Why do people not like police?

[BellaRisa]

Maybe the cops have a reason to 'profile' you according to your race.

According to July 1st 200 Census report, the United States is populated by 211,460,626 'white' people and 34,658,190 'black' people, which makes up 75.1% and 12.3% of the population respectively. And I am sure that 12.3 percent of the population was a little lower ten years ago in 1997, when 37.8% of the people in jails nation wide were black.

Ya think there might be some kind of correlation here or what? You can't argue with the numbers.

Viper,

I've read your statements in this thread and I'm truly disappointed. I thought you had far more intelligence, true knowledge of the world around you, and compassion than you've displayed here. You've insulted every person of color who reads this thread, and some of us thought you considered us friends. As a person of color I do hope you weren't worried about your wallet or safety when near me at NEST, since we brown folks are so statistically criminally inclined.

I know, you didn't mean me.

Of course you didn't.

Perhaps your stats are correct. Let's say they are. They don't justify people being mistreated and needlessly made to feel like criminals by police and other authority figures simply for their resemblance to others who've commited crimes. That behavior is hurtful and hateful and wrong, period.

I've been brown since 1972. I grew up in one of the roughest parts of Bed-Stuy, Brooklyn, surrounded by other brown people and precious few who weren't brown. And I've seen horrible, horrible things done to innocent brown people by non-brown people. And yet I'm happily married to a non-brown man. I consider many non-brown people to be family, people for whom I would do damn near anything. Because people are INDIVIDUALS, and we each deserve to be treated as such. Anyone who lacks the sense and maturity to understand that has no place in my life until they grow up. I will NOT pay for the crimes of others, just as I don't expect whites in my life to pay for crimes whites have commited against blacks over the last several centuries. To ask my husband to suffer for that long, long boatride to slavery that my ancestors were forced to make is ridiculous. As is 'profiling' innocent people based purely on acts that others of their race have commited.

Do I understand how racial profiling happens? Of course. If you get scratched by enough cats eventually you'll twitch when a strange cat walks by. But you don't have the right to kick or scream at every cat you see. Nor do police have the right to give certain races a humiliating and damaging level of scrutiny simply because others of that race have done wrong. It's unacceptable and only serves to further seperate our society, which is the last thing we need.

As to the original question: I have no issue with police, despite some truly horrific behavior I've seen from some of them. Judgng all of a group by the behavior of some, or even many, is childish and wrong and should not be tolerated simply because "that's the way it is today". I certainly have issue with bad police, just as I do with bad teachers, bad doctors or any other professional who's performance is discriminatory or poor in some way. Based on their particular performance, not that of their profession, race or anything else as a generality.

Bella

 

[Headsnap]

Giggle, why do you talk about me being a small man when you're only a smart ass when you're behind your keyboard? You're the meekest little thing in person. Besides, mathematics is not a matter of opinion, last time I checked. 😉

The law of averages is a mathematical rule and is therefore not to be argued with. Applying it to vast swathes of the population and calling it a "profile" is prejudicial and a little bit reactionary. Nowadays we're introducing all sorts of legislation to provide for human individuality and yet we're using the law of averages to police the people. Does that not strike you as slightly at odds?

My opinions are based on personal experience and the things I learned growing up and observing the things that went on around me. I don't fall under the influence of anyone or anything. My decisions are made by me and only me. "The man" has nothing to do with it.

It is big of you to take personal responsibility for your own judgemental ignorance, sir.

 

[isabeau]

i didn't read every post on this thread..looks like it's getting rather nasty...i have nothing against police myself.. did anyone mention the Rodney King issue? that could be why so many "hate" the police..those police officers didn't exactly give cops a good name..my next door neighbor's son is a policeman..i would be proud if my son/daughter had chosen that field, if i had had children that is...

in fact i find nothing sexier than a male cop in uniform...i used to have a fantasy involving a rather built cop...handcuffs..private room etc....oops i digress...

 

[kis123]

Viper,

I've read your statements in this thread and I'm truly disappointed. I thought you had far more intelligence, true knowledge of the world around you, and compassion than you've displayed here. You've insulted every person of color who reads this thread, and some of us thought you considered us friends. As a person of color I do hope you weren't worried about your wallet or safety when near me at NEST, since we brown folks are so statistically criminally inclined.

I know, you didn't mean me.

Of course you didn't.

