i truly now can say that ghost exist

[Capnmad]

Well, you've got me stumped; I just checked again and the link goes right to "ghostcar.wav".

Eh, it wasn't meant to be serious anyway.

IT'S THE CURSE OF THE GHOST CAR!!!

 

[Backstep]

Aside: I think there are creatures in this world that we haven't found and identified yet. While I personally think Bigfoot and Yeti sighings are actually bears (especially the Yeti), you never know what you'll find out there. Giant squids used to be a myth, after all.

As for the whole ghost thing, I posted a story about something odd that happened to me earlier on this thread. And while I don't know if ghosts exist, sometimes strange things happen that are very difficult to explain.

And even if some ghost sightings are caused by more prosaic explanations like 'ball lightning,' for example, it's still an explanation that asks almost as many questions as it answers (namely, how the hell does that even happen?)

 

[john getty]

I strongly disagree, its very possible to prove the non-existence of something.If you can stay awake in the present long enough, you will start to notice glitches in percieved reality, suttle at first and then they get more noticable...try it. Then you will prove to yourself there must be a " higher mind" or even "higher civilization" of minds at work. There is no "randomness" to the universe..its a total fix! Its all on the program.
Yes, I also said there was NO bigfoot, but some may argue he does occassionally appear on the program.

I went to Catholic school, believe me there were times when I could have used a genocidal poltergeist (God) for a bodyguard. Unfortunately, I have never noticed any glitches in the natural world, or maybe I'm just not one of those people who think that 9 11, Katrina, and Haiti were punishments for homosexuality. Terrorism and natural disasters happen, they are not glitches in reality, and I'd rather have earthquakes and tsunamis explained by scientists than some posturing priest.

One more thing, if it is a supreme creator, what if it's Odin? What if He's punishing us for getting His name wrong?

 

[taptoematt]

I went to Catholic school, believe me there were times when I could have used a genocidal poltergeist (God) for a bodyguard. Unfortunately, I have never noticed any glitches in the natural world, or maybe I'm just not one of those people who think that 9 11, Katrina, and Haiti were punishments for homosexuality. Terrorism and natural disasters happen, they are not glitches in reality, and I'd rather have earthquakes and tsunamis explained by scientists than some posturing priest.

One more thing, if it is a supreme creator, what if it's Odin? What if He's punishing us for getting His name wrong?

John, either you can't read english or you are a bloody Idiot. I don't think either one is true, so you're just "messing" with me again. nice try

 

[Backstep]

John's an Evangelical Atheist, taptoematt.


Best to just let it go, yeah?

 

[john getty]

You're BOTH right.

 

[rhiannon]

I strongly disagree, its very possible to prove the non-existence of something.

Sorry to disappoint you, but no, it is NOT possible to prove that something doesn't exist. You can only prove the existence of something. How do you want to prove that something doesn't exist? It could just not be right here at the moment! Doesn't mean it isn't somewhere else!

If you can stay awake in the present long enough, you will start to notice glitches in percieved reality, suttle at first and then they get more noticable...try it.

Uhm...you do know that insomnia causes hallucinations, right? The glitches in perceived reality are actually things that are not real!

Then you will prove to yourself there must be a " higher mind" or even "higher civilization" of minds at work.

I think you have watched "Matrix" too often!

 

[paristickler]

11 pages : WOW ! I'm sure shane2 had no idea it would draw so many reactions ! All of this leads me to think that, beyond any present and future clash between religions, it is more a clash between believers and non-believers that more knowledge and science will throw us into someday. I don't know, it seems inevitable to me - especially when people will be real fed up of all tensions and wars coming out because of religion matters in the political world. "Boom, Baby!" indeed !

