give a decade.

 

[LindyHopper]

Given current events, I maintain that M/M is currently the most protected gender preference to embrace.

This is simply because we only need to jump in to protect those who require protection. In this culture, we don't need to protect heterosexuality. On this forum, we don't need to protect foot fetishists or F/F lovers. No one, to the best of my knowledge, gets regularly flamed or criticized for liking feet or F/F. People do, on the other hand, get flamed for enjoying M/M, or for being openly gay. And so the mods step in.

So, I'm wondering why you feel that M/M is taboo? Around here, disliking M/M is way more taboo than acceptance of it.

Not at all. Plenty of people don't care for M/M, and I haven't seen anyone posting here have a problem with that. They only get upset when those who dislike M/M insult others for enjoying it. You can have a right to your own opinion, and still show others the same courtesy, without denigrating something important to them.

 

[isabeau]

ok the use of taboo was probably a bad choice on my part..i didn't realize the extent of the description regarding that word..

Deadsea thank you for that post..well thought out and made much sense to me...and i can understand that i suppose...for many it's true, tickling is sexual, and that includes my stories..but for others, tickling is a playful way to have fun, meaning no sex at all...

 

[AffectionateDan]

Very well said, Lindy!

 

[kyle]

Wow, these M/M threads are starting to rub me the wrong way. I don't see why some people can't understand that males are not as intimiate with each other as females are. Do you girls just not get this? When a straight male views two males tickling each other (specially in bondage) it is unsettling.

Guys who are good friends or brothers or whatever will wrestle around and be playfull and that's fine. However, when it comes to something i'm watching so i can freaking WHACK OFF, i don't want to look at it. Catch my drift?

I bet less than one tenth of one percent of members on this forum have "bashed" m/m content. Most people just find what they want and not bother with the rest.

 

[PainTrain]

Guys who are good friends or brothers or whatever will wrestle around and be playfull and that's fine. However, when it comes to something i'm watching so i can freaking WHACK OFF, i don't want to look at it. Catch my drift?

I bet less than one tenth of one percent of members on this forum have "bashed" m/m content. Most people just find what they want and not bother with the rest.

As for your little whack off comment, nobody forces you to look at, or open m/m threads, catch that drift?

Less than ten percent? Probably so. However, when the people continually harrass just to do it, it gets old.

 

[isabeau]

As for your little whack off comment, nobody forces you to look at, or open m/m threads, catch that drift?

Less than ten percent? Probably so. However, when the people continually harrass just to do it, it gets old.

well said Gremio...no one forces anyone to open threads..

 

[Libertine]

F/f

Because I'd rather think about four breasts than two phalluses. Or even one phallus, if it isn't mine.

 

[Redmage]

Wow, these M/M threads are starting to rub me the wrong way.

Free tip: if you don't like them, don't read them.

I don't see why some people can't understand that males are not as intimiate with each other as females are.

I don't see why some people are prone to stereotyping. So maybe everyone has something they can't understand.

When a straight male views two males tickling each other (specially in bondage) it is unsettling.

I'm sure that's true of some straight men. And some gay men who don't like bondage and tickling. And some straight women. And some gay women.

What you really seem to be saying is "I don't understand why people don't think everyone likes what I like."

I bet less than one tenth of one percent of members on this forum have "bashed" m/m content. Most people just find what they want and not bother with the rest.

Are you representing the 0.1% then? Because I'm not feeling the love here. Or even the not bothering.

 

[KittenToes]

Male vs. Female sexuality

One answer springs immediately to mind to explain the disparity in the number of F/F clips versus M/M and the differing attitudes towards the 2 styles.

Most purchasers of tickle videos, porn films, or any sexually oriented films for that matter, are male. Straight male. Film companies are first and foremost business and profit oriented. They produce what they have found will sell to the biggest audience.

An audience that would want to see M/M material would consist of straight women and gay men for the most part. That would be less profitable, because in general, women are far less visually oriented. Women do not buy tickle/fetish/sex videos. The only instances I have encountered in which women purchased fetish/sex videos were as half of a m/f couple, to use as a marital aid. No single female of my acquaintance has purchased porn to accompany a session of self-gratification. She would, instead, buy a "romance novel". Have you noticed that 99% of those are female-oriented? I mean, I can't see your typical Joe Lumberjack racing to purchase the latest Danielle Steel, any more than I can see some sweet lonely housewife drooling over Ron Jeremy.

So while I might find the idea of two lovely muscly men writhing in ecstacy nice to think about, I would never go out of my way to watch it, let alone purchase it. And video producers are well aware that, if I, and other women, did enjoy the idea of it, we'd be much more likely to want to read a story about it than observe it.

Yes, I know. Some women are visual, and some men might like Danielle Steel. But in this case I am speaking of the majority. So don't be offended if your opinions differ from mine. I never said 100% of men are one way and all women another way.

BTW, I don't like Danielle Steel OR Ron Jeremy, myself...

 

[BellaRisa]

"Women do not buy tickle/fetish/sex videos...No single female of my acquaintance has purchased porn to accompany a session of self-gratification."

Hi Kittentoes, I believe we became aquaintances at NEST 🙂

Women don't buy as much as men, but they definitely buy plenty and for that very purpose; especially we women with kinks, we can't get our pleasures from vanilla romance fluff. Trust me, I spent hours and hours searching novels like that for precious, badly written tickling and spanking scenes before I discovered material written just for my needs and was able to obtain it. I started when I was just 15 with M/F Cal Star videos(oh good lord I'm old) and moved on. I'm not single now by any means but I was then. And it's not just me, I'm no exception to some rule; My friends that run Shadow Lane tell me that women make up about half of their customer base. *ALL* of my single girlfriends in OH own their own collections of both vanilla and kink-oriented porn for self-pleasuring purposes; my best friend J works at one of our most popular adult shops, and she tells me that at least a quarter of the porn rentals and purchases are for single straight ladies.