Perhaps your stats are correct. Let's say they are. They don't justify people being mistreated and needlessly made to feel like criminals by police and other authority figures simply for their resemblance to others who've commited crimes. That behavior is hurtful and hateful and wrong, period.

I've been brown since 1972. I grew up in one of the roughest parts of Bed-Stuy, Brooklyn, surrounded by other brown people and precious few who weren't brown. And I've seen horrible, horrible things done to innocent brown people by non-brown people. And yet I'm happily married to a non-brown man. I consider many non-brown people to be family, people for whom I would do damn near anything. Because people are INDIVIDUALS, and we each deserve to be treated as such. Anyone who lacks the sense and maturity to understand that has no place in my life until they grow up. I will NOT pay for the crimes of others, just as I don't expect whites in my life to pay for crimes whites have commited against blacks over the last several centuries. To ask my husband to suffer for that long, long boatride to slavery that my ancestors were forced to make is ridiculous. As is 'profiling' innocent people based purely on acts that others of their race have commited.

Do I understand how racial profiling happens? Of course. If you get scratched by enough cats eventually you'll twitch when a strange cat walks by. But you don't have the right to kick or scream at every cat you see. Nor do police have the right to give certain races a humiliating and damaging level of scrutiny simply because others of that race have done wrong. It's unacceptable and only serves to further seperate our society, which is the last thing we need.

As to the original question: I have no issue with police, despite some truly horrific behavior I've seen from some of them. Judgng all of a group by the behavior of some, or even many, is childish and wrong and should not be tolerated simply because "that's the way it is today". I certainly have issue with bad police, just as I do with bad teachers, bad doctors or any other professional who's performance is discriminatory or poor in some way. Based on their particular performance, not that of their profession, race or anything else as a generality.

Bella

Bella, you handled that with grace and dignity I didn't see the need to afford him. Thank you for your opinion; it only proves everything I've always said when these race things pop up.

What he has done is what I try to do; expose people for who they really are and what they really think. I hope he's just spouting insanity out of anger and this isn't truly how he feels. If so, it's just sad and shameful in this day and age, isn't it??

 

[brianspencer66]

Viper,
I truly like your the clips you have shown on this site but I have to say as a black man im deeply disturbed by you racist comments on here and I for one am not going to patronize your site at all. The more im seeing your post here the deeper I dislike you. And its not just here but some of the deeply offensive things you said about a child getting hit by a car and your infamous post about the young girl getting raped and deserving it. I dont like you and I dont want to know you. And you know what for a young man starting out with a web site why do you choose to alienate so many why be so foolish?

 

[PainTrain]

Someone expresses their opinion, based on statistical fact, and now they are being a "racist".


Come now, we never saw THIS one coming.


Criminals are punished for what they do, be they white, black, yellow or whatever, and everyone else pays the price for their actions. It's the world we live in, and it isn't going to change.


All we need now are more severe laws for drug and gun related crime. Strike fear into the hearts of anyone considering a crime, and the crimes will decrease.


I think Police officers should be given far more authority as to what they can do to suspects, especially when it comes to physical authority.

 

[Fire_Sprite]

In conclusion, everyone in this thread is ABSOLUTELY right, everyone else is either racist, ignorant, or misguided.


If you think thats a contradiction, consult the above sentence.

 

[ViperGTS]

Bella, Kis, brianspencer...every single one of you have taken what I've said out of context.

rac·ism /ˈreɪsɪzəm/ - hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Bella, did I seem intolerant of you when we were together at NEST?

Have I ever called anyone on this forum a derogatory name based on what I think to be the color of their skin?

Have I ever, outside of this thread, said anything that ever expressed my opinions about the various races AT ALL?

You will find that the answers to all these questions is, in fact, a resounding, blaring NO.

I didn't think I would need to sit here and explain this concept to anyone. Perhaps it was a misjudgment of my own, I don't know. I will give this one last shot, and hopefully I can get my point across and through all the anger in this damned thread.

The statistics I posted are not opinions. They are facts taken directly from US Census websites and Criminal Justice System websites. Interpereting these numbers, I formed an opinion that makes sense to me.