 

[shane2]

Does god exist if yes then he is an evil god cause he created everything including evil right? Well then do you ever get cold? in the laws of physics cold does not exist cold is a reality in absence of heat,does darkness exist ? darkness does not exist darkness is in reality of the absence of light, light we can study not darkness , evil does not exist its just like darkness, and cold, God did not create evil,evil is a result of what happens when a person does not have gods love present in his heart.
All of the 3 major monotheistic religions agree that there is one true God, but their views differ on prophets. Does this not suggest that Christianity borrowed ideas from Judaism, and Islam, in turn, borrowed from Christianity? Many may argue that Christianity must be true, because 3 people who never met eachother wrote the synoptic gospels, but Matthew borrowed 617 of Mark's 667 verses, almost word for word. If Catholicism is untrue, then surely all other religions can be.
The argument of agnostics is that, since there is no proof of either a god or lack of one, and there never will be, there is no point in wondering if there is a god or not. Atheists believe that there is definitely no god, and that the true cause of life is, as of yet, unexplained.
Oh Rhiannon I reserched the case again of Anneliese Michel sorry to back so late but I do have a life outside of here but anyway she never had No evidence of Epilepsy was found in her brain. An autopsy was conducted to see if her brain had damage that would have proved her to be Epileptic. As I am skeptical too, I know God is all around me and if I believe in God, I am willing to accept the opposite is also true. I also believe that someone can bring these situations upon themselves by stirring up evil.

 

[shane2]

Though intuitively by nature many of us 'believe' to the thought of its phenomenal existence. The natural phenomena is also said being part of nature in this universe..
Beside still many others base it in its spiritual nature.
Ghosts are known as non physical entities, present on other dimensional life. But it possesses an energy force that is known to be as existing.

And Albert Einstein had proven that existence of energy that survives..It only changes its form.

 

[c7_assassin]

As I am skeptical too, I know God is all around me and if I believe in God, I am willing to accept the opposite is also true.

This may be the most perfect sentence I've ever read. Shane needs to become a meme.

 

[john getty]

Does god exist if yes then he is an evil god cause he created everything including evil right? Well then do you ever get cold? in the laws of physics cold does not exist cold is a reality in absence of heat,does darkness exist ? darkness does not exist darkness is in reality of the absence of light, light we can study not darkness , evil does not exist its just like darkness, and cold, God did not create evil,evil is a result of what happens when a person does not have gods love present in his heart.
All of the 3 major monotheistic religions agree that there is one true God, but their views differ on prophets. Does this not suggest that Christianity borrowed ideas from Judaism, and Islam, in turn, borrowed from Christianity? Many may argue that Christianity must be true, because 3 people who never met eachother wrote the synoptic gospels, but Matthew borrowed 617 of Mark's 667 verses, almost word for word. If Catholicism is untrue, then surely all other religions can be.
The argument of agnostics is that, since there is no proof of either a god or lack of one, and there never will be, there is no point in wondering if there is a god or not. Atheists believe that there is definitely no god, and that the true cause of life is, as of yet, unexplained.
Oh Rhiannon I reserched the case again of Anneliese Michel sorry to back so late but I do have a life outside of here but anyway she never had No evidence of Epilepsy was found in her brain. An autopsy was conducted to see if her brain had damage that would have proved her to be Epileptic. As I am skeptical too, I know God is all around me and if I believe in God, I am willing to accept the opposite is also true. I also believe that someone can bring these situations upon themselves by stirring up evil.

Hmm, so I must be evil.

I think the argument for our side is very clear, we do not believe that God exists because there is no evidence for that position.
If God did exist, you only have to read the bible to see what a twisted fuck He is.
No one said God doesn't exist because He is evil or because He created evil.
Your argument is not original, it is just a far more tedious example of an old argument that was exploded a long time ago.
Are you saying that if it wasn't for the promise of eternal life, or the threat of hellfire that you would be out raping, robbing and killing?
What kind of morality is that?
I've never done any of those things, and I have never felt the "love of God" in my heart.

 

[vladtickleman22]

For those who believe no explaination is needed. For those who don't no explaination will ever be good enough.

/thread

 

[Ticklish9's]

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I'm confused - this says that I'm about to see proof of a ghost. I saw a door open.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't doors designed to open?

This is the same situation as the knife. You see something and you don't know what caused it, so you are telling me what caused it - ghosts. That's completely illogical.