You're right, they're not drooling over Ron Jeremy, they're losing their minds over Jeff Stryker

Bella, still a fan of Tied and Tickled #'s 1 and 2...

 

[Vae]

I admit being apart of this double standard. I will not watch M/M clips. I have no idea why. Male on male sex does not bother me -- I'll watch that. But for some reason, it doesn't work with tickling.

I guess I see tickling as an innocent, playful matter. Girls are in generally more intimately playful with each other than men, but it doesn't excuse the total dislike. I have no answer for it. It's just how I feel.

 

[isabeau]

I admit being apart of this double standard. I will not watch M/M clips. I have no idea why. Male on male sex does not bother me -- I'll watch that. But for some reason, it doesn't work with tickling.

I guess I see tickling as an innocent, playful matter. Girls are in generally more intimately playful with each other than men, but it doesn't excuse the total dislike. I have no answer for it. It's just how I feel.

i can respect that, Vae...it's true that men generally aren't as playful with each other as women can be...which is rather a shame...

thank everyone for their views...it's nice that people shared their opinions without getting flamed.......

in Europe, men greet each other with a hug i believe...especially relatives..but not here...tis a shame

 

[primetime]

you know, i always wondered about why people look at f/f in a more positive way than M/M. now, anyone who reads my stories knows i absolutely LOVE F/F. i like it more than M/F, unless i am the "M". there is something highly erotic about it and i just enjoy watching F/F. there is nothing else like it.

as for M/M, it isnt my cup of tea, but i have seen some still pictures and it isnt too bad. i cant watch clips because like someone mentioned before, male laughter doesnt quite do it for me like female laughter. i know i am not gay and i do not go out of my way to look at M/M stuff. M/M just isnt what i like to look at.

the real source of the problem is we have people on the TMF who find it necessary to insult those or give negative opinions on those who like M/M. to me, they are posting in these threads to be mean. why else would they even bother to open a M/M thread if they dont like it? if i dont like McDonald's for example, i am not going to go into a McDonald's restaurant and tell the workers and management that i hate their food. what would be the point?

think about it. why ELSE would you even bother to read a M/M thread? it is possible you are curious as to why others like it, but the real issue is you want to be mean. there is no other explanation. let the M/M fans enjoy their thing and you enjoy your thing whether it is M/F, F/F, F/M, horse/F, spider/M, whatever. so lovers of M/M, keep posting your stuff. someone is going to like it. to the haters of M/M, unless your opinion is asked for, just leave them alone. dont be an ass and let people be.

 

[isabeau]

you know, i always wondered about why people look at f/f in a more positive way than M/M. now, anyone who reads my stories knows i absolutely LOVE F/F. i like it more than M/F, unless i am the "M". there is something highly erotic about it and i just enjoy watching F/F. there is nothing else like it.

as for M/M, it isnt my cup of tea, but i have seen some still pictures and it isnt too bad. i cant watch clips because like someone mentioned before, male laughter doesnt quite do it for me like female laughter. i know i am not gay and i do not go out of my way to look at M/M stuff. M/M just isnt what i like to look at.

the real source of the problem is we have people on the TMF who find it necessary to insult those or give negative opinions on those who like M/M. to me, they are posting in these threads to be mean. why else would they even bother to open a M/M thread if they dont like it? if i dont like McDonald's for example, i am not going to go into a McDonald's restaurant and tell the workers and management that i hate their food. what would be the point?

think about it. why ELSE would you even bother to read a M/M thread? it is possible you are curious as to why others like it, but the real issue is you want to be mean. there is no other explanation. let the M/M fans enjoy their thing and you enjoy your thing whether it is M/F, F/F, F/M, horse/F, spider/M, whatever. so lovers of M/M, keep posting your stuff. someone is going to like it. to the haters of M/M, unless your opinion is asked for, just leave them alone. dont be an ass and let people be.

thank you Primetime...exactly what i've thought..i mean most of the m/m clips are marked that way in the title..in fact i know the thread that sort of started all this controversy was...because i went in there and viewed all the negative postings...as i've said before many times, i have read stories that i don't care for at all..instead of posting anything negative about them, i just close the thread and move on...

 

[Redmage]

Here's the finest example of this "no MM" attitude that I've ever encountered.

Almost 20 years ago, now, I visited Charleston, South Carolina. A mining company had flown me out there for a job interview, because they needed a chemist. The interview was nothing special, but nothing awful either. So I decided that if I was thinking of living there I had better scope out the adult entertainment scene and see what they had to offer.

Well, after much searching I finally tracked down what seemed to be Charleston's one and only adult bookstore. I roamed around, checking things out, and after a little while I started to notice a pattern. Now, I'm from California, so I wasn't sure at first that I was seeing things right. I checked with the clerk behind the counter.

"'Scuse me," I said. "I'm noticing a lot of lesbian porn here, but I don't seem to see any gay male porn. Is that right, or am I missing something?"

"No, sir, that's right," he said. "That's the law here."

"Huh?" Sudden shocks make me witty like that.

"'s the law," the clerk repeated. "City gummint says we can sell the girlie stuff, but they don't want any fag porn here."

So, basically, the old men who make the rules in those parts liked looking at the girls together, but they couldn't handle two guys in a bed. So they banned it. Nice, eh?

Needless to say, I didn't move to South Carolina. But that has stuck with me as the best example of our social double standard that I've ever run across.