I grew up in a shitty neighborhood. The people who were causing 95% of the trouble in said neighborhood were black. Therefore, given my childhood circumstances, I formed an opinion based on my surroundings. It's not because The man was telling me that certain types of people are dangerous, it's because certain types of people PROVED to me to be dangerous. Did that make me a racist? No. In fact, my very best friend during my entire childhood, who I am still good friends with to this day, was directly from Nigeria. Very dark skinned, with a bit of a French accent. His name is Dave. I went to his house almost every single day, where we played with his Gerbils, Scott and Tanya, and played Sonic The Hedgehog on Sega Genesis, as well as Resident Evil when it came out on 3DO.

A racist would automatically write off someone of another color without taking any time getting to know them. Bella, I have known you for how long? Would a racist white man even bother getting to know you, and call you to personally apologize from the bottom of his heart for endangering his friendship with you?

Do I profile people? Yes, I do. The way people carry themselves, the way people dress, the way people talk, it all influences the way we think about someone even if we've never met them before. Do I act differently around them as a result? No, that would be wrong. I don't exactly go try to make friends with someone who looks like he might be looking for trouble, but I don't strike up a conversation with random people anyway.

Someone said earlier, if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, it must be a duck. Following that logic, if someone looks like they want to start trouble, and uses lingo that sounds like gang talk, they must be in a gang, right? They must be a criminal, right? Wrong.

I'm sorry that some of you took what I said to be indicative of me being racist. Someone started off on a tangent about racial profiling, which provided the fuel, and I kindof got on my high horse about it and sparked the flame. Of course, people got angry and refuse to see anyone else's point of view through their own opinions, myself included. I could have said things differently and antagonized people a little less, but I still stand behind my points, as I consider them to be valid given the facts and experience that they are based on.

 

[Stugots]

here's a clip for the racist members:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=XCbrEbEyheM&mode=related&search=

 

[ViperGTS]

here's a clip for the racist members:

No, now see, THAT was fucking wrong. I wanted to lay in to him for that myself, when I heard about it. He said those things in ager, with hostility and hate, and that is what differentiates a racial comment.

 

[brianspencer66]

Someone expresses their opinion, based on statistical fact, and now they are being a "racist".


Come now, we never saw THIS one coming.


Criminals are punished for what they do, be they white, black, yellow or whatever, and everyone else pays the price for their actions. It's the world we live in, and it isn't going to change.


All we need now are more severe laws for drug and gun related crime. Strike fear into the hearts of anyone considering a crime, and the crimes will decrease.


I think Police officers should be given far more authority as to what they can do to suspects, especially when it comes to physical authority.

Young man I just read your profile and Im guessing your from the UK and your 21 years old I see. Im sure you mean well but frankly your not american ok? Im more than twice your age and I can quite remember washrooms and hotels that said white only ok? this was before you were in diapers. Black people to this day dont get a fair deal in this country look up right now on the net about what is happpening in Jena Louisana with that high school where white kids have been getting away for years with having a whites only section under a tree in the schools back yard. Did you know some of the blacks kids got fed up with that and decided to sit there and the next day the white kids put up a noose under that tree to scare the black kids? Do you understand what a noose tells black people in this country? Anyway to make a long story short a white kid was ruffed up by some black students and one black kid was almost given a life sentence for murder even though this same white kid that was beaten showed up at I think it was a football game that night. Is that justice? Do you know anything about the laws here and how black youth are locked up for having crack cocain and how rich whites using pure cocain are not dished out the same sentence? we as African Americans are sick to our stomachs seeing a double standard and you as a 21 year old english white male well you dont live here. Im 52 and I dont dislike police I think most do a wonderful job. But racial profiling is a reality that all black males fear. We all have a deep lingering though that one of us can be shot or killed by police and that my friend is a fear you can never understand.

 

[ViperGTS]

a white kid was ruffed up by some black students and one black kid was almost given a life sentence for murder even though this same white kid that was beaten showed up at I think it was a football game that night. Is that justice?

I'm not trying to aggrivate you or anything, but I am curious...what did the white kid do get the snot beaten out of him? What did he do that you think he should be punished for? You just didn't clarify that, that's all. 🙂

 

[brianspencer66]

I'm not trying to aggrivate you or anything, but I am curious...what did the white kid do get the snot beaten out of him? What did he do that you think he should be punished for? You just didn't clarify that, that's all. 🙂

Ill be the first to admit Viper that this kid was WRONGLY beaten. But at this particular school for years whites kids made it a rule that they and only they should sit under this tree no blacks allowed ok? Hell if I was a 17 year old I may have wanted to beat the snot out of this kid too if I had to deal with that crap Viper. This kid was part of a racist collective that was ongoing for years in other words. And the real point is not that this kid was beaten the point is the kind of justice that was doled out to those black kids. Should have they been punished? Hell yeah!!! But what does it tell you when african american kids are or one at least is facing life in jail for attempted murder when this same beaten white kid shows up at a football game that same day?