 

[Ticklish9's]

You are misunderstanding my responce.I'm telling her to forget all the misconceptions you have,: THIS is the point I'm trying to make to you.

And if you are looking for Science to give you evidence of ghosts...Good luck, because its too primative and confined to the construct of the 3rd dimension and is incapable of going any higher.
Oh yea, you can get simple EVPs and evidence of residual activity, but as for actual apparitions, the only evidence you will find is with your own experience.

Life lesson number one - if somebody starts using words like "confined to the third dimension," it's because they don't know what they're talking about.

I'm not asking science to give me evidence of ghosts - I'm asking for YOU to give me evidence of ghosts, because YOU are the one making the claim. Tossing out some mumbo-jumbo about alternate dimensions while simultaneously demonstrating that you have no idea what the word "science" means is not particularly effective evidence.

I look forward to your evidence.

 

[Ticklish9's]

Your senses lie to you horribly, because since the day you've been born you have been walking through life as a Zombie, unconscious and unaware of anything around you. Live in the present and I assure you the world will look different .

Your argument here is: "Your senses lie to you horribly, but mine don't because I [live in the present/believe in the one TRUE God/have psychic powers/am a vampire/am a vegan/am a pyramid in human form/am Tom Cruise].


Again you're making an extraordinary claim - your senses don't lie to you when literally every other human being suffers from fallible senses - without a shred of evidence.

The polite term for that is "disingenuous." The perhaps more accurate term is "full of shit."

 

[Ticklish9's]

God no...don't believe me. If you want the answer, look inside yourself.

I looked inside myself and found a half-digested soy burger and some organic ketchup.

Presumably that's not the answer you had in mind, so why don't you just give us a simple step by step analysis for what we need to do? Then we can repeat it at home and, since you clearly have the truth, we'll find the same result you do. That's very simple.

I look forward to your evidence.

 

[Ticklish9's]

Yeah...how am I going to say this....Ok ..ghosts are not real like UFOs, bigfoot etc. They are just another construct in the 3rd dimension. Everything you see and experience, the whole universe, is a construct..a running program if you will. Ghosts are not inside you..all of creation is inside you.
I can't make it any simpler than that or elaborate on it anymore.
Its hard for too many people to get their heads around...and yes you are not haunted.

Strange. You claim to be trying to make it "simple" for us, and yet you persist in using meaningless word salad to obfuscate your meaning.

Words have meaning. When you say "all of creation" is inside you, perhaps you could explain a little better, since clearly there is a fair portion of creation not only outside of me, but quite far away.

If you mean that I'm "connected" to all of creation, I'm even willing to grant you that - but it has nothing to do with ghosts.

Why not simply bring us your evidence for ghosts and your simple step by step process for finding this answer? You clearly found the answer which means the answer is available to human beings; if you're able to understand the answer then it is a simple matter to post us the process by which you developed it so we can repeat it.

I look forward to your evidence.

 

[Ticklish9's]

Sorry John, can't help you anymore. I'm trying to give you insight into something big and you can't get off the ghost stuff.

Anyhow, where do you think Hollywood gets this idea? Art imitating life.
This has been around for hundreds if not thousands of years and if you investigate some of the work science has been doing trying to disprove a supreme creator, they keep on returning to the opinion there must have been a supreme mind or even a supreme civilization, possibly one with a "super computer" thats uses real life like simulations to propel people back in time.
We might all be part of a grand Hologram. Well sounds like BS and too fantastic to believe, but the info is out there on it, and there is still more work being done.

To make you happy, ghosts are all in our imagination from scary movies...BOO !

Hey, now we're talking! You're absolutely right - we might all be part of a grand hologram. Can't deny it! It's definitely possible. It may even be likely.

But earlier you said to look inside myself for the answer. Can you please detail for me how I can get your level of certainty about the holographic nature of the universe by looking inside myself? What steps did you take to reach your certitude? I am eager to repeat them and learn for myself.

I look forward to your evidence.