 

[Icycle]

Most people who don't like police have either broken the law or make a habbit of hanging out with people who brake the law. Personaly I haven't had any trouble with cops. I'm a middle class white guy with no record, and no intentions of getting one soon. I don't use drug, don't steal, and just generaly stay out of trouble. I really think it's funny when I hear someone say a cop gave them a hard time for nothing, normaly nothing means nothing they felt they deserved it for. When my dad was a teen, he knew guy who got slapped around by cops for just looking at them the wrong way, and guess what when my old man was younger EVERYONE he knew was white. For those of you who want to play the race card go elts where it won't wash with me.

Once when I was in high school (age 18), I was parked on the side of a dark, quiet country road late at night, making out with my girlfriend (age 17). A cop happened to drive by, stopped, looked in us, and then began to harass us, and threatened me with statutory rape!

Another time later that year, I was performing in a local theater production. One night after the show I hung with the cast at a local diner until about 2am, and then drove home. About halfway home I noticed a pair of headlights following me, which seemed a little odd, since I lived in a small town, and there is almost no traffic that late at night. I turned off on a side street to see if the guy was following me, or if it was just a coincidence. The headlights stayed right behind me. I was getting really nervous and freaked out. I made my way back to the main drag, and the following car stayed with me. As I pulled around the corner near my home, I was so freaked out, I cut the corner too close and rolled over the curb. The car behind me parked behind me, and then turned on his cop lights. The cop started harrassing me, asking me why I had parked here, where I was going, why I took such roundabout route. Then he asked if I had been drinking. When I told him (truthfully!) that I had not, he asked me why I had been driving so erratically! I explained to him that a strange car (him!) had been following me for about two miles!

Sometimes, even white, law-abiding citizens get unfairly harassed by police.

 

[kis123]

Bella, Kis, brianspencer...every single one of you have taken what I've said out of context.

rac·ism /ˈreɪsɪzəm/ - hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Bella, did I seem intolerant of you when we were together at NEST?

Have I ever called anyone on this forum a derogatory name based on what I think to be the color of their skin?

Have I ever, outside of this thread, said anything that ever expressed my opinions about the various races AT ALL?

You will find that the answers to all these questions is, in fact, a resounding, blaring NO.

I didn't think I would need to sit here and explain this concept to anyone. Perhaps it was a misjudgment of my own, I don't know. I will give this one last shot, and hopefully I can get my point across and through all the anger in this damned thread.

I'm sorry that some of you took what I said to be indicative of me being racist. Someone started off on a tangent about racial profiling, which provided the fuel, and I kindof got on my high horse about it and sparked the flame. Of course, people got angry and refuse to see anyone else's point of view through their own opinions, myself included. I could have said things differently and antagonized people a little less, but I still stand behind my points, as I consider them to be valid given the facts and experience that they are based on.

I was going to comment on this yesterday but was far too angry to respond. Thanks for the backhanded apology, but I'm going to pass. This is typical of how you post on a regular basis and I personally feel that if Bella didn't shake you out of your tree, you wouldn't apologize at all. So apologize to Bella since that's the only one you're really concerned about. You cannot take back what you put in print-it's a reflection of the true condition of your heart and how you really feel.

If you can still stand by the points you made, then there was no real reason for an apology at all. Your points are what caused the mess in the first place. Your "black panther" comment was totally out of line and you have yet to account for it which means you're standing by that too, right? Do you know all the good they did in the 60s gets overshadowed by their implosion in the 70s? I won't get into the reasons for the implosion because you'll probably try to counterpoint me with your so-called statistics and opinions. You know statistics are only developed when someone wants to know something; if they don't want to know how many whites get into trouble or land in jail, they won't use statistical data to find out will they? Besides, they separate the crimes anyway--they don't call it blue or black collar crime but they do separate white collar crime don't they? And if you don't think white collar crime is serious, go talk to people in Enron, MCI, Adelphia, and the multitude of companies whos life savings were wiped out, and they lost their jobs over the crimes of rich greedy white men!