Oh, and PS - here's why we can't get off the ghost stuff:

You are misunderstanding my responce.I'm telling her to forget all the misconceptions you have,: THIS is the point I'm trying to make to you.

And if you are looking for Science to give you evidence of ghosts...Good luck, because its too primative and confined to the construct of the 3rd dimension and is incapable of going any higher.
Oh yea, you can get simple EVPs and evidence of residual activity, but as for actual apparitions, the only evidence you will find is with your own experience.

You just specifically told us that science won't find evidence of ghosts but that you have some deeper understanding which we're still waiting for you to elaborate on.

 

[Ticklish9's]

I strongly disagree, its very possible to prove the non-existence of something.If you can stay awake in the present long enough, you will start to notice glitches in percieved reality, suttle at first and then they get more noticable...try it. Then you will prove to yourself there must be a " higher mind" or even "higher civilization" of minds at work. There is no "randomness" to the universe..its a total fix! Its all on the program.
Yes, I also said there was NO bigfoot, but some may argue he does occassionally appear on the program.

If you stay awake long enough, you'll notice glitches in your PERCEIVED reality.

The question, then, is are the glitches in reality... or in your perception?


Either A) by staying awake I become more perceptive and start to notice the glitches in reality, or B) by staying awake, I get tired and start to lose accuracy in my already flawed perception.


One of these seems more likely but I'll let you figure it out. If you're having trouble, just stay awake until it all becomes clear.



Also, you're subsequent argument - that if you notice glitches in reality there must be a higher mind - is totally illogical. But one step at a time I suppose, so we'll come back to that.

 

[Ticklish9's]

Aside: I think there are creatures in this world that we haven't found and identified yet. While I personally think Bigfoot and Yeti sighings are actually bears (especially the Yeti), you never know what you'll find out there. Giant squids used to be a myth, after all.

As for the whole ghost thing, I posted a story about something odd that happened to me earlier on this thread. And while I don't know if ghosts exist, sometimes strange things happen that are very difficult to explain.

And even if some ghost sightings are caused by more prosaic explanations like 'ball lightning,' for example, it's still an explanation that asks almost as many questions as it answers (namely, how the hell does that even happen?)

Agreed - the universe is a mysterious and fascinating place!

I'm thrilled that we have the means to comprehend so much of it, and such a decent chance of comprehending the rest. 😀

 

[Ticklish9's]

Does god exist if yes then he is an evil god cause he created everything including evil right? Well then do you ever get cold? in the laws of physics cold does not exist cold is a reality in absence of heat,does darkness exist ? darkness does not exist darkness is in reality of the absence of light, light we can study not darkness , evil does not exist its just like darkness, and cold, God did not create evil,evil is a result of what happens when a person does not have gods love present in his heart.

Dark is the absence of light, cold is the absence of heat, and evil is the absence of God - let's accept your premise. But there's a flaw in your argument, I'm afraid. Unlike light and heat, God is omnipotent and omniscient. Thus, not only is God the opposite of evil - God is perfectly capable of stopping evil by being present. And yet He chooses to allow Evil to continue. God must thus not be perfectly good.

You may then argue that God allows Evil to continue to allow us free will. Yet, if He is allowing us free will, then he must not know of our actions - yet He is omniscient. Thus we must not have free will. Thus he is allowing evil specifically.



Of course, I don't need to follow the logic to know this - God also thinks that it's cool to ask his followers to kill children and mistreat their wives, and that destroying a city because he doesn't approve of gay people loving each other is downright holy. If that's the sort of God that's out there, I'd be proud to opppose him. But I doubt it is, because the God of the bible is also dumb enough that he leaves his tree of knowledge in a garden with two people he gave curiousity to. It's not like God doesn't have other gardens. That's just shitty planning.