Oh, and I loved your path of logic about "african americans", from what actual experience did you gain this wisdom? From what you saw as a kid?? So what Viper--black kids caused trouble! So what, your neighborhood and childhood was rough! Join the club!! It's no reason to lump everyone in one category!

How many black people especially males have written about their negative experiences with police? My son was beaten in my face and I was threatened with arrest Viper-did that not mean anything to you??? My son is mentally handicapped Viper and he was treated like a street thug!! What, no witty, insuting, abusive, arrogant, rude commentary from you?? I'm surprised!

Oh, I almost forgot, the comment about punching someone's lights out which was quoted in my post was such a sweet touch. You haven't apologized for threatening to hit a woman either have you? Then again, you said it to me and not to Bella or you'd care more about what you put in print. No one took your "opinions" out of context--we were dead on point and there's no clean up. Good luck with the damage control with Bella though; I wouldn't want you to lose a friend at the cost of insulting an entire race of people now would I??😡

You started this thread with the intention of stirring up racial tension. You even admitted to doing such in one of your tantrums-if you don't recall, go back and read, it makes for quite interesting reading. I always said make someone angry enough and they'll tell what they truly think about an issue. That's what I did, get you angry enough to tell the truth. The only thing your're sorry about IMO is that you put it in print for everyone to see. You really should do something about that temper of yours, it has a way of biting you in the backside pretty regularly around here.

I said it before and will say it again, you know not of what you speak Viper! You have and will never experience it for yourself!! Stick to computers or your dom activities and keep out of things you have no knowledge of and your world will be a better place for you to live. Maybe in the future, you won't type yourself into a corner with people who have called you "friend" if you'd lose the attitude!

 

[Wolf]

Just one opinion

and the experience it is based upon;

Full disclosure: I was a cop for 12 years. In that time, I saw a lot of brave, honest, hardworking people in uniform who genuinely just wanted to help. I saw a lot of admirable people that I was proud to work with. That being said.....

I also saw drunks, wife beaters, and racists in uniform. I saw people working out their own psychological inadequacies on the public that they were sworn to protect. I knew of cops committing crimes in their off time that would never be charged, and I saw politics overshadow right and wrong. When it got too much for me, I left. It still bugs me when people talk trash about cops, but I don't blame them. I blame the cops who gave them those opinions. Because those people usually have a reason.

As for the whole racial experience thing, I consider it pretty silly to try to opine about the black experience, if you've never lived it. After all;

I've never had someone cross the street when they saw me coming.
I've never had a shopkeeper look at me suspiciously when I was browsing.
I've never had a woman look at me in fear when I stepped into an elevator alone with her. They usually asked me to walk me to their cars.
I've never been pulled over because I was driving in an all-white neighborhood after dark.
However, I was the only white kid in a school of 300, in Houston, and never had a problem. Maybe I was too valuable as the token white guy. Maybe I was lucky. Or maybe there were enough people in the school who already knew what it was like to be the minority.

Just my opinion.

By the way, anyone else notice how many self-proclaimed bad-ass "dominant" types are not only not-so-closeted misogynists, but also not-so-closeted racists? It's all about trying to justify your fear, while concealing it....isn't it?

 

[BellaRisa]

and the experience it is based upon;

Full disclosure: I was a cop for 12 years. In that time, I saw a lot of brave, honest, hardworking people in uniform who genuinely just wanted to help. I saw a lot of admirable people that I was proud to work with. That being said.....

I also saw drunks, wife beaters, and racists in uniform. I saw people working out their own psychological inadequacies on the public that they were sworn to protect. I knew of cops committing crimes in their off time that would never be charged, and I saw politics overshadow right and wrong. When it got too much for me, I left. It still bugs me when people talk trash about cops, but I don't blame them. I blame the cops who gave them those opinions. Because those people usually have a reason.

As for the whole racial experience thing, I consider it pretty silly to try to opine about the black experience, if you've never lived it. After all;

I've never had someone cross the street when they saw me coming.
I've never had a shopkeeper look at me suspiciously when I was browsing.
I've never had a woman look at me in fear when I stepped into an elevator alone with her. They usually asked me to walk me to their cars.
I've never been pulled over because I was driving in an all-white neighborhood after dark.
However, I was the only white kid in a school of 300, in Houston, and never had a problem. Maybe I was too valuable as the token white guy. Maybe I was lucky. Or maybe there were enough people in the school who already knew what it was like to be the minority.

Just my opinion.

By the way, anyone else notice how many self-proclaimed bad-ass "dominant" types are not only not-so-closeted misogynists, but also not-so-closeted racists? It's all about trying to justify your fear, while concealing it....isn't it?

You, Sir, are my Hero for today. Expect a basket of muffins, fine chocolates and elegantly tiny soaps

Bella

 

[Headsnap]

You, Sir, are my Hero for today. Expect a basket of muffins, fine chocolates and elegantly tiny soaps

Bella

IAWTC. That was one of those show-stopper replies which makes everything you were about to write slightly irrelevant. Well done, Wolf-sir!

 

[kis123]

Ill be the first to admit Viper that this kid was WRONGLY beaten. But at this particular school for years whites kids made it a rule that they and only they should sit under this tree no blacks allowed ok? Hell if I was a 17 year old I may have wanted to beat the snot out of this kid too if I had to deal with that crap Viper. This kid was part of a racist collective that was ongoing for years in other words. And the real point is not that this kid was beaten the point is the kind of justice that was doled out to those black kids. Should have they been punished? Hell yeah!!! But what does it tell you when african american kids are or one at least is facing life in jail for attempted murder when this same beaten white kid shows up at a football game that same day?

Well, another example of how fair and just a criminal justice system we have! I wonder how things would have been if it were a group of white kids beating up a black teenager? It probably never would've made it to court and never would've made it to the news!

Times are changing and kids aren't willing to ignore or suck up to things my generation had to endure. Besides, the 60s was about civil change, over 40 years later, just how much has really changed overall? People wonder why blacks feel the way we do about racisim--it's because so little has really changed. They took the signs down, but the attitudes and stereotypes are still there.

Sorry for going off topic, but the Jena case has me so upset I couldn't avoid or ignore this comment. This just set back race relations about 50 years IMO.

 

[dvnc]

Bella said it so well. I just wanna support the lady.

I wanna support the vast minorities in a FORUM of minority. Bella, Kis123 and the thousands of others here who just got a backhand from the 60s. Then let's add the rest of the folks that sympathize with such perspectives - the Asian, Hispanic, Native-American, and so on. There's many in West Coast Gatherings that deserve the respect.

Wanna support the number of law enforcement members here. WCG has some of you, too. Respect. Wolf, props t'you for jumpin' in.

Statistics can be spun forever. They're numbers. They're meant to be played. Such statistics NEVER mention what they DON'T know. They don't cover a variety of aspects of failing in our society, and others. And no one's touching the economics of this.

They don't justify blamin' blacks, or cops, or women, or anyone else.

This thread, in my personal opinion, starts out bad, Viper. It's my opinion, and that's inarguable and only valuable as it's mine. I don't like the way you've responded. That's my opinion, too.

You had many ways you could have handled this. I'm not appreciating this one, personally.

As a mod, I'm glad it's not turned into a greater problem. The damage it's done is just sad and unfortunate, and doesn't appear to be something that will go away. Would require written apologies here, and personal apologies to those that won't touch this thread, etc.

It's just disappointing, Viper. Very, very disappointing. Free will, though. You're responsible for what you've said, and what you've started. Just glad I'm one of the folks who don't agree with you at all.

 

[Dave2112]

By the way, anyone else notice how many self-proclaimed bad-ass "dominant" types are not only not-so-closeted misogynists, but also not-so-closeted racists? It's all about trying to justify your fear, while concealing it....isn't it?

I liked your original post, all of it, but wanted to comment on this. I agree that this is the case more often than it should be. And it pisses off those of us who are Dominant for all the right reasons. I'm hoping Bella comes along to back me up on this, because it's something we've discussed before. A true "Alpha Male" Dom mentality is something different than being a "control freak". You can't be a racist or misogynist and be an effective Dom. Not for long, anyhow. I don't have the tiniest bit of a misogynistic or racist bone in my body, but am a complete Dominant nonetheless. The emotion a Dom should be sharing with a Submissive; the balance between control and care, give and take, fulfillment and cross-fulfillment, the "owner" and the "caretaker", all of the roles involved...pretty much mean you have to have a more open view of a D/S relationship.

Just wanted to put that out there before a stereotype of Doms gets started inadvertantly.