All of the 3 major monotheistic religions agree that there is one true God, but their views differ on prophets. Does this not suggest that Christianity borrowed ideas from Judaism, and Islam, in turn, borrowed from Christianity? Many may argue that Christianity must be true, because 3 people who never met eachother wrote the synoptic gospels, but Matthew borrowed 617 of Mark's 667 verses, almost word for word. If Catholicism is untrue, then surely all other religions can be.
The argument of agnostics is that, since there is no proof of either a god or lack of one, and there never will be, there is no point in wondering if there is a god or not. Atheists believe that there is definitely no god, and that the true cause of life is, as of yet, unexplained.
Oh Rhiannon I reserched the case again of Anneliese Michel sorry to back so late but I do have a life outside of here but anyway she never had No evidence of Epilepsy was found in her brain. An autopsy was conducted to see if her brain had damage that would have proved her to be Epileptic. As I am skeptical too, I know God is all around me and if I believe in God, I am willing to accept the opposite is also true. I also believe that someone can bring these situations upon themselves by stirring up evil.

I would like you to find one example where praying under controlled conditions generated any kind of response, ever. I'm interested. You can also win a million dollars if you do so, so follow up!

 

[Ticklish9's]

For those who believe no explaination is needed. For those who don't no explaination will ever be good enough.

/thread

Shorter version of above: I don't have any evidence but I want to believe so STFU.




The question for believers is - do you care if your beliefs are true? If not, then carry on your way believing whatever you like. If so, though, then you're going to want some evidence.

 

[rhiannon]

Oh Rhiannon I reserched the case again of Anneliese Michel sorry to back so late but I do have a life outside of here but anyway she never had No evidence of Epilepsy was found in her brain. An autopsy was conducted to see if her brain had damage that would have proved her to be Epileptic.

It is true that there were no signs found in her brain, but that doesn't mean she didn't have Epilepsy. She was treated for Epilepsy before she even got "possessed", and it is very likely that her sickness turned into a paranoid psychosis. EEGs that were made during her cramping also show she was epileptic. Demons do not exist, and were certainly not possessing her!

Gee Rhiannon, where do you think they got the idea for the Matrix? Art imitating life.

Yeah...right....they did for "Alice in Wonderland" too. I think this discussion ends with your last statement.

 

[shane2]

Wow ticklish 9 and john now i know you have no reserch on the bible it self no where in the bible it says that god said to kill, rape, murder,or do harm to children you dont know to much and you really don't pay to much attention didn't you read what I wrote about Albert Einstein.
Though intuitively by nature many of us 'believe' to the thought of its phenomenal existence. The natural phenomena is also said being part of nature in this universe..
Beside still many others base it in its spiritual nature.
Ghosts are known as non physical entities, present on other dimensional life. But it possesses an energy force that is known to be as existing.

And Albert Einstein had proven that existence of energy that survives..It only changes its form.
__________________
what do you think that means I think its a pretty strong point and also many of the greatest minds in the history of the world believed in god I'm pretty sure if god was evil then why would they follow him till there last days Sir Issac Newton, Albert Einstein, Shake Sphere, Abraham Lincoln,Ben Fraklin and so on brillant minds and your telling me that they were dumb enough to follow an evil god wow its just sad to see people can be so blind even when people have very strong points and evidence they chose to call it something they to can't explained I'm not say that when something weird happens all the its an act of god but whenyou can't explain it and you know for a fact the laws of physics don't apply you chose to ignore the sign or act and say oh its this complicated universe and I can't explain it its complicated and very complexed for a very good reason but know very little of this universe and of this world we still have much to learn about life and its mysterious ways. Let me ask you this do you feel love ,and sadness,hate angry,happiness how can you explain that if you can't see it you can't just pull it out of your body or theres no special organ that makes us feel that way and if you know theres no afterlfe then why go on with life why be a part of it your not going to exist way longer than you existed so if you have no meaning then why should you continue to if know in a few decades that your going to be just food for bugs and thats it no glory after life no nothing forever thats the atheist belife that sounds so exciting for your guys afterlife.

As we get closer and closer to the Second Coming of Christ, there will be increasing and widespread doubt about whether Jesus even existed. People will also start wondering if God really exists and believers will leave the Christian faith (2 Thessalonians 2:1-4, 1 Timothy 4:1-2, and 2 Peter 2:1-3). Do you think we're already seeing these signs?