Good post, though. It's nice to have the point of view of someone with some experience in these things. I have family in State and Federal law enforcment, and by virtue of my job, am friends with many Customs officers, Border Patrol, State Police and such. But that doesn't mean that I personally have any experience in it to form a frame of reference. Thanks for your point of view.

 

[Dave2112]

Bella said it so well. I just wanna support the lady.

I wanna support the vast minorities in a FORUM of minority. Bella, Kis123 and the thousands of others here who just got a backhand from the 60s. Then let's add the rest of the folks that sympathize with such perspectives - the Asian, Hispanic, Native-American, and so on. There's many in West Coast Gatherings that deserve the respect.

Wanna support the number of law enforcement members here. WCG has some of you, too. Respect. Wolf, props t'you for jumpin' in.

Statistics can be spun forever. They're numbers. They're meant to be played. Such statistics NEVER mention what they DON'T know. They don't cover a variety of aspects of failing in our society, and others. And no one's touching the economics of this.

They don't justify blamin' blacks, or cops, or women, or anyone else.

This thread, in my personal opinion, starts out bad, Viper. It's my opinion, and that's inarguable and only valuable as it's mine. I don't like the way you've responded. That's my opinion, too.

You had many ways you could have handled this. I'm not appreciating this one, personally.

As a mod, I'm glad it's not turned into a greater problem. The damage it's done is just sad and unfortunate, and doesn't appear to be something that will go away. Would require written apologies here, and personal apologies to those that won't touch this thread, etc.

It's just disappointing, Viper. Very, very disappointing. Free will, though. You're responsible for what you've said, and what you've started. Just glad I'm one of the folks who don't agree with you at all.

On these points, I am in 100% agreement with my wise colleague.

 

[ViperGTS]

Damage? Someone didn't like something that someone else said and they got offended. What's so damaging about that? People get offended all the time; they get over it.

 

[Capnmad]

I liked your original post, all of it, but wanted to comment on this. I agree that this is the case more often than it should be. And it pisses off those of us who are Dominant for all the right reasons. I'm hoping Bella comes along to back me up on this, because it's something we've discussed before. A true "Alpha Male" Dom mentality is something different than being a "control freak". You can't be a racist or misogynist and be an effective Dom. Not for long, anyhow. I don't have the tiniest bit of a misogynistic or racist bone in my body, but am a complete Dominant nonetheless. The emotion a Dom should be sharing with a Submissive; the balance between control and care, give and take, fulfillment and cross-fulfillment, the "owner" and the "caretaker", all of the roles involved...pretty much mean you have to have a more open view of a D/S relationship.

Just wanted to put that out there before a stereotype of Doms gets started inadvertantly.

Well said, and good for people to understand. Unfortunately, as evidenced with racism, it only takes a few bad examples to set a stereotype and do damage to wider perceptions of the lot.

 

[Cosmo_ac]

Damage? Someone didn't like something that someone else said and they got offended. What's so damaging about that? People get offended all the time; they get over it.

Sadly viper, some don't. And those who do, and those who don't usually don't wear it on their sleaves, which is why that is not a very good view to hold.

That being said, reading some of your posts, i can undertsand, if not agree with your views.

Personally, i have a friend who some would consider a racist. I wouldn;t call him a bad person though. He's the type of guy who would have your back in a second if your are his friend without even needing to ask. But, he also dislikes black people and arab people, not because he was raised that way, but because he has had bad experiences with them.

He works for a comunications company and has had to travel to some of the shittiest parts in Toronto, and has more then a few stories about his experiences their. In one case he had a machetti put to his neck by a middleeast guy who was freaking out on drugs. Another time he was chased down the street by a bunch of black guys cause he was wearing the wrong type of shirt. Another time he was attacked by some guy when he went into their house to set something up, and made a comment when the guy hit his kid. Their are other stories as well that i'm sure i don't remember off the top of my head, or haven;t been told, but this has caused him to have a very poor view of coloured people, even though he does have at least one friend i know of who is black.

I'm gathering that you have a negative view because of your experiences, and you know, i can appreciate that. There are people in this thread who also have bad views of police because of negatie experiences, and i can appreciate that as well.

However, i think we all might need to take a step back and realize that while those our are own personal experiences, others have had very different experiences with those we view as good or bad. We need to make sure that we don;t prejudge people. just take it as a case by case, and let the cards fall where they fall. Black, white, red, yellow, cop, soldier, lawyer, etc. We are what we are, but what we are does not dictate who we are or what we must